Leave or remove first addition hops during whirlpool

[Joeymacca]

Hi all,

I brewed a low IBU NEIPA today. The only hop addition during the boil was at 5 mins. It then called for a 15 minute whirlpool addition @ 170 degrees. There is no guidance on whether to remove the 5 min addition during cooling or leave it.

Questions: In recipes that call for the beer to be cooled slightly for a whirlpool addition, should you remove the previously added hops while the beer cools? Leave them in while the beer cools and during the whirlpool addition?

Thanks!

 

[Teufelhunde]

I'm 99% sure that all the recipe software calculates the IBU's (and recipes as written) are based on once the hops hit the wort, they stay there.

Lon

 

[Sammy86]

Hops shouldn't leave the boil kettle unless they are heading for the fermentor.

 

[GuldTuborg]

Can't say I've ever heard of removing hops from the kettle before adding more.

During dry hopping to prevent overextraction before another round? Sure. During the boil? Never.

 

[Joeymacca]

Yeah I’ve definitely never removed a hop addition during boil. In this case, boil is over and I’m cooling the beer to 170 degrees for a whirlpool addition. Sounds like from everyone’s replies that I should be leaving the first addition hops in the wort during cooling and during the whirlpool addition.

 

[SonomaBrewer]

I heard a few years ago that leaving early-boil hops in the kettle during a long whirlpool can extract "grassy" flavors from pellet hops. My LHBS still suggests pulling them out (assuming they were boiling in a hot spider or other removable vehicle).

Me personally -- I don't really subscribe to that idea. I do use a spider and remove them for clean lagers than showcase flaws (Helles, Pils). But for most ales I have been throwing pellets in the boil "commando" and have not noticed any downside.

 

[GuldTuborg]

Yeah I’ve definitely never removed a hop addition during boil. In this case, boil is over and I’m cooling the beer to 170 degrees for a whirlpool addition. Sounds like from everyone’s replies that I should be leaving the first addition hops in the wort during cooling and during the whirlpool addition.

Let me clarify then. Removing from the boil kettle at any point? Not saying you can't, but it'd be new to me.

 

[day_trippr]

fwiw, I leave everything in the kettle to the end.
I suspect it would be a challenge to Beersmith to set it up for "add then remove" hop functions...

Cheers!

 

[hotbeer]

Unless they specify, most recipes likely just assume you throw the hops in and they come out when ever they come out.

Whether you were able to leave them in the bottom of the boil kettle when you move the wort to the FV or that they become trub on the bottom of the FV might make some differences or it might not make much. If you want to keep them contained in a hop bag or something for easy removal that's all on you and your desires.

Why not try several batches doing them differently and find out which works for you?

 

[Joeymacca]

Thanks everyone for your replies. I have always left my hops in for the full amount of time that the recipe calls for. I was just wondering when there is a whirlpool addition if the hops that were put in during boil should be removed while the beer is cooling. For example if there is a 60 minute hop addition and it takes me 30 minutes to cool the wort down to 170° that 60 minute addition is getting an extra 30 minutes in the wort. Mind you, the wort isn’t boiling at that point but it’s definitely not cold so I assume it’ll continue to pull some bitterness while the wort cools. But sounds like the suggestion is to just leave all the hops in while the wort cools down to whirlpool temperature. For the record, this is what I have always done when there is a whirlpool addition. But during this brew day it just got me thinking if that’s the correct process. Thanks again everyone.

 

[mashpaddled]

I don't take them out but I know some people do. IMO it would make sense to take them out if you're putting so much hop matter into the wort that you can't get good distribution of the hops and risk poor extraction. That's probably not an issue with a single whirlpool addition but if you're doing two different whirlpool additions then I would consider pulling out at least some of the earlier additions.

 

[Teufelhunde]

Thanks everyone for your replies. I have always left my hops in for the full amount of time that the recipe calls for. I was just wondering when there is a whirlpool addition if the hops that were put in during boil should be removed while the beer is cooling. For example if there is a 60 minute hop addition and it takes me 30 minutes to cool the wort down to 170° that 60 minute addition is getting an extra 30 minutes in the wort. Mind you, the wort isn’t boiling at that point but it’s definitely not cold so I assume it’ll continue to pull some bitterness while the wort cools. But sounds like the suggestion is to just leave all the hops in while the wort cools down to whirlpool temperature. For the record, this is what I have always done when there is a whirlpool addition. But during this brew day it just got me thinking if that’s the correct process. Thanks again everyone.

I pretty much think that by the end of 60 minutes of boiling, those hops are totally spent and you aren't going to get anything else out of them.

YMMV

Lon

 

[CascadesBrewer]

For example if there is a 60 minute hop addition and it takes me 30 minutes to cool the wort down to 170° that 60 minute addition is getting an extra 30 minutes in the wort.

The difference from system to system as far as cooling is an area that probably does not get enough attention. Yes, if it took you 30 minutes to lower the temp, that will have a large impact. Also, most brewing software is very bad at predicting IBUs from boil additions for recipes that have a whirlpool (at least BeerSmith is pretty weak in this area).

I would say that if you are going to add a reduced temp whirlpool steep, you should have a mechanism to quickly drop the wort temp. 5 minutes if fine, but 30 minutes seems excessive. If that is the best you can do, then you should probably tailor your recipes around your process. The issue is not so much with the 60 minute addition (there is very little difference between 60 and 90 minutes) but more with your late boil additions (there is a big difference between 10 minutes and 40 minutes).

What I do: For my 2.5 gallon batches I chill down to whirlpool temp with a water bath. For my 5 gallon batches I use my old wort chiller.