In Line GFCI vs Panel GFCI

[Armando Soto]

I am sorry if this was answered before but I couldn't find it, I know that there is a lot of discussion regarding if a GFCI is needed or not, to me it is but the question is :
Instead of installing a GFCI circuit breaker in the house panel can I just use one of this in line GFCI (like this one 240 Volt AC 30 Amp Inline Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter)
Please note that the main difference is that I can't use this in line from my house inlet to my control panel as it is 4 wires (L1, L2, N, G) (all inline GFCI are 3 wires)
So what this means is that I can only use this between the control panel and the heating element, meaning that only the heating element and the water inside the kettle will be GFCI protected. This makes sense to me but I could be wrong. I cannot see any scenarios where the control panel or the pump will get contact with water in order to need GFCI protection. They are above the ground.
By doing this I can use my brewing system in any 240 inlet without having to add circuit breakers for each (planning to install one for outdoors and use the electric dryer inlet for indoors.
Thanks in advance for your comments

 

[doug293cz]

Bad idea. You want your system protected before the control panel. It's not about the control panel getting wet, but rather you standing in spilled water/wort, and having an electrical fault anywhere in the system. GFCI's protect people, not equipment.

You can make your own 4 wire GFCI protected extension cord by using a spa panel.

Brew on

 

[rsquared]

For the spa panel idea, see this thread. I built one of them earlier this year for roughly the same price as your inline GFCI.

 

[sibelman]

What about adapting the panel to be 3 wire itself? Would that be a serious electrical safety no-no?

 

[doug293cz]

What about adapting the panel to be 3 wire itself? Would that be a serious electrical safety no-no?

You can build a 240V only panel that does not require a neutral line, but then you can't run any 120V load (e.g. pumps) from the panel. You also have to use contactors with 240V coils, and 240V indicator lamps.

Brew on

 

[sibelman]

Got it, Doug, thanks.

fwiw, I control my pump manually. PID controls heat (30A SSR w/in - line GFCI). 120V pump and PID are GFCI protected. I now understand why more fully panels benefit from 4-wire connections.

What remains unknown to me is the relationship between neutral and ground in my 1987 Oregon house.

 

[Armando Soto]

Bad idea. You want your system protected before the control panel. It's not about the control panel getting wet, but rather you standing in spilled water/wort, and having an electrical fault anywhere in the system. GFCI's protect people, not equipment.

You can make your own 4 wire GFCI protected extension cord by using a spa panel.

Brew on

Thank so much for the feedback , looks like this is exactly what I need to do.

 

[Armando Soto]

For the spa panel idea, see this thread. I built one of them earlier this year for roughly the same price as your inline GFCI.

Thanks for the info. I just have a question, do you have the exact model of the spa panel? I just cant find the same one, when I google it I only get metal options and I really like the fact that this is plastic..

 

[rsquared]

Mine was inspired by that, but not an exact copy... And I ended up with metal.

 

[Bobby_M]

Thanks for the info. I just have a question, do you have the exact model of the spa panel? I just cant find the same one, when I google it I only get metal options and I really like the fact that this is plastic..

All options that I have ever seen are metal boxes. The Midwest brand is popular, Found at Home Depot.

 

[Bobby_M]

What about adapting the panel to be 3 wire itself? Would that be a serious electrical safety no-no?

Mostly practical if you are at the planning stages of building your own panel. As Doug said, the contactor coil has to be 240v which is no big deal. The other thing is that if you want pump control you need a 230v unit. That is also not a problem as all major pump companies sell one. The topsflo TD5 will take any voltage.

 

[MikeCo]

If you are still considering it and only planning for two, installing GFCI breakers in the house panel is not that difficult. The cost for two might not be any more than a spa panel.

 

[matt_m]

My personal preference is a GFCI in the panel for the simple fact that you can't get lazy and not use it. Seconded by the fact that there's no protection from say someone grabbing the input side of that GFCI with wet hands to unplug it. A compromise that at least solves the first is using a different plug/socket on your panel and the outlet of the GFCI than the wall/GFCI inlet.

If you have a common panel type the GFCI breakers aren't terribly expensive, especially if its a line where the big box stores carry a matching spa panel. I pulled out the old stove breaker (we installed gas) installed the GFCI out of a matching spa panel, and fed a small sub panel that feeds everything brewing ("bar/kitchenette" for when we someday sell) related.

 

[Bobby_M]

I assumed there must have been a concrete reason for avoiding the panel. Maybe a rental. Maybe moving soon. I agree that if its just fear of touching it, I would suggest at least price shopping.