lagerring vs. lager beer

[madtown]

newbie AG brewer here making my first post so sorry if this is stupid, and long. My understanding is these two concepts are totally different yet it seems as though people use these terms interchangeably which confuses me. Lager beer is a beer which uses lager yeast that prefer temps around 48-52 and produces a beer that is dry/crisp. Ales use yeast that prefer temps in the 60's-70's and produce a beer that is fuller and sweeter. Laggering (again i'm probably wrong) is a process (from germany) to naturally carbonate a beer since by law they cant artificially carbonate their beers. So instead of just adding 12 PSI of CO2 and forgetting it for 2-3 week they have to have a long secondary fermentation to naturally carbonate their beer. Ok, If this is the case, then what would i gain by "laggering" my already carbonated lager beer for 2-3 months? I mean i'm not trying to carbonate my beer, thats already been done. If its basically a secondary fermentation (to improve the flavors), why not just leave the beer in the primary for a month (doing both a primary and secondary) like i do with my ales then cold crashing it once the yeast have done their job? If having beer in my carbonating/storing/serving freezer (@38 degrees F) for several months is "laggering" then that means all of my beers (including ales) are being "laggered". Again, as i understand it, laggering is naturally adding CO2 to a beer. having it in the freezer for several months isn't adding CO2, maybe clarifying it a little but i'm still very confused on the concept and why in modern brewing you would want to do this?

 

[ISLAGI]

Lager is the beer. Lagering is the method of storing fermenting beer at low temps (32 - 40F) for extended periods to mellow flavors.

As for your definition, it sounds like you got kraeusening mixed into your definition. The Brew Wiki is a great way to check your terms. Also, John Palmer's How To Brew is a good resource to get started.

Enjoy!

 

[rocketman768]

Laggering (again i'm probably wrong) is a process (from germany) to naturally carbonate a beer since by law they cant artificially carbonate their beers.

Yep. You are wrong. To "lager" comes from the German word "to store." Lagering is a process whereby beer is stored at low temps (just above freezing usually) for an extended period of time. This is why a "marzen" (brewed in March obviously) is drunk at Oktoberfest 7 months later.

 

[Yooper]

Lager is the beer. Lagering is the method of storing fermenting beer at low temps (32 - 40F) for extended periods to mellow flavors.

As for your definition, it sounds like you got mixed up with kraeusening. The Brew Wiki is a great way to check your terms. Also, John Palmer's How To Brew is a good resource to get started.

As a rule, lagers are a more advanced brewing style because of the extra resources needed to maintain temp control. Most brewers start with ales, and work from there.

Enjoy!

Correct! Lager means "to store" in German. It means keeping the beer cold for a storing period.

Krausening is carbonating with gyle (fermenting beer wort).

 

[Yooper]

newbie AG brewer here making my first post so sorry if this is stupid, and long. My understanding is these two concepts are totally different yet it seems as though people use these terms interchangeably which confuses me. Lager beer is a beer which uses lager yeast that prefer temps around 48-52 and produces a beer that is dry/crisp. Ales use yeast that prefer temps in the 60's-70's and produce a beer that is fuller and sweeter. Laggering (again i'm probably wrong) is a process (from germany) to naturally carbonate a beer since by law they cant artificially carbonate their beers. So instead of just adding 12 PSI of CO2 and forgetting it for 2-3 week they have to have a long secondary fermentation to naturally carbonate their beer. Ok, If this is the case, then what would i gain by "laggering" my already carbonated lager beer for 2-3 months? I mean i'm not trying to carbonate my beer, thats already been done. If its basically a secondary fermentation (to improve the flavors), why not just leave the beer in the primary for a month (doing both a primary and secondary) like i do with my ales then cold crashing it once the yeast have done their job? If having beer in my carbonating/storing/serving freezer (@38 degrees F) for several months is "laggering" then that means all of my beers (including ales) are being "laggered". Again, as i understand it, laggering is naturally adding CO2 to a beer. having it in the freezer for several months isn't adding CO2, maybe clarifying it a little but i'm still very confused on the concept and why in modern brewing you would want to do this?

Also, ales aren't sweeter. They are fermented at warmer temperatures, yes, but are not sweeter than lagers.

Naturally adding co2 to a beer has nothing to do with lagering.

 

[madtown]

wow, thanks for the quick replies!! So i guess all of my ales are technically being lagered since i store them at 38 degrees. Is this a problem for ales? should i be storing them at my cellar temp (62 degrees F) until i want to drink them then cooling them?

 

[JonK331]

Nope it will not hurt your ales at all, most ales benefit from some lagering to help them clear and the bitterness mellow. Obviously some beers are better consumed more quickly though. For example, extended lagering of a hefeweizen would make it clear and not have the cloudy appearance which is expected from that type of beer. Beers that are supposed to have a lot of hop flavor also benefit from drinking fresh as the hop flavors will mellow over time. However, all beers will benefit from at least a week or two of "lagering."

 

[brewit2it]

As a little bit of a tangent, should a kolsch or lager be lagered flat or under CO2 or does it not matte?. I'm just getting into kegging and will be taking my Kolsch from the primary into the keg next weekend and want to store it for about 3 weeks in my Keezer before drinking, but just wondered if it mattered if I hooked it up to the CO2 or not during the lagering.

 

[JonK331]

I would hook up the CO2

 

[KevinM]

I'm a bit more confused now about lagers.
Doesn't part of lagering a beer to brew a lager have to do with the temperatures of the primary (and if there's a secondary) femermentation process?
As opposed to the completed beer being bottled/kegged and stored at a low temperature?

For the most part, do we (generic we, and mostly in the US since offhand I can't remember all the other usages in other posts) use the term lagering when referring to aging finished beers at all? Or do we just call it bottle conditioning, kegging, storing, refridgerating, aging, etc? (Of course if you speak German, then it'd could all be called lagern since it doesn't seem to have any temperature indications in the word, don't they lagern groceries, lagern nuclear waste)

 

[Yooper]

I'm a bit more confused now about lagers.
Doesn't part of lagering a beer to brew a lager have to do with the temperatures of the primary (and if there's a secondary) femermentation process?
As opposed to the completed beer being bottled/kegged and stored at a low temperature?

For the most part, do we (generic we, and mostly in the US since offhand I can't remember all the other usages in other posts) use the term lagering when referring to aging finished beers at all? Or do we just call it bottle conditioning, kegging, storing, refridgerating, aging, etc? (Of course if you speak German, then it'd could all be called lagern since it doesn't seem to have any temperature indications in the word, don't they lagern groceries, lagern nuclear waste)

Yes, a lager is brewed with lager yeast, at 48-55 degrees or so. That's what makes a lager, not storing it cold. You can put Genessee Cream Ale in your fridge, but that doesn't make it a lager.

Lager yeast is a different beast than ale yeast. Lager yeast is bottom fermenting yeast, saccharomyces pastorianus and ale yeast is a top fermenting yeast called Saccharomyces cerevisiae. Different characteristics. For example, lager yeast can ferment different dissaccharides than ale yeast.

You can cold condition an ale, even call it lagering if you want. It's not correct, but you can say it. That won't magically make it a lager. Using a lager yeast, fermenting at the correct temperature (generally 50 degrees), etc, make a beer a lager.

 

[Yooper]

wow, thanks for the quick replies!! So i guess all of my ales are technically being lagered since i store them at 38 degrees. Is this a problem for ales? should i be storing them at my cellar temp (62 degrees F) until i want to drink them then cooling them?

Your ales are being cold conditioned. Not lagered. Lagering is a specific term used for lagers that are being cold conditioned.

 

[KevinM]

Thanks Yooper, that's the explanation I was expecting.