help: losing a lot of wort between my tubing and march pump,

[awtesta]

I recently decided to go balls to the wall and get a top tier system (very happy with it) and have all the valves, cooler, pump, therminator, HERMS coil. hooked up with 1/2in. silicone tubing and camlock disconnects. While giving the system its inaugural run this weekend I noticed I lost a LOT, possibly a gallon+ of wort, between the tubing, pump and therminator. I ended up with ~6.5 gallons pre boil and by the time I pumped, chilled, and got it in the fermenter I ended up with about 4.5gallons at most.

I think that the pump is my main area of loss. When I turn it off, I end up with wort in both the in/out sides and can't always easily get the tubing to the right height/spot to dump any remaining wort

Is this something that I can just expect with a multi-tier setup, pump, therminator, etc. and need to account for by brewing a slightly bigger batch? Or should I try squeezing the tubing to push all the wort out? Should I be kinking the hoses and make sure I'm dumping all the wort? Am I missing something obvious here?

P.S. My previous system was a HLT/BK, cooler mash tun and good old gravity. I don't recall losing much wort at all between transfers.

 

[edmanster]

Could put some quick connects on and purge the system with air or Co2 after.. Just a thought

 

[jkarp]

I think you may need to look elsewhere for your loss. The March pump housing holds MAYBE a half cup of liquid. Ten feet of 1/2 silicone tubing has a volume of only 0.1 gallons.

 

[Bobby_M]

Test it out by filling the system, then disconnect and pour the contents into an empty measuring cup. You might be looking at a quart. The therminator is a big chiller, but the wort path only holds about a pint IIRC.

 

[rockytoptim]

Test it out by filling the system, then disconnect and pour the contents into an empty measuring cup. You might be looking at a quart. The therminator is a big chiller, but the wort path only holds about a pint IIRC.

Do what bobby said and do test run with water and then blow out system with air into a bucket and measure what came out.

 

[HitTheTwit]

Did you end up figuring out where the loss was coming from?

 

[mike79]

I use a single tier system, but other than that, my set-up is exactly the same- 1/2" tubing, camlocks, march 809 and therminator. The loss between tubing, pump head and chiller is minimal. Can't comment on the multi-tier, what about volume loss due to cooling? I know it won't account for all your loss, but it's the only thing I can think of...

 

[audger]

i have a charcoal water filter with a cam lock fitting on the output side attached to the brew rig. whenever im done circulating wort, i just attach the pump to it and push some clean water thru the system until just before it starts coming out clean on the other end. i figure its better to dillute the 10 gallons of wort with half a cup of water than loose a quart of wort. you can always just boil off that half a cup.

 

[wncbrewer]

I have keep a little bit of my strike water in the hlt, when I've pumped all the wort I can get out of the boil kettle, I hook my in line to the hlt and use the water to push any remaining wort out of the lines and pump and chiller, just watch closely and shut your outflow valve as soon as you see water, it also rinses the lines and pump at the same time, I use a fifty foot counterflow, i've never measured its capacity, but it is substaintial

 

[HitTheTwit]

Is a quick pump outflow shutoff like that dangerous to the magnetic pump itself?
Do you only have the shutoff on the outflow and not the inflow?

 

[OLDBREW]

On the March 809's pump output outlet, install an inline tee, then come off the middle port of that tee with another ball valve. This ball valve can be used to drain the hoses and pump housing of any left over wort, and can be dumped into the boiler. It can also be used to easily prime the pump in the beginning of the brew session.

As far as restricting the input sides flow with a ball valve... you can lose the prime on the pump trying to reduce the flow rate that way. The 809s are not self priming pumps. That is why you control your flow rate from the output side to begin with.

That being said, I agree with taking a measurement of the total volume of wort left behind in your herms coil and plumbing.

 

[HitTheTwit]

On the March 809's pump output outlet, install an inline tee, then come off the middle port of that tee with another ball valve. This ball valve can be used to drain the hoses and pump housing of any left over wort, and can be dumped into the boiler. It can also be used to easily prime the pump in the beginning of the brew session.

OB, thanks for clarifying that. I just received my first pump and have been toying with different setup ideas.

To make sure I understand, you have the following:
Pump outlet running through a tee, with a ball valve on either end of tee, one running to hoses per usual, and the other for drainage?

That sounds like a great idea. And one further threadjack (the thread was dead a while ago anyways!); do you use another ball valve when flowing liquid back into your tanks? I would have the pump push out through hose into a high side ball valve going into my boil kettle.

 

[OLDBREW]

OB, thanks for clarifying that. I just received my first pump and have been toying with different setup ideas.

To make sure I understand, you have the following:
Pump outlet running through a tee, with a ball valve on either end of tee, one running to hoses per usual, and the other for drainage?

That sounds like a great idea. And one further threadjack (the thread was dead a while ago anyways!); do you use another ball valve when flowing liquid back into your tanks? I would have the pump push out through hose into a high side ball valve going into my boil kettle.

different brewery setups may call for two tees instead of one if you have multiple outlet hoses running up to different vessels from one pump.

the tees have two end ports and one middle port. if you want just one feed with a drain, you could do just as you suggest, or if more ports are needed you can stack the tees using a close nipple. All output feed or drain ports get a ball valve to control flow. you don't need more then one valve for flow control on one line

my herms coil in the hlt has a by-pass loop which is regulated by a diverter valve. the valve will allow you to route the liquor through the coil, or bypass the coil completely. I can also mix any portion of the coil and bypass liquor together using just this one valve, so one output pump hose goes to the common input of this valve.

another output hose goes to the boiler so I can pump from the mashtun to the boiler

 

[wncbrewer]

The additional valve on the outflow side is a great idea, they can be tricky to prime, and that would make bleeding air very easy. Bobby_m has a youtube video on how to prime one up. In terms of shutting the valve quickly, I don't think its gonna hurt anything, we're talking about 7 gpm, so water hammer doesn't really come into play. Good luck...once you get things figured out, a pump will make you're brewing life a ton easier. I don't know how I ever got along without it

 

[HitTheTwit]

Thanks! I'm looking forward to getting everything setup and breaking it in. I get the brew stand on Sunday, and everything gets beautiful from there

 

[johnodon]

Could put some quick connects on and purge the system with air or Co2 after.. Just a thought

I have to factor in my CFC which has a lot more loss so I think I am going to take edmanster's advice. I have a 2 port manifold that I use solely for force carbing. I can easily sacrifice one of those.

What kind of PSI do you use edmanster?

John

 

[edmanster]

I have to factor in my CFC which has a lot more loss so I think I am going to take edmanster's advice. I have a 2 port manifold that I use solely for force carbing. I can easily sacrifice one of those.

What kind of PSI do you use edmanster?

John

i just recently cleaned and flushed out my heat exchanger/flash chiller that i serve room temp brew down to 35-40 degreese and i think 40psi was about the perfect pressure for clearing out most of the liquid left.

 

[OLDBREW]

2-5 psi should push any left over wort out of a counterflow chiller as long as your connector is tight. gravity should really drain the counterflow chiller if it sits like pictured