Hoppy Red Ale recipe design assistance

[bonecitybrewco]

Working on a Hoppy Red Ale and wondering if anyone can offer thoughts on the grain bill. Not necessarily looking for how you would do it but rather whether you think the grain bill seems excessive or missing in any areas or anything seems obviously out of place. I am fairly confident in the hopping schedule but am open to ideas. Looking for a malty, clean flavored, smooth bitterness with slight hop flavour and huge hop aroma. Simple, straight forward, refreshing red ale.


8 lb American - Pale Ale
0.75 lb American - Caramel / Crystal 60
0.5 lb German - Melanoidin
0.25 lb American - Victory
0.25 lb United Kingdom - Pale Chocolate

~14 SRM
~4.8%
70% efficiency.

Mash @ 155 for 60 min


0.75 oz Centennial First Wort 60 min
2 oz Cascade 5 min
3 oz Cascade Dry Hop 7 days
2 oz Centennial Dry Hop 7 days

~ 26 IBU

Safale US-05

 

[saltymirv]

Brew it! Brew it now!

The only thing I might change is lower the amount of pale choc. I think you'll definitely taste it and I personally don't like my ambers to taste stout-y. That's up to you though

 

[bonecitybrewco]

Brew it! Brew it now!

The only thing I might change is lower the amount of pale choc. I think you'll definitely taste it and I personally don't like my ambers to taste stout-y. That's up to you though

The debate was between 2oz and 4oz. The change will drop the colour and I could add 2oz of Crystal 120 to make up the difference. Just didn't want to go too hard on the Crystals.

Apparently the pale chocolate adds a nuttiness in small amounts. That's what I'm hoping to achieve with this.

 

[saltymirv]

The debate was between 2oz and 4oz. The change will drop the colour and I could add 2oz of Crystal 120 to make up the difference. Just didn't want to go too hard on the Crystals.

Apparently the pale chocolate adds a nuttiness in small amounts. That's what I'm hoping to achieve with this.

I would drop it to 2oz and you could add 2-4oz of C-120 back in. If its just color you're after try adding carafa special/blackprinz/midnight wheat. They all add color without much flavor.

The biscuit malt will add nuttiness as well, so I think you will be happy with it

 

[bonecitybrewco]

So ditch the chocolate altogether and maybe bump the Melanoidin for the biscuit and maybe add carared?

 

[kh54s10]

I would drop it to 2oz and you could add 2-4oz of C-120 back in. If its just color you're after try adding carafa special/blackprinz/midnight wheat. They all add color without much flavor.

The biscuit malt will add nuttiness as well, so I think you will be happy with it

IMO these will give a brown/black color not red. Try Carared or Red X for color or the C-120 would be better.

I like the hops schedule.

 

[Yooper]

So ditch the chocolate altogether and maybe bump the Melanoidin for the biscuit and maybe add carared?

No, no, yes. In that order.

You already have a boatload of melanoidin, way too much for my taste. I'd leave that out altogether, and get the malt flavor from the base malt, victory malt (same as biscuit) and yes, I like carared.

I like a "layering" of crystal malts in American reds. Don't be afraid to use plenty- up to 15% would be ok in a well-hopped red. You'd need to bump up the IBUs a bit, so that the beer isn't too caramel sweet and too forward. If you have something like 1.050 gravity, you could go with 35(ish) IBUs to do this.

I like to use a 20L like carared, then maybe an 80L, and even a smidgeon of 120L (not much) for the depth of flavor and richness it brings. Victory or biscuit is fine, but again- not too much.

You have 60L, so some carared would be great, with a touch of dark crystal to really balance the flavors and deepen the color.

A pinch of pale chocolate is fine for color adjustment, or some debittered carafa III or midnight wheat works very well.

 

[bonecitybrewco]

Thanks so much all. I might turf the Melanoidin and sub carared and then sub 120 for the chocolate. I'll post an updated version in a few mins.

 

[crusader1612]

IMO Pale Choc will give a better red colour than something like Carafa or midnight wheat.
R/Barley is another good addition for red beers.
Obviously keep the additions small 1-2 oz should cut it, especially ifyou have dark crystal and something like carared.

I've actually simplified ym red ipa grain bill somewhat.
pale malt
munich malt
caramunich ii
special B (I use a locally available malt, which is a similar colour. with maybe 1oz of Black Patent to red it in the area.

then you hop the crap out of it.
I'm really starting to enjoy more simplified grain bills in my hoppy beers.

 

[bonecitybrewco]

Trying to avoid it being an IPA. Would really like it more malt forward than hop forward. Want aroma, yes, but the flavour to be more balanced to the malt side like a traditional red. Just doing some experimenting based on the American Amber style for fun. Thanks for the ideas.

 

[kristiismean]

Mine in the fermenter (my hoppy red wheat) is 6 lbs 2 row, 5 lbs red wheat and 1 lbs caravienne.

but I am only using Amarillo hops. (going to a gumball head type wheat)

 

[bonecitybrewco]

Updated version. Problem is SRM is only @ 15. Really want to push this to 17 but don't want too much dark malt obviously. The Crystals are sitting at 15% if you don't count Victory. Any thoughts? Also updated the hop schedule just adding a different variety. I could go either way on this... either single hop or 4 hop. Like the blend of Cascade/Amarillo/Simcoe for flavour/aroma and Centennial is great for bittering.

9 lbs Canadian Superior Pale Ale 2-row
0.5 lbs Carared
0.5 lbs Crystal 60
0.25 lbs Crystal 120
0.25 lbs Victory
0.125 lbs Midnight Wheat

0.75oz Centennial - First Wort Hop - 60 min
1oz Cascade - Boil - 5 min
1oz Amarillo - Boil - 5 min
1oz Simcoe - Boil - 5 min
2 oz Cascade - Dry Hop - 7 Days
2 oz Amarillo - Dry Hop - 7 Days
1 oz Simcoe - Dry Hop - 7 Days

 

[crusader1612]

Remove the victory and up your C120 - that'll darken it up a touch.
you can increase you dark malt a touch as well, maybe even just to 0.15lb it'll darken without adding much in the way of flavor.

 

[kristiismean]

why not magnum bittering with amrillo and simcoe? just a thought. whatever happens, let me know the recipe and if it's good!

which yeast were you thinking of using?

 

[bonecitybrewco]

why not magnum bittering with amrillo and simcoe? just a thought. whatever happens, let me know the recipe and if it's good!

which yeast were you thinking of using?

Honestly haven't used Magnum and have 2lbs each of Cascade and Centennial kicking around. Absolutely I think Magnum or Warrior would certainly work. Thanks for the idea. I also want it to avoid getting into IPA territory and so the one above is sitting around 35 IBU as per Yooper's suggestion to balance it. I may even bring it down to 30 as I do want some malt flavour to be a bit forward.