is brewing beer worth my time?

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bk0 said:
Unless you're doing some pretty sophisticated calculations involving equipment depreciation, that will only be a rough estimate.
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I'm not planning on selling any of my equipment (most old stuff gets donated to newer brewers), so I consider it a sunk cost.
 
Considering I got my 1650w fryer free from SWMBO's family and a propane burner from my family, I've spent practically nothing on heat sources. I paid for insulation on the fryer and I paid $50 for a backup propane tank.

$75 For heating (backup propane and insulation)
$100 for 3x 6 gal fermenters, $60 for 3x 5 gal secondaries.
Bottles were all free. Bench capper was $20 used.

So that is basically everything needed to get started.

Consumables:

$17 for 640 caps. Each batch is ~50 bottles = $1.32 to cap 5 gallons
I won't count corn sugar for priming since it's so cheap.
Star San is $8 -- I think that lasts 16 batches for me so I'll say $0.50 to sanitize.

Centennial Blonde all-grain is $22 per batch. Plus $1.82 in consumables. Guesstimate I burn 1/4 tank per batch so thats a generous $5 in propane.

So for under $30 you can get 50 bottles of nice blonde homebrew. Commercially that would be over $1 / bottle, even if BMC. So you save over $20 per batch vs commercial.

It cost $255 for basic gear (cheaper if you get used). Break even in ~12 batches if you save $20 per 5 gallons vs BMC commercial.

Now if you go on and drop $1k on equipment, yea -- it's gonna be longer to get a ROI. But if you keep it simple with a BIAB single-kettle setup and not get all fancy -- you can brew on the cheap. The problem is most people get into the hobby and start buying expensive equipment to go along with everything and costs start to skyrocket.
 
you can save money. especially if you live in Canada or some other country with ridiculous taxes.. im not trying to be cheap either.. i buy whatever i need to make the job easier. i've just recently acquired everything i need to allggrain. and my bank account says im saving money! so now i have lots of beer tons of toys and i'm saving money. so are my friends and family lol.. best hobby i ever started
 
G_Brew said:
I'm in Ontario Canada, our alcohol distribution is controlled and monopolized here... 28$ for a 24 is the lowest legal limit to sell... most discount brands are selling for 28-30 for 24 beers... coorse and budweiser are around 35-36$ for 24 beers... and craft beer is usually found between 40 and 50$ for a 24 IF YOU CAN FIND IT in the beer store (rarely) And if you have to buy craft beer at the liquor store it's 12-16$ for 6 pack (only size they come)... so UP TO 60$ for 24 craft beers.... i can make a batch of Edwort's Haus Pale for about 20$ if i drive to buy my ingredients and pay no shipping, that's 2 1/2 cases for 20$ compared to paying over 100$ for the same amount of equal quality product.... If you do the math, i'll drink 2-3 cases a month... saving maybe 80$ a month.. doesn't take long to recoop 1500$ 18-20 months?
Click to expand...

I'm in Manitoba so a 24 of domestic costs around 40$ I can make 5 gallons for much less than that and I've definitely noticed the savings on my bank account since I took a break from buying new gear
 
Do I save money by brewing beer? Yeah, but it's not a breathtaking savings. I found the whole -process- intriguing, and still do. And I end up with the beer I want, not that the brewmaster at XXX brewery wants.
 
It is all relative to each individual, and I can't stand when people make blanket statements like "homebreing is more expensive than buying commercial beer" because it just isn't true for everyone. If you constantly buy new equipment or don't buy anything in bulk, then maybe it cost more, but it's not a definite.

Just for grins here is my breakdown on equipment cost....

Starter equipment kit was $80, turkey fryer w/ 7 gallon pot was $50, new filled propane tank $45, DIY mash tun (I got my cooler for free from a coors light promotion, but lets say i payed $30 for it) $50... so $225 for my initial equipment. I fermented with the swamp cooler technique at first so no additional cost there.

I could of stopped there and made good beer, I did however eventually get a kegging setup 3 kegs plus lines and co2 tank that was about $280, plus two used deep freezers at a total cost of $200, 2 external thermostats 1 @ $45 and 1 @ $65, 2 additional PET carboys at $24 each, and additional accessories and chemicals at about $100.

So thats $963 so far spent, I buy hops in bulk and reuse yeast to save money, would save more if i bought grain in bulk, but then i would need a mill. A batch runs between $15 (4% American Blonde) to $28 (9% Imperial IPA), more if i need fresh yeast.
So if an average batch runs 21.50 X 24 Batches a year thats $516. I have been brewing for a year and a half roughly so thats 36 batches @ $774.

A tank of propane is $17 with 4 refills so far so an extra $68, water is almost nothing but lets say 50 cents a batch so another $18.

co2 at 5 refills at $12 each is another $60

963 + 774 + 68 + 18 + 60 = 1883 .... 1883 / 36 batches is $52.31 per batch or (52.31/8) $6.54 per six pack.

most beer I purchase in the store is $7.99-9.99 a six pack so I am doing pretty good.
 
Brewing's fun as heck, that's my excuse. I love the smell of the wort, especially after the hops are added. :) I love the whole process of brewing, it's just a good time to create my own beer.
 
If you are serious about the hobby, there are ways to cut costs and brew good beer cheaper than you can buy it. I can brew for cheaper than I can buy Busch. However, even if you get your costs down, a fancy system will likely take many years to break even on. After you figure out costs, then you have to decide how much time you want to invest. IMO, time is the greatest cost associated with brewing. For anyone that's in it for the long run, I recomend sizing your system so that you can comfortably satisfy your consumption rate while minimizing time invested. You'll spend a rediculous amount of time trying to keep a good pipeline going doing 5 gal batches. It takes me ~6 hours to do a 5 gal batch, I can crank out 30 gal in 12. That's some serious time savings.
 
I have not been brewing very long and have just converted to all grain. I brew on my gas stove inside, I converted a cooler I had laying around and it cost roughly $15 to do so, I picked up my brew kettle for $20, and paid about $16 for my Ale Pail with airlock, and use a swamp cooler to control my temps. Most beers cost me about $0.40/bottle for ingredients for 5%abv brews. So I am definitely saving money by brewing since my time isn't worth much and I would much rather spend my time brewing than other things. Sure a big rig would be nice to have, but I can make really good beer with what I have so I would rather take that money and spend on more ingredients.
 
my friends and coworkers find me edgy and creative for brewing my own beer
plus i've got a ton of different styles to suit whatever fancies me!
 
It has been said in here a number of times, but it's a hobby. It's not meant to save you money, only eat it up.

That being said, if you enjoy it and enjoy the end product, continue on, but drop the idea of trying to turn the home hobby into a cost effective way of living. It's going to take a long time to hit the BE point.

I'll be brewing for 10 years or so before I even imagine hitting the BE point. On the other hand, with all of the improvements I've made to my setup, each batch has gotten cheaper on a variable level through buying bulk grain as well as hops by the pound, and reusing yeast.

In the end, if your only factor for continuing on is an idea of saving a buck or two, you are doing it wrong.
 
Man I wonder where you guys get your grain because the most I have ever spent on a batch was 24 bucks including yeast. My least expensive was 9.73. Note I did not say cheapest because it is a great beer.

Do I save money on beer. Heck yes I do. My time is just that my time and if I choose to spend a half day brewing beer then it is a half day well spent if it is doing something I like.

Brewing beer for me is like baking. Right now I am making bread for beer and cigar night tonight. Could I buy a loaf of bread easier and simpler. Yes I could but then I would not get the handful of crystal 60 malt I threw in. Same with beer. I can buy beer but then I have to settle for what other people think I will like.

I bottled 6 gallons or 60 beers this morning. 14 bucks in money but 6 or more hours time. I say I made out like a bandit:D
 
Two words: Sunk cost

Don't try to cost-justify your equipment. Usually ends poorly. Statements such as "Save money by <insert hobby>!" are marketing statements and nothing else.

Think in terms of marginal cost. Then you at least have a chance at breaking even. And if you include opportunity costs of money you woulda spent on other hobbies, now you're getting somewhere.

And don't count your own time. If you include labor costs it's not a hobby, IMO.

Think in terms of utility and not cost. I get more "units of enjoyment" by brewing than the opportunity cost of the $ spent on brewing. Therefore I brew.
 
For me brewing beer is a relaxing experience. yes, once I have the equipment I can make beer for fairly cheap, but this is a hobby that I enjoy doing and enjoy putting money and more importantly my time into.
 
If I don't count the cost of my equipment, I think brewing my own beer actually does end up being cheaper than buying the sort of beer I like to drink.

I make 3 gallon batches, which works out to approximately 30 bottles' worth. The usual cost for this is approximately $25, as I recall. If the beer I like to drink costs $9 to $10 for 6 bottles, then 30 bottles' worth is $45 to $50, meaning a savings of ~$20.

That said, it doesn't include the cost of fuel for the range, or my time, so it probably ends up being a wash, but the important thing is that I end up with two months' worth of beer that I like better than store bought.
 
TyTanium said:
Two words: Sunk cost

Don't try to cost-justify your equipment. Usually ends poorly. Statements such as "Save money by <insert hobby>!" are marketing statements and nothing else.

Think in terms of marginal cost. Then you at least have a chance at breaking even. And if you include opportunity costs of money you woulda spent on other hobbies, now you're getting somewhere.

And don't count your own time. If you include labor costs it's not a hobby, IMO.

Think in terms of utility and not cost. I get more "units of enjoyment" by brewing than the opportunity cost of the $ spent on brewing. Therefore I brew.
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This^^
I was thinking opportunity costs, margin and utility the whole thread. It really is more complicated than just dollars and cents.
 
beergolf said:
I don't even think about the cost. I just enjoy brewing beer. I like to cook and brewing is just an extension of that. I like formulating recipes and tweaking them to get beer that I like to drink. There is something very satisfying about drinking a brew that you made from a recipe that you made up.

I brew a lot of Belgians so I guess that if I figured it out I am probably saving money, since they are usually pretty expensive to but, but either way I don't really care about that.

Brew for fun and satisfaction.
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Cheers to brewing for fun! Its a hobby and the simple fact that I get some return on investment is a huge win. All that camping/hiking/skiing gear doesn't save me any money or get me more beer!
 
I'm a n00b to this, but I told SWMBO that homebrewing is going to be the cheapest hobby I'll take on. Otherwise I'd be looking at Corvettes, Motorcycles, Airplanes, or Boats.

I made sure to make the point that starting homebrewing didn't rule out those hobbies. :D
 
ktm250 said:
This^^
I was thinking opportunity costs, margin and utility the whole thread. It really is more complicated than just dollars and cents.
Click to expand...

I had a similar conversation with my brother-in-law about "the cost of my time". We were actually talking about me finishing my basement, but the concept still applies. His argument was that I had to factor in X dollars an hour that I spent working on the basement. I agree there is an "economic" value to my time, but that doesn't always translate to a dollar value. I saved a ton of money by doing the work myself and argued that nobody was going to give me money for an activity (unless I took on a second job) that I did instead of finishing my basement. Sure, there is opportunity cost of not doing something else like sitting on my butt or playing golf... but that missed opportunity would not translate into more money in my wallet. I don't agree with saying "you have to figure in the cost of your time" into the dollars and cents calculation of the cost of home brewing unless you are going to spend those 5 hours doing an activity that actually pays you money. If you take off 5 hours of work (hourly employee) to brew beer... then you should factor it in. My guess is that most of us would spend those 5 hours doing something else besides working extra hours in our hourly jobs.
 
I re-started brewing about 3 years ago, and have kept meticulous records of costs of everything I have bought. The only things I do not have in my cost roll-up is my own time and electricity.

I do partial mash (so don't have an all-grain set-up). I do partial boil, so I don't buy propane. I do have a turkey burner and an extra large pot, I have included them in my costs even though I have never used them.

I buy grain, hops and extract in bulk, and re-use yeast. I probably have enough ingredients to do about 20 more brews with little extra to buy.

Over the past 3 years I have produced somewhere between 4,000 and 5,000 bottles (I don't have my records on this computer), and the average cost of a 12 ozs beer (including everything I have spent to date) works out at $0.50. My average abv (again, being anal and keeping records) is about 6.5%. I have Barleywines, Lambics, Flanders, Belgians, Stouts, Porters, and several English and American Pale Ales right at hand, and I would happily stand any of them against major Commercial craft examples.

I find it fun and cost effective ....... Now if I should factor in my time, all those records go out the window.
 
I, much like many others, enjoy making the beer. I remember when I brewed my first batch. I gave some to a bunch of friends and family just to see their faces when I told them I made it. It is a thrill for me to brew it, bottle it, then when you finally get to taste it.... I get excited.

Is it cheaper? Probably not but possibly. Is it easier? Definitely not. It is more exciting? For me most definitely.

I know I dragged this out, but it is just my opinion. It also gives you some insight as to why I brew (and many other people).
 
Like others have mentioned, I brew because I enjoy it. I'm still at the beer kit stage, but it's a blast. I can say it was saving me lots of money, that is untill I just bought my keg setup and I guess its a slippery slop from here.

That and no one complains when I tell them I need some beer consumed to free up bottles for the next batch! :mug:
 
For me it is worth it. I don't care if brewing is more or less expensive than buying beer at the store, I enjoy my time when bottling and brewing. Its relaxing and I get beer from the process. I also change my own oil, garden, and bbq because I enjoy it not to save money.
 
This is by far the cheapest hobby I have, I get to use my machine tools to make new toys for brewing and i get to taste some of the best brews I have ever had (couple of the worst too).:tank:
 
"is brewing beer worth my time?"

Well that's a silly question. How can any of us put a value on your time and a value on how much you'll enjoy brewing & drinking beer?

Hell, some people drink solely to get drunk, and for those people, what's your answer to them if they ask if it's worth buying Sierra Nevada instead of 1.75L bottles of cheap vodka? Value is subjective.

As for me, I toss the money aspect of it out the door entirely. I do well enough in the financial side of my life to be able to afford all the craft beer I want. I'm also a very busy guy -- I work hard at the office and harder at home with 2 (soon to be 3) little rugrats running around. So my time is probably more valuable to me than the money...

...yet I still brew. Because I love brewing beer. For me, the time is not "wasted" brewing beer of similar quality to what I can buy in a store. Brewing is for me a release. It's a way to let go of work and kids for a while and do something I enjoy. And it's incredibly satisfying to brew unique and excellent beer for my own consumption, as well as to see other people drink it and incredulously ask "You brewed this? REALLY?!" So to me, it's very much "worth it". But it may or may not be for you.
 
Like any other hobby, it's something you do because you are passionate about it, love doing it. Period.
 
I know as a homebrewer I will always be in the red. Homebrewing is a hobby. And like gardening, knitting, and woodworking it is a hobby that produces an economic offset. It is not a 100% offset, but definitely over 50%. Once you factor in equipment and materials you will be hard pressed to find a hobby that yields a 100% offset. It is fair to assume that you will be drinking beer anyway. And it is fair to assume that the leisure time you spend brewing would be otherwise spent doing something else leisurely. Homebrewing rewards your leisure time with a product that you would probably buy anyway. Competition and economy of scale dictate that professional brewers, farmers, clothing manufacturers, and furniture makers will usually be able to make their products at a cheaper per unit cost that you can reasonably do at home.

I like big beers (RIS, IIPA, and strong Belgians). Considering my craft brew target samples go for $8 -15 a bottle I think I get a pretty good ROI. But it is also an excuse to be outside listening to music, playing with fire and drinking lots of beer. I get to geek out with science and I haven't run out of beer at the end of the night in years.
 
If I needed to figure "per unit costs" I wouldn't be a homebrewer, but an industrial engineer. Yeah, it's probably beer I would drink even if I didn't homebrew, but the intangible involvement that exists with any pastime (aka "hobby") does it for me....or I wouldn't be doing it, trust me.
 
Crunching the numbers KEEPS me homebrewing. Because I sure as heck wouldn't want to do this for a living. $/hr is pretty terrible...
 

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