I think I bottled too early

[photocurio]

I made a batch of ale. The starting specific gravity was 44. Today I bottled it. The gravity at bottling was 14.

Did I screw up? Will my beer explode? This was a dark ale with half a pound of crystal malt (which I understand has some non-fermentable sugar) so that may increase terminal gravity. But still I'm thinking I should have waited.

The beer had been in primary fermentation for two days. Then I racked it into a carboy, where it say for 9 days before bottling.

 

[aslander]

Primary for 3 weeks. Why the rush? Yeast starters, 3 week primary, and temp control and you will never have to worry about this problem. 2 days is way too short before tranferring

 

[brewbama]

If fermentation stopped as determined by successive hydrometer readings you're OK. 2 days in primary is really short.

If it did not finish... well, what's done is done. In that case I recommend putting the bottles in a container of some sort as insurance. Maybe a cooler or two, or a bathtub covered with a tarp or something. You might be just fine but if it does blow you'll want to contain it.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[masskrug]

I usually bottle at 20. I always get stuck at 20, even after 3 weeks. No explosions to date. You should be fine.

But yeah, why are you moving out a primary after only 2 days? Keep it in there 3 weeks, skip secondary.

 

[photocurio]

Thanks, guys.
I will change my fermentation schedule.

And I've ordered a wine thief, so I can more easily take hydrometer readings.

 

[photocurio]

Just to follow up: my beer came out very nicely. I put the bottles in my closet to finish, where the temperature is steady. And after 4 weeks they were very nice, and not over carbonated either. And no explosions. I guess this just demonstrates how forgiving beer can be. Or maybe how lucky I am.

Now I am giving my beer more time in primary fermentation. I give it two weeks before I sample. But I have also come up with a better method for sampling my beer and checking specific gravity. Now I won't have to guess if fermentation has finished.

 

[smizak]

But I have also come up with a better method for sampling my beer and checking specific gravity. Now I won't have to guess if fermentation has finished.

It's very easy.

Dramatically slowed airlock activity √
Yeast flocculating and beer clearing √
Identical hydrometer reading 2 days apart √

Bottle.

Don't listen to the 3 week primary nonsense. There's no reason for an arbitrary primary length.

 

[WileECoyote]

It's very easy.

Dramatically slowed airlock activity √
Yeast flocculating and beer clearing √
Identical hydrometer reading 2 days apart √

Bottle.

Don't listen to the 3 week primary nonsense. There's no reason for an arbitrary primary length.

The extra time on the yeast will actually help finish/condition your beer quicker than if you pull it off as soon as it reaches FG.

So yes there is a good reason for setting a arbitrary length of time on your beers.

I also believe it shouldn't be a standard 3 weeks in primary for every beer, the amount of time in primary depends on many factors, the recipe, amount of yeast pitched, fermentation temp, and on.

I like to let my beers tell me when to transfer out of primary, I generally wait 14 days then take a reading, then I taste it, depending on how it taste I will ether transfer it or leave it for another week.

All that being said, the standard 2 to 3 weeks in primary before even checking FG works great for a beginning brewer.

Also secondary'ing is a tool in making beer, and the standard don't secondary your beer, just gets me, there are lots of great reasons to use a secondary fermenter, like bulk aging/conditioning for starters, although I don't think its necessary for most beginner recipes or most recipes ether.

I hope this helps info you photocurio

Cheers

 

[smizak]

The extra time on the yeast will actually help finish/condition your beer quicker than if you pull it off as soon as it reaches FG.

If it's flocculating(see post) it's done. The yeast aren't doing anything. I've bottled lagers after 9 days.

 

[fearwig]

Don't rack your beer off yeast, especially after two days.

To know if your beer will explode, you'll have to open one now and then to see how carbonation is progressing. If you get a gusher, pasteurize the lot of them and count your blessings that you have overcarbed beer, not exploding beer.

 

[fearwig]

Don't listen to the 3 week primary nonsense. There's no reason for an arbitrary primary length.

There is, but only for people who refuse to use a hydrometer (read: every person who has ever posted one of these threads, because man there are like three or four a week). And obviously even then the hydrometer is a preferable solution.

 

[WileECoyote]

I usually bottle at 20. I always get stuck at 20, even after 3 weeks. No explosions to date. You should be fine.

But yeah, why are you moving out a primary after only 2 days? Keep it in there 3 weeks, skip secondary.

What are your recipes?, fermentation temps?, yeast?, amounts of yeast?

How many brews have you had stick at 20?

Im more than willing to try and help, and I know theres lots of others here that would help you figure out what is going on with your beers.

Cheers

 

[WileECoyote]

If it's flocculating(see post) it's done. The yeast aren't doing anything. I've bottled lagers after 9 days.

So you don't believe that yeast clean up after there selfs ?

Cheers

 

[photocurio]

The reason I was not taking specific gravity readings was that it was such a pain to take samples.

This is my improved method, that makes it easy:
I have an 'Auto Siphon' racking tube.

I found that if I remove the inner racking cane, I can insert just the outer cylinder into my beer, and it will scoop up a perfect size beer sample, with only a little dripping. It works much better than the glass wine thief I bought. Its quick and easy to sterilize. I can sample from the plastic bucket of course, but I can also fit the tube into the carboy to get a sample from secondary.

p.s. I'm not really modifying the Auto Siphon. I simply re-assemble the thing for racking the beer.

 

[fearwig]

That's not a bad idea, that's the only part of my autosiphon that hasn't fallen to pieces.

Ease of sampling is another reason to steer beginners away from carboys, though. You have to sample to know it's done. I am thinking of having "BCKT" inked on one hand, "4EVA" on the other.

 

[smizak]

So you don't believe that yeast clean up after there selfs ?

Cheers

I do, but on a much shorter time scale than a lot of beginning homebrewers are led to believe. Ask a pro brewer how long their beer sits in the primary fermentation vessel.

 

[crazyirishman34]

So you don't believe that yeast clean up after there selfs ?

Cheers

After the yeast has flocked it really isn't doing anything. Most commercial breweries are on a 7 day cycle for ales. So leaving your beer in the FV for 3 weeks is really not doing anything for you.

 

[crazyirishman34]

The reason I was not taking specific gravity readings was that it was such a pain to take samples.

This is my improved method, that makes it easy:
I have an 'Auto Siphon' racking tube.

I found that if I remove the inner racking cane, I can insert just the outer cylinder into my beer, and it will scoop up a perfect size beer sample, with only a little dripping. It works much better than the glass wine thief I bought. Its quick and easy to sterilize. I can sample from the plastic bucket of course, but I can also fit the tube into the carboy to get a sample from secondary.

p.s. I'm not really modifying the Auto Siphon. I simply re-assemble the thing for racking the beer.

You could buy one of these also. If you sanitize the thief and hydrometer you can just return the sample to the beer.

http://www.midwestsupplies.com/fermtech-wine-thief.html

 

[WileECoyote]

I do, but on a much shorter time scale than a lot of beginning homebrewers are led to believe. Ask a pro brewer how long their beer sits in the primary fermentation vessel.

After the yeast has flocked it really isn't doing anything. Most commercial breweries are on a 7 day cycle for ales. So leaving your beer in the FV for 3 weeks is really not doing anything for you.

Ok guys, these are NOT pro brewers we are answering, so stating what pro brewers are doing is really irrelevant, pro brewers are doing things a lot differently than what beginner brewers are doing.

From personal experience I tried a experiment on a 2 different recipes several times each, I split the batch and racked one as soon as FG was reached, let the other sit on the yeast for 3 weeks, and the one that sits on the yeast longer is always much better tasting quicker total time wise from brew date to drinking.

My conclusion is yeast help finish/condition a beer if allowed to.

Cheers

 

[crazyirishman34]

Ok guys, these are NOT pro brewers we are answering, so stating what pro brewers are doing is really irrelevant, pro brewers are doing things a lot differently than what beginner brewers are doing.

From personal experience I tried a experiment on a 2 different recipes several times each, I split the batch and racked one as soon as FG was reached, let the other sit on the yeast for 3 weeks, and the one that sits on the yeast longer is always much better tasting quicker total time wise from brew date to drinking.

My conclusion is yeast help finish/condition a beer if allowed to.

Cheers

Yes speaking as a pro-brewer and a home-brewer there are differences at scale. But there is no reason to let your beer site on the yeast for an extended time. If you pitch enough yeast and add enough O2 to the wort. Then keep a reasonable measure of temp control you can have a beer go from grain to glass in 5 to 7 days.

Most of the things that pro-brewers do to any beginner brewer can do also. There is no voodoo involved. The one thing that pro-brewers can get away with is fermenting warmer because we normally ferment under pressure that makes the yeast ferment cleaner at a given temp.

Once the yeast flocks out of the beer it has very little contact with the beer. Most likely what is really happening is that the off flavors are out gassing or dropping out of the beer if you age it for a long time. If you avoid producing those off flavors you don't need to age them out of the beer.

 

[smizak]

If you avoid producing those off flavors you don't need to age them out of the beer.

That needs to be repeated a lot more around this forum.

 

[photocurio]

Yes speaking as a pro-brewer and a home-brewer there are differences at scale. But there is no reason to let your beer site on the yeast for an extended time. If you pitch enough yeast and add enough O2 to the wort. Then keep a reasonable measure of temp control you can have a beer go from grain to glass in 5 to 7 days.

So, oxidizing the wort before pitching can speed up fermentation, with no undesirable effects? I've had trouble with oxidized-tasting beer, and have been skipping this step.

One reason that I like to rack the beer into secondary (in a carboy) is that there is less headspace, and (I presume) less chance of oxidation. I'm just not sure what the optimum time to rack is.

As for temperature, I've been working under the assumption that a slow, cool fermentation makes the cleanest beer. I've been putting my beer in a corner of the house that is far from heat sources and windows. The temperature stays around 65, and I wrap a cozy around the carboy.

 

[smizak]

So, oxidizing the wort before pitching can speed up fermentation, with no undesirable effects? I've had trouble with oxidized-tasting beer, and have been skipping this step.

One reason that I like to rack the beer into secondary (in a carboy) is that there is less headspace, and (I presume) less chance of oxidation. I'm just not sure what the optimum time to rack is.

As for temperature, I've been working under the assumption that a slow, cool fermentation makes the cleanest beer. I've been putting my beer in a corner of the house that is far from heat sources and windows. The temperature stays around 65, and I wrap a cozy around the carboy.

Yeast need oxygen to reproduce and they use it all up way before your beer is done fermenting. You get a faster ferment because the yeast cell count is higher after the reproduction phase.

Your beer, assuming no leaks in the fermenter, should be under almost pure CO2 after fermentation. Oxygen will be long driven off/consumed. Racking to secondary is a far greater oxidation risk.

 

[WileECoyote]

Yes speaking as a pro-brewer and a home-brewer there are differences at scale. But there is no reason to let your beer site on the yeast for an extended time. If you pitch enough yeast and add enough O2 to the wort. Then keep a reasonable measure of temp control you can have a beer go from grain to glass in 5 to 7 days.

Most of the things that pro-brewers do to any beginner brewer can do also. There is no voodoo involved. The one thing that pro-brewers can get away with is fermenting warmer because we normally ferment under pressure that makes the yeast ferment cleaner at a given temp.

Once the yeast flocks out of the beer it has very little contact with the beer. Most likely what is really happening is that the off flavors are out gassing or dropping out of the beer if you age it for a long time. If you avoid producing those off flavors you don't need to age them out of the beer.

I wish we lived closer to each other, Id love to sample one of your 5 to 7 day old beers.

Im calling BS on the 5 to 7 days from grain to glass, yes I can do that too, but good or great beer in 5 to 7 days Im calling BS on that.

I love when people make general statements like that, leading beginner brewers to think any and all beers can be produced in 5 to 7 days and be good, Id love to see you do that with a oak aged imperial stout.

Oh and I am temp controlling, and I also never said it was voodoo.

If these new brewers don't even understand the brewing process, how do you expect them to do what a pro brewer is doing?

Cheers

 

[crazyirishman34]

So, oxidizing the wort before pitching can speed up fermentation, with no undesirable effects? I've had trouble with oxidized-tasting beer, and have been skipping this step.

One reason that I like to rack the beer into secondary (in a carboy) is that there is less headspace, and (I presume) less chance of oxidation. I'm just not sure what the optimum time to rack is.

As for temperature, I've been working under the assumption that a slow, cool fermentation makes the cleanest beer. I've been putting my beer in a corner of the house that is far from heat sources and windows. The temperature stays around 65, and I wrap a cozy around the carboy.

Yeast needs O2 to grow. So the yeast will pull it out of the wort as the cell count increases. If you don't add O2 to the wort at the start of the fermentation cycle you will stall the yeast. That leads to off flavors and also can lead to under attenuating the beer.

When the beer is in the bucket a blanket of CO2 covers it. So really you don't need to worry about it becoming stale from O2 uptake as long as you don't open the bucket too much after the yeast slows down. Normally what I would do is once the beer reaches FV I cold crash the beer in the primary. That is when you put it in the fridge or in my case the chest freezer set to 33f overnight to help drop the yeast out of the beer. After that I would prime and bottle the beer if you are not kegging.

If you are rellying on the the ambient temp to control your beer temp while you are fermenting you should shoot to me about 5f under what the temp you want to ferment at. So for WLP001 I like that yeast fermented at around 62F to 65F. That means you need to keep the surrounding temps around 60F. Also I like to pitch at a lower temp say around 62F then allow it to slowly rise to 65F and hold it there.

 

[photocurio]

Your beer, assuming no leaks in the fermenter, should be under almost pure CO2 after fermentation. Oxygen will be long driven off/consumed. Racking to secondary is a far greater oxidation risk.

But is that still true after you open up the bucket to take a sample? If I ferment in a bucket for two weeks, and then sample the beer to measure the gravity, the bucket will contain oxygen. And I will probably be taking more frequent samples after that.

So, it seems to me the beer would be better off in a carboy.

 

[crazyirishman34]

I wish we lived closer to each other, Id love to sample one of your 5 to 7 day old beers.

Im calling BS on the 5 to 7 days from grain to glass, yes I can do that too, but good or great beer in 5 to 7 days Im calling BS on that.

I love when people make general statements like that, leading beginner brewers to think any and all beers can be produced in 5 to 7 days and be good, Id love to see you do that with a oak aged imperial stout.

Oh and I am temp controlling, and I also never said it was voodoo.

If these new brewers don't even understand the brewing process, how do you expect them to do what a pro brewer is doing?

Cheers

OK so a new brewer should not be trying to make an oak aged Imperial Stout first off. They should be starting with something simple like a pale ale or a brown ale. Those beers can easily go from grain to glass in 5 days if you aren't dry hopping.

If you have ever had a Sam Adams lager you have had a beer that went from grain to bottle in 7 days. The one thing that they do that really no homebrewer does is centrifuge the beer. That is why they don't have to lager it for an extended time.

I make four beers that are just around 12% abv and they take any were from 14 to 30 days to get into the bottle. The one that takes the longest is the DIIPA that needs to be dry hopped over 4 weeks.

 

[WileECoyote]

OK so a new brewer should not be trying to make an oak aged Imperial Stout first off. They should be starting with something simple like a pale ale or a brown ale. Those beers can easily go from grain to glass in 5 days if you aren't dry hopping.

If you have ever had a Sam Adams lager you have had a beer that went from grain to bottle in 7 days. The one thing that they do that really no homebrewer does is centrifuge the beer. That is why they don't have to lager it for an extended time.

I make four beers that are just around 12% abv and they take any were from 14 to 30 days to get into the bottle. The one that takes the longest is the DIIPA that needs to be dry hopped over 4 weeks.

Like I said I would love to try one of your 5 day old beers, and like i said already I can do that to.

The one thing you haven't addressed is will it be great tasting beer at 5 days ?, I think not.

You could always prove me wrong and send me a sample? if its great I will come on here and say its great ! if its not I will state that too.

Cheers

 

[crazyirishman34]

Like I said I would love to try one of your 5 day old beers, and like i said already I can do that to.

The one thing you haven't addressed is will it be great tasting beer at 5 days ?, I think not.

You could always prove me wrong and send me a sample? if its great I will come on here and say its great ! if its not I will state that too.

Cheers

OK you are right I am wrong. I guess that a Master Brewer Certificate means nothing.

 

[fearwig]

But is that still true after you open up the bucket to take a sample? If I ferment in a bucket for two weeks, and then sample the beer to measure the gravity, the bucket will contain oxygen. And I will probably be taking more frequent samples after that.

So, it seems to me the beer would be better off in a carboy.

As long as your beer is fermenting, it's creating quite a lot of CO2. That's why oxidation is not a serious risk in primary, no matter how much you sample. When you take samples, you also agitate the beer, releasing some more residual CO2 that blankets the liquid once you've closed the lid. CO2 is heavier than air.

At the very end of primary, it is more of a risk, but if you are not overly concerned with having months and months of shelf stability the small amount of O2 your beer will take in through the surface of the liquid at this time is still NOT a major factor. In small-scale homebrewing oxidation is 90% boogeyman. You will get more O2 from racking (even racking relatively well) than you get from checking on your beer in the fermenter.

 

[smizak]

Ugh.


I ignored this forum for a year because of this ridiculous assertion that beer needs to "age"/"condition"/"mature". I would get flamed with two screens worth of copy and pasted dissertations about how I was wrong.

Beer is best served fresh. Period. Done fermenting, yes obviously, but still fresh.

Some things never change.

 

[WileECoyote]

Ugh.


I ignored this forum for a year because of this ridiculous assertion that beer needs to "age"/"condition"/"mature". I would get flamed with two screens worth of copy and pasted dissertations about how I was wrong.

Beer is best served fresh. Period. Done fermenting, yes obviously, but still fresh.

Some things never change.

I think one thing you are forgetting is that everyones taste is different, I like the flavor of aged/conditioned beers much better.

You calling aging/conditioning beer a ridiculous assertion, is the ridiculous statement here.

Not all beer is best served as soon as its done fermenting period.

Cheers

 

[crazyirishman34]

Ugh.


I ignored this forum for a year because of this ridiculous assertion that beer needs to "age"/"condition"/"mature". I would get flamed with two screens worth of copy and pasted dissertations about how I was wrong.

Beer is best served fresh. Period. Done fermenting, yes obviously, but still fresh.

Some things never change.

There really isn't any point in continuing to talk about the merits of "aging" beer. There are some beers that change as they age in the bottle like RIS, Barley Wines and the like but they are perfectly drinkable when they are bottled. But beers like IPAs, Pales, Browns are best fresh. If you like them "aged" if you make it out to MA and stop by the brewery I will give you a few cases of out of date beer.

 

[WileECoyote]

OK you are right I am wrong. I guess that a Master Brewer Certificate means nothing.

See there you go again, deflecting, Please prove me wrong, PM me and I'll give you my address, send me a bottle, any recipe you want, just not a IPA because that would not be fair to you cuz I don't like IPAs to begin with.

I have seen lots of people with a masters degree in business management fail at running a business and go belly up, so no a pice of paper really doesn't mean much to me, proof is in the pudding as my grandmother use to say!

Cheers

 

[crazyirishman34]

See there you go again, deflecting, Please prove me wrong, PM me and I'll give you my address, send me a bottle, any recipe you want, just not a IPA because that would not be fair to you cuz I don't like IPAs to begin with.

I have seen lots of people with a masters degree in business management fail at running a business and go belly up, so no a pice of paper really doesn't mean much to me, proof is in the pudding as my grandmother use to say!

Cheers

Take a look at my website and there are plenty of Cicerone certificated local industry folks who have taken the time to write testimonials that are posted there and more are going up as soon as the web designer gets back from her trip.

 

[WileECoyote]

If you have ever had a Sam Adams lager you have had a beer that went from grain to bottle in 7 days. The one thing that they do that really no homebrewer does is centrifuge the beer. That is why they don't have to lager it for an extended time.

^ This was the best statement so far, especially the part about using a million dollar centrifuge to make beer in 7 days.

My home brew pail didn't come with one of those.

Cheers

 

[crazyirishman34]

^ This was the best statement so far, especially the part about using a million dollar centrifuge to make beer in 7 days.

My home brew pail didn't come with one of those.

Cheers

Well you could by a $30 filter and do the same thing. Or use finings and add a day or 2 to the time that it takes to go from grain to glass. I guess that you are the sidestepping the issue.

Brewing mostly science and a hefty dose of art in how you blend flavors and textures to make a balanced and drinkable product. If you don't do the science bit right there is no way that you can get to the artistic part of brewing. I think too many new homebrewers that just try and make the most outlandish beers (oak aged Russian imperial stout) before mastering the basics of making a great normal beer.

The thing is when you chuck everything including the kitchen sink into a beer and then give the yeast sub optimal conditions to ferment that beer you end up needing to "age" the beer for the flavors to mellow and fade. But if you make a simple beer that is well balanced and you give the yeast near perfect conditions to ferment the beer then you will have a beer that tastes great as soon as it is carbed and clear.

The things that will give you a good strong fermentation is:

Correct Pitching Rate ---- use www.mrmalty.com
Enough O2 in the Wort ----- I use pure O2 with a stone but if you really rock
the bucket for at least 5 min you should be fine
Proper Fermentation Temps ---- Ales I like to pitch at 62F and ferment at
65F. If you are doing wheat beers or
Belgian styles that is a different story
Take Readings and record them

Those things will help you make great beer.

 

[smizak]

Pay attention WileE, so you don't have to let your pale ale sit in primary for 6 months to let all those fusels and esters age out lol...

 

[photocurio]

The things that will give you a good strong fermentation is:

Correct Pitching Rate ---- use www.mrmalty.com
Enough O2 in the Wort ----- I use pure O2 with a stone but if you really rock
the bucket for at least 5 min you should be fine
Proper Fermentation Temps ---- Ales I like to pitch at 62F and ferment at
65F. If you are doing wheat beers or
Belgian styles that is a different story
Take Readings and record them

Those things will help you make great beer.

According to mrmalty.com, 1.5 packets of dry yeast would be better for my 5 gallon brews than a single packet. I'll try that with my next batch, and aerate.

But I can't cold crash the beer. Neither my 7 gallon fermenter bucket, nor my carboy will fit in my fridge. It might take me longer to drop the yeast out of the beer. I could put the beer in the basement, which is probably at 60F this time of year.

Crazyirishman, I live in Somerville, MA. When you get your tasting room open, I'll drop in.

 

[moreb33rplz]

Ugh.


I ignored this forum for a year because of this ridiculous assertion that beer needs to "age"/"condition"/"mature". I would get flamed with two screens worth of copy and pasted dissertations about how I was wrong.

Beer is best served fresh. Period. Done fermenting, yes obviously, but still fresh.

Some things never change.

For what it is worth, I am going to disagree. Some beers taste best fresh, some taste better after being aged. I've drank some homebrews that I've bottled 1-2 years ago, and they have been the best beers of my own I've ever tasted. They were regular old American Pale's and Ambers too, not high gravity types.