Invert Sugar or Lyle's Golden Syrup

[Pappers_]

I'm making an English strong bitter and in researching these have found that many use invert sugar or Lyle's Golden Syrup (a UK product). I *think* the rational is that they tend to mash their beers pretty high to increase the impression of maltiness and the sugar helps dry out the beer and increase its drinkability.

In any case, I've found some youtube videos about making an invert sugar syrup but thought I would ask here if anyone makes their own invert sugar syrup, has experience with it, or thoughts about why the English include it in their recipes. I'm brewing this Saturday afternoon, for what its worth.

Here's the recipe I'm using:

10 gallons (serving half in a pin cask for a party, half for me in a keg or bottles)
OG 1.055
Bitterness 41 IBU
Color 10 SRM
Mash Temp 158F

Fermentables
14 lbs Maris Otter (Muntons)
2 lbs Kiln Amber Malt
1 lb Caramel 60L
1 lb Caramel 20 L
1 lb Dememera Sugar
1 lb Invert Sugar Syrup (syrup made with 1 lb of sugar)

Hops
2 oz Challenger (7%) @ 60 min
1 oz EKG (5%) @ 20 min
1 oz Challenger @15 min
1 oz EKG @ 10 min
1 oz Challenger @ 5 min

Irish Moss
Omega British Ale VIII


Ferment at 65F for 2 weeks, cold crash for a week (add finings if necessary), carb/condition in cask for two weeks, cold crash in cask for one week before tapping.

 

[kevin58]

Yes as a matter of fact I just made myself a list of to-do's for my brew day tomorrow and one of them is "make invert sugar".

I suggest throwing out any recipe that says to use regular sugar. Look for "sugar in the raw" that you can pick up at the grocery store along with the type of citric acid that can be found in the canning and preserves section of the store. Your recipe doesn't state what type of invert you are making... #1, #2, #3 or #4? #1 is very light in color and #4 is very, very dark.

Here is a link with useful information on how long to cook to make each version and what the SRM should be for each. I usually make Invert #3 and it takes almost two hours.

http://www.unholymess.com/blog/beer-brewing-info/making-brewers-invert

To learn more about the history of invert and how it was used originally in the 1800's check out Ron Pattinson's blog: http://barclayperkins.blogspot.com/

 

[rhys333]

Yes as a matter of fact I just made myself a list of to-do's for my brew day tomorrow and one of them is "make invert sugar".

I suggest throwing out any recipe that says to use regular sugar. Look for "sugar in the raw" that you can pick up at the grocery store along with the type of citric acid that can be found in the canning and preserves section of the store. Your recipe doesn't state what type of invert you are making... #1, #2, #3 or #4? #1 is very light in color and #4 is very, very dark.

Here is a link with useful information on how long to cook to make each version and what the SRM should be for each. I usually make Invert #3 and it takes almost two hours.

http://www.unholymess.com/blog/beer-brewing-info/making-brewers-invert

To learn more about the history of invert and how it was used originally in the 1800's check out Ron Pattinson's blog: http://barclayperkins.blogspot.com/

I recently made some #2 sugar using Sugar in the Raw and it added some really nice flavors to my beer. One thing I noticed though: my beers usually drop crystal clear after a week or so chilling, but the one with homemade invert stays cloudy. Have you experienced this?

 

[Pappers_]

Yes as a matter of fact I just made myself a list of to-do's for my brew day tomorrow and one of them is "make invert sugar".

I suggest throwing out any recipe that says to use regular sugar. Look for "sugar in the raw" that you can pick up at the grocery store along with the type of citric acid that can be found in the canning and preserves section of the store. Your recipe doesn't state what type of invert you are making... #1, #2, #3 or #4? #1 is very light in color and #4 is very, very dark.

Here is a link with useful information on how long to cook to make each version and what the SRM should be for each. I usually make Invert #3 and it takes almost two hours.

http://www.unholymess.com/blog/beer-brewing-info/making-brewers-invert

To learn more about the history of invert and how it was used originally in the 1800's check out Ron Pattinson's blog: http://barclayperkins.blogspot.com/

Thanks for the link, very helpful. Since thie invert sugar is a substitute for the English product Lyle's Golden Syrup, I inagine I'm aiming for a light version. Does that make sense?

 

[Pappers_]

I recently made some #2 sugar using Sugar in the Raw and it added some really nice flavors to my beer. One thing I noticed though: my beers usually drop crystal clear after a week or so chilling, but the one with homemade invert stays cloudy. Have you experienced this?

That is worrisome.

 

[Derp]

I make my own invert and haven't noticed any additional cloudiness. I usually fine with gelatin, so maybe that makes up for it.

I need to make another batch of invert. I'm going to try the oven method this time. Should be less hassle than the stove-top method.

This thread may be of interest:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/made-simple-invert-sugars-jeff-alworths-method.628857/

 

[kevin58]

I recently made some #2 sugar using Sugar in the Raw and it added some really nice flavors to my beer. One thing I noticed though: my beers usually drop crystal clear after a week or so chilling, but the one with homemade invert stays cloudy. Have you experienced this?

No I haven't. However I normally use them in Strong Ales, Old Ales or Barleywines that I let age for many months at a time before serving so anything causing cloudiness must have dropped out by then.

 

[rhys333]

I make my own invert and haven't noticed any additional cloudiness. I usually fine with gelatin, so maybe that makes up for it.

I need to make another batch of invert. I'm going to try the oven method this time. Should be less hassle than the stove-top method.

This thread may be of interest:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/made-simple-invert-sugars-jeff-alworths-method.628857/

That's my beer in the picture. The cloudy one with invert. [emoji3]

EDIT: I guess the picture thumbnail only shows on the mobile app.

 

[rhys333]

That is worrisome.

It finally cleared up today. Probably 4 weeks in the keg. Usually they're clear within 7 days.

 

[cyberbackpacker]

Just as an FYI I have brewed many beers with homemade invert and never have had clarity issues.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Since thie invert sugar is a substitute for the English product Lyle's Golden Syrup, I inagine I'm aiming for a light version. Does that make sense?

This is completely back to front. Commercial brewers would (almost?) never use golden syrup. Golden syrup is used by some British homebrewers as a widely-available hack to replicate any of the various brewing sugars available to commercial brewers, typically invert #2.

Historically there were times when invert sugar was cheaper than using malt, but it became part of the taste profile, certainly in northern England and Scotland. Also if you're brewing primarily for cask, then you need a yeast that drops well, which tends to be associated with lower attenuation, so a bit of sugar helps balance out the lower attenuation from the yeast. US brewers generally seem to think that British beers are sweeter than they actually are, and tend to go overboard on the crystal and other speciality grains.