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jammer66

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It drives me crazy to pay more for shipping then the grain. I started thinking what about Sam's club. If we could get them to sell base grains. we could order what we want online and pick it up at the nearest store. i think they charge 5 bucks to do that. It would be a win for everyone. They would get a bunch of new members, good profit margin and we would get $5.00 shipping
 
Why don't you just go to a local homebrew store?

I went on Google Maps and found two LHBS in your area:
- Niagra Traditions Homebrew Supply (Tonawanda, NY)
- Make Your Own (Lockport, NY)

There were also a couple places with names indicating they are wine making stores but they usually sell homebrew stuff, too.
 
jammer66 said:
I have and they want $58.00 for a sack of 2 row.

Well is it cheaper to do that? Shipping 50 pounds isn't going to be cheap anywhere
 
your missing the point. If you could get it at sams it would be alot cheaper, like $36.00 and no high shipping costs.
 
just my two here.....the last thing i want is big box cutting in on my homebrew store......they will somehow find grain in china:D
 
I just happily paid 60 buckaroos for 50 lbs of british pale ale malt (canadian). The camaraderie, feedback, tips, free beer, and everything else that is great about a local homebrew shop is worth paying a premium for. Sure, I could buy online and save a few bucks, but I know the guy, and while purchasing, I get to talk to other people about brewing. Support your Local Homebrew Store! You'll be thankful you did....
 
I dunno.. I have had terrible luck with LHBSs. I know it's the going trend to support them but here in Ontario, there are very few and the ones with enough supplies for all grain brewing tend to be.. well, *****es. They are few and far between enough that you tend to need things shipped anyway.

Prob a bit different down south. All Homebrew places here have enormous focus on wine and don't so much as carry bottling sugar let alone kegging supplies.

Though at least in Canada you can go straight to the maltster and grab a bag of 2-row for $16 ;)
 
i just happily paid 60 buckaroos for 50 lbs of british pale ale malt (canadian). The camaraderie, feedback, tips, free beer, and everything else that is great about a local homebrew shop is worth paying a premium for. Sure, i could buy online and save a few bucks, but i know the guy, and while purchasing, i get to talk to other people about brewing. Support your local homebrew store! You'll be thankful you did....

+1
 
I dunno.. I have had terrible luck with LHBSs. I know it's the going trend to support them but here in Ontario, there are very few and the ones with enough supplies for all grain brewing tend to be.. well, *****es. They are few and far between enough that you tend to need things shipped anyway.

Prob a bit different down south. All Homebrew places here have enormous focus on wine and don't so much as carry bottling sugar let alone kegging supplies.

Though at least in Canada you can go straight to the maltster and grab a bag of 2-row for $16 ;)

Where in Ontario can you do that?!? (the last part :) )
 
It drives me crazy to pay more for shipping then the grain. I started thinking what about Sam's club. If we could get them to sell base grains. we could order what we want online and pick it up at the nearest store. i think they charge 5 bucks to do that. It would be a win for everyone. They would get a bunch of new members, good profit margin and we would get $5.00 shipping

Jammer,
You should join in on the Syracuse group buys. There are usually folks from the buffalo area who participate and the last pick up was in the Rochester area. We just finished an order up so it will be a while, but the previous 5 group buys went fairly quickly. Here's the link https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f174/syracuse-ny-round-6-group-grain-buy-279676/, we are already up to 22 sacks. As an example, the estimated price for a 55# sack of 2 row is $35 w/shipping.
 
That's from Saskatoon, but you can get it for $45 in Peterborough from Great Canadian Malt. Call the day before and they'll have it ready for you to pick up. Last bag I got there was still warm from malting :)
 
Next time I'm at Sam's club I'll fill out the suggestion card for bringing in bulk grains. Who knows, if enough of us request it they may do it. However I doubt if they could do it for what I pay now. But if they can do it for <62¢ a lb I'm in.
 
iaefebs said:
Next time I'm at Sam's club I'll fill out the suggestion card for bringing in bulk grains. Who knows, if enough of us request it they may do it. However I doubt if they could do it for what I pay now. But if they can do it for <62¢ a lb I'm in.

Eff that. The last thing we need is to take the money out of our homebrew stores and sending it to some billionaire *****ebags. Is that really worth saving $.12 on a glass of beer to you?
 
It's disgusting to me to me that you'd want a mega store like Sam's Club to get involved in a process as intricate as home brewing.
What the F--- do they know about making Craft Beer?

So you can save a buck or two by sending it to China and then what??
Put your LHBS out of business?

Good luck getting an answer of info from someone who doesn't give a crap about you or the Beer you make!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

F the big guy that is reaching into your pocket and stealing our livelyhood!

Rant!

Bull
 
Eff that. The last thing we need is to take the money out of our homebrew stores and sending it to some billionaire *****ebags. Is that really worth saving $.12 on a glass of beer to you?
This

It's disgusting to me to me that you'd want a mega store like Sam's Club to get involved in a process as intricate as home brewing.
What the F--- do they know about making Craft Beer?

So you can save a buck or two by sending it to China and then what??
Put your LHBS out of business?

Good luck getting an answer of info from someone who doesn't give a crap about you or the Beer you make!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

F the big guy that is reaching into your pocket and stealing our livelyhood!

Rant!

Bull
Also, this.
 
You might want to encourage a deal between your local homebrew shop and a local brewpub/micro. The pubs/ micros get great pricing on the grain and super cheap shipping because of the quantity they buy and because it comes palletized via freight carriers.

I am just getting back into brewing after a 10 or so year hiatus, but back in the day I used to get Briess two row for about half of what the "going rate" was because of a deal like I described. I will sure my days of buying base malt for $16/bag!

Adam
 
davefleck said:
I doubt either sams or Costco would care to dedicate shelf space to a product that has such a low market draw.

This is probably correct. But I can't agree with those who don't want greater access to HB supplies.

Don't buy them there if you don't want to. My local LHBS kind if sucks, so the more competition the better.
 
This is probably correct. But I can't agree with those who don't want greater access to HB supplies.

Don't buy them there if you don't want to. My local LHBS kind if sucks, so the more competition the better.

+1. My LHBS is actually pretty good, and I try to give them plenty of business. They even occasionally do special offers on sacks of 2-row ($36 the last time), and I try to encourage them doing so by buying some even if I don't yet need it.

But I don't get the mind-set that thinks big is always bad, and the F the man thing. Even big-bad Wa*mart started as ONE store, and grew because they were more efficient and better run than the other stores they competed with. This was true even before they bought anything from China. I remember going to Colorado in the late 80's (before WalMart was on the east coast) and went to a store...when I cam back home I knew that Sears and JC Pennys and KMART and a bunch of other chains like Caldor and Montgomery Wards that no longer exist were in for a tough time against them). And like you said, if you don't like them, don't buy there. (I myself only go there once in a while as I can't stand the lines.)

As I mentioned to the OP, there is an ACTIVE group in the upper NY state area doing group buys, centered in Syracuse but with folks from the Buffalo area who participate every buy...so all the OP needs to do is get involved and get a bunch of different stuff (w/splits) at great prices.
 
Davefleck is right. Walmart lives and dies by volume. I'd rather not let the executives of Walmart decide what kind of brew kits,or anything else for that matter, to stock on the 2 sq ft of shelf space they would dedicate to homebrewers. Pay the extra amount to buy from the little guy.
 
copyright1997 said:
But I don't get the mind-set that thinks big is always bad, and the F the man thing. Even big-bad Wa*mart started as ONE store, and grew because they were more efficient and better run than the other stores they competed with. This was true even before they bought anything from China. I remember going to Colorado in the late 80's (before WalMart was on the east coast) and went to a store...when I cam back home I knew that Sears and JC Pennys and KMART and a bunch of other chains like Caldor and Montgomery Wards that no longer exist were in for a tough time against them). And like you said, if you don't like them, don't buy there. (I myself only go there once in a while as I can't stand the lines.)

Big is not always bad, but big also comes with unintended consequences.

We are here to craft beer, not to make cheap beer. If cheap is your goal, go buy BMC and save lots of time money and hassle. Handmade artisanal beer is an art and a science that emphasizes quality and creativity. Large chain retailers aren't there for quality, they are there to drive down prices and command market share. That sounds like the natural bedfellow of mass market beer to me, not obsessive zymergysts in their garages making beers half the world wouldn't drink because it's too dark or weird or not promoted by a pet wearing an aloha shirt and his bevy of large breasted, bikini-clad sudswhores.

Not everyone in this hobby is here to make masterpieces, but the vast majority of us are here because we see and taste a difference between cream of three crops and PBR.

If big box and mega retail start driving the profitability out of beer ingredients and thereby destroy LHBSs we nerds in sheds loose. Most home brew shops are started by people like you and me that love the hobby and want to share that love.

Wally world will not ever carry smoked malt or liquid yeast or have people on staff that know anything about what they sell who love what they do. But they could destroy the hard working enthusiasts' business if we allow them to dazzle us with the smoke and mirrors of low prices. It wouldn't take much to kill those LHBSs off.

So be as cavalier as you want about how your local sucks, but remember that you could be helping kill off MY awesome LHBS, and you are making sure that the terrific guy or gal that might want to start up a new store near you that will rock never gets that chance.
 
Big is not always bad, but big also comes with unintended consequences.

We are here to craft beer, not to make cheap beer. If cheap is your goal, go buy BMC and save lots of time money and hassle. Handmade artisanal beer is an art and a science that emphasizes quality and creativity. Large chain retailers aren't there for quality, they are there to drive down prices and command market share. That sounds like the natural bedfellow of mass market beer to me, not obsessive zymergysts in their garages making beers half the world wouldn't drink because it's too dark or weird or not promoted by a pet wearing an aloha shirt and his bevy of large breasted, bikini-clad sudswhores.

Not everyone in this hobby is here to make masterpieces, but the vast majority of us are here because we see and taste a difference between cream of three crops and PBR.

If big box and mega retail start driving the profitability out of beer ingredients and thereby destroy LHBSs we nerds in sheds loose. Most home brew shops are started by people like you and me that love the hobby and want to share that love.

Wally world will not ever carry smoked malt or liquid yeast or have people on staff that know anything about what they sell who love what they do. But they could destroy the hard working enthusiasts' business if we allow them to dazzle us with the smoke and mirrors of low prices. It wouldn't take much to kill those LHBSs off.

So be as cavalier as you want about how your local sucks, but remember that you could be helping kill off MY awesome LHBS, and you are making sure that the terrific guy or gal that might want to start up a new store near you that will rock never gets that chance.

HERE HERE!!!

Well said, my friend.
 
You could try checking around at local grocery stores. You'd be surprised at the variety of products that the distributors carry that the local stores don't purchase regularly. If you're a regular customer it's quite possible that management will be willing to order a bag in for you (assuming their distributor carries it). I'd recommend you go to a local store though, not a chain or even regional chain. I used to work at a grocery store and markup on special orders was around 10-15%. My friend manages a deli and their distributor carries 4 different brewing grains. He gets 50lb bags of 2-row for $23.
 
There are 2 brew stores near me, far from each other but I live in the middle (roughly). One sells 50# bags for $60 and the other sells the same exact 50# bags, same brand, same grains, for $35.

The difference? The one selling at $35 is also a brewery, Michigan Brewing Co. and the $60 bags come from a small shop that just sells supplies. Unfortunately for me (regarding prices) the advice, knowledge, jokes, etc are far better at the expensive shop that is actually almost twice the drive.
 
I don't know for yours, but at my brew store when he makes an order he give us a special if we order with him and take the stock in the next weeks. For him it is good for the space, for us it is good for the price.

20% discount. this month I will receive 1 50kg of two-rows ans one of Marry Otters
 
But I don't get the mind-set that thinks big is always bad, and the F the man thing. Even big-bad Wa*mart started as ONE store, and grew because they were more efficient and better run than the other stores they competed with. This was true even before they bought anything from China. I remember going to Colorado in the late 80's (before WalMart was on the east coast) and went to a store...when I cam back home I knew that Sears and JC Pennys and KMART and a bunch of other chains like Caldor and Montgomery Wards that no longer exist were in for a tough time against them). And like you said, if you don't like them, don't buy there. (I myself only go there once in a while as I can't stand the lines.)

I have to disagree with your Walmart assessment. Walmart got big because of the distribution chain they developed, not being better run or smarter. Now Walmart dictates to manufacturers, what they will make and when and how much they will pay for it. Walmart uses unfair labor practices and and unfair pricing practices in a total effort to stomp the local stores out of business. They buy on huge scale and ship where ever they want... they do not ever deal locally and that sucks. We need fewer Walmart's and more local stores. I never go to a Walmart just on the basis of the unfair way they treat employees.. this is the largest most profitable corporation on the planet and they don't offer fair wages or worthwhile benefits. They got big on the backs of the workers they exploit. Walmart needs to be boycotted!

Rant Over

EDIT: My LHBS is Great and the owner and employees are good people and are helpful.
 
your missing the point. If you could get it at sams it would be alot cheaper, like $36.00 and no high shipping costs.

Here's how to get 2-row for 50 cents a pound.

1) Join local homebrew club
2) Local homebrew club sets up a group buy deal with a local microbrewery.
3) The more grains that the local microbrewery buys, the cheaper their grain cost is from the distributor, so both the microbrewery and the homebrew club wins.
 
Big is not always bad, but big also comes with unintended consequences.

We are here to craft beer, not to make cheap beer. If cheap is your goal, go buy BMC and save lots of time money and hassle. Handmade artisanal beer is an art and a science that emphasizes quality and creativity. Large chain retailers aren't there for quality, they are there to drive down prices and command market share. That sounds like the natural bedfellow of mass market beer to me, not obsessive zymergysts in their garages making beers half the world wouldn't drink because it's too dark or weird or not promoted by a pet wearing an aloha shirt and his bevy of large breasted, bikini-clad sudswhores.

Not everyone in this hobby is here to make masterpieces, but the vast majority of us are here because we see and taste a difference between cream of three crops and PBR.

If big box and mega retail start driving the profitability out of beer ingredients and thereby destroy LHBSs we nerds in sheds loose. Most home brew shops are started by people like you and me that love the hobby and want to share that love.

Wally world will not ever carry smoked malt or liquid yeast or have people on staff that know anything about what they sell who love what they do. But they could destroy the hard working enthusiasts' business if we allow them to dazzle us with the smoke and mirrors of low prices. It wouldn't take much to kill those LHBSs off.

So be as cavalier as you want about how your local sucks, but remember that you could be helping kill off MY awesome LHBS, and you are making sure that the terrific guy or gal that might want to start up a new store near you that will rock never gets that chance.

I suggest you re-read what I posted and also to NOT assume my priorities and intensions. Nowhere did I say my LHBS sucked. In fact, I stated the opposite and also stated I try to give them business. Just doing a quick check of some of my credit card receipts showed that I've spent well over $500 there since July.

Also, there is nothing that says that good quality home brew cannot also be cost effective. (I used that phrase on purpose as "cheap" has quality perceptions.) By participating in group buys, leveraging deals on hops (both online and my lhbs), and re-using yeast for a couple of generations I have my average cost on a 5 gallon batch WELL south of $15. This is important to me not because I'm trying to brew cheaper than buying Bud, but rather because a) I can brew beer that tastes as good or better than what I can buy for $9/six pack and b) so I can brew MORE, improve my process, and give it to friends.

I'm not saying to buy big, and I do understand your point regarding the fact that if the result is "driving the profitability out of beer ingredients" for the LHBS that they will be hurt. But the reality is that the world has changed. Just look at the knowledge on this site...having this kind of resource would have been unimaginable 30 years ago. The result is that if the LHBS doesn't provide superior service they will eventually be doomed.

All of this discussion is pretty moot however, as I seriously doubt whether Sam's or Costco will start carrying 2ROW. (The part of the discussion that is relevant is on-line vs. local.)

Sorry for the long response...the economics major in me is coming out.
 
I have to disagree with your Walmart assessment. Walmart got big because of the distribution chain they developed, not being better run or smarter.... Walmart needs to be boycotted!

Distribution is part of being "better run". My first phrase is the more appropriate one, namely "more efficient". There is a reason that Walmart went from one store in 1950 to where they are today, and it isn't just because they exploited the little man. What happened to Caldors, Montgomery Wards, and hundreds of others.

You have every right to boycott WalMart or anyone else. The last I knew, no-one, including you, was being forced to go to WalMart with a gun to their head. Vote with your wallet, but remember I get to do my wallet vote with my money. (I happen to volunteer at and buy a lot of my food at my local member-owned food co-op.)

Signed,
A conservative organic food loving, back to basics but electronics loving libertarian.
 
I have to disagree with your Walmart assessment. Walmart got big because of the distribution chain they developed, not being better run or smarter. Now Walmart dictates to manufacturers, what they will make and when and how much they will pay for it. Walmart uses unfair labor practices and and unfair pricing practices in a total effort to stomp the local stores out of business. They buy on huge scale and ship where ever they want... they do not ever deal locally and that sucks. We need fewer Walmart's and more local stores. I never go to a Walmart just on the basis of the unfair way they treat employees.. this is the largest most profitable corporation on the planet and they don't offer fair wages or worthwhile benefits. They got big on the backs of the workers they exploit. Walmart needs to be boycotted!

Rant Over

EDIT: My LHBS is Great and the owner and employees are good people and are helpful.


Here here! :mug:

Without reiterating everything said here already, Walmart may have started from a single store but NOW they put their thumb on the scale. From the tax breaks forced on local municipalities to their drain on that community's infrastructure (roads, water, power), they take more than they give. It's also pretty easy (and underhanded) to advertise guaranteed price matching when you are also forcing manufacturers to make a unique product ID for Walmart distro only. They work on high volume and low margins...cheap prices are the outcome, quality is not. Seems to me like shopping at Walmart for ingedients is the antithesis of homebrewing and homebrewers.

OK, another rant on the pile here, but I for one, cringed a little thinking about a Wal-Mart branded sack of grain.
 

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