Help! Confused why Maibock Clone is Way too Sweet.

[Tippsy-Turvy]

I typically like very low bitterness but even for me this is cloyingly sweet and I can't figure out why.

It lagered for 3 months, bottle conditioned (4 days room temp, 9 days in fridge) and the targeted BU:GU was 0.35. I believe the bitterness ratio is at the low end for the style but not way out of range. FG settled at 1.019 vs target of 1.016.

Is the priming sugar not fully fermented? The beer's not conditioned long enough? It didn't reach a low enough FG (I don't have pure oxygen)? The recipe's unbalanced? I screwed up adding the hops? Aaargh!!

8lb Pilsner
4lb Munich 10
1lb Carapils
1lb Caravienne

0.5oz Magnum @ 45mins (~19 IBUs)
0.5oz Hallertau @ 10mins (~2 IBUs)
0.5oz Hallertau @ 5mins (~1 IBU)

P-rest @ 132F 20mins
Dext-rest @ 154F 30mins
Decoc 10mins
Dext-rest @ 160F 20 mins
Sparge @ 171F 10mins

WLP830, 3L starter
Fermented @ 50F 1 week, D-rest @ 67F 5 days, Secondary @ 40F 3 mths
OG 1.063, FG 1.019, IBU 22

 

[theheroguy]

Well you have a pound of caravienne which seems way out of style to begin with. I've never done a decoction mash but your saccharification steps seem to be too high temp also.

 

[MrPowers]

From what I understand, when brewing the maibock style, generally you want to target the high end of the spectrum for IBU's. I once brewed one with 25 IBU's and it was far too sweet as well. I ended up using most of that beer to boil brats because I couldn't drink it.

Your FG seems reasonable. So I would guess that it just comes down to the IBU's.

 

[Tippsy-Turvy]

Boy, I feel like an idiot who's just publicly declared he's an idiot.

I'm so averse to high bitterness that I'm almost hard-wired to mash high which, for such a high OG recipe, is obviously inappropriate.

I reckon you're both right. The sacc-temp is too high therefore the IBU is too low.

Durgh...

 

[porterpounder]

154 sacch rest is not mashing high. 158 would be high. Your yeast apparent attenuation is less than 70% for a strain that averages 77%. Either you didn't pitch enough healthy yeast, didn't have enough oxygen as you suspected or a combination of both. Even if the yeast finishes out all the way in a dextrinous wort, you're not going to get more sweetness, even at 1.019, you're going to get more body. The body will accentuate the maltiness, but maltiness is not sweetness.

 

[Tippsy-Turvy]

Your yeast apparent attenuation is less than 70% for a strain that averages 77%.

Fair point, but wouldn't a lower mash temp result in a lower FG and therefore higher apparent attenuation? In other words, it would seem that the cause is still likely to be the wrong mash temp?

I monitored the FG levels and they did stabilise close to the predicted level (Brewer's Friend) but definitely was slightly higher.

 

[BigEd]

I typically like very low bitterness but even for me this is cloyingly sweet and I can't figure out why.

It lagered for 3 months, bottle conditioned (4 days room temp, 9 days in fridge) and the targeted BU:GU was 0.35. I believe the bitterness ratio is at the low end for the style but not way out of range. FG settled at 1.019 vs target of 1.016.

Is the priming sugar not fully fermented? The beer's not conditioned long enough? It didn't reach a low enough FG (I don't have pure oxygen)? The recipe's unbalanced? I screwed up adding the hops? Aaargh!!

8lb Pilsner
4lb Munich 10
1lb Carapils
1lb Caravienne

0.5oz Magnum @ 45mins (~19 IBUs)
0.5oz Hallertau @ 10mins (~2 IBUs)
0.5oz Hallertau @ 5mins (~1 IBU)

P-rest @ 132F 20mins
Dext-rest @ 154F 30mins
Decoc 10mins
Dext-rest @ 160F 20 mins
Sparge @ 171F 10mins

WLP830, 3L starter
Fermented @ 50F 1 week, D-rest @ 67F 5 days, Secondary @ 40F 3 mths
OG 1.063, FG 1.019, IBU 22

View attachment 361055

14% crystal malts, 63 OG/ + 21 IBU is your basic problem.

My take: You need a 90/60 bittering hop addition. 45 minutes isn't going to cut it IMO. For a 63 OG get your IBU up into the mid/high 20s, like 26/28. 154F is too high for main mash rest temp IMO. Start your decoction @ 128F and then step to 148F for the main rest. For a Maibock I'd also lose the Munich, ditch the CaraVienna and go maybe 60/40% Vienna/Pilsner.

 

[Tippsy-Turvy]

14% crystal malts, 63 OG/ + 21 IBU is your basic problem.

My take: You need a 90/60 bittering hop addition. 45 minutes isn't going to cut it IMO. For a 63 OG get your IBU up into the mid/high 20s, like 26/28. 154F is too high for main mash rest temp IMO. Start your decoction @ 128F and then step to 148F for the main rest. For a Maibock I'd also lose the Munich, ditch the CaraVienna and go maybe 60/40% Vienna/Pilsner.

Succinct and sweet! Thanks BigEd.

On the Munich deletion, I believe the style emphasizes maltiness so wouldn't you want it in the recipe? Eliminating the crystals, I get now.

 

[BigEd]

Succinct and sweet! Thanks BigEd.

On the Munich deletion, I believe the style emphasizes maltiness so wouldn't you want it in the recipe? Eliminating the crystals, I get now.

Munich? I still say no in a Maibock. Maibocks are light in color and Vienna/Pils is the way to go IMO. I love Munich malt but it doesn't hold an exclusivity on maltiness.

 

[porterpounder]

Fair point, but wouldn't a lower mash temp result in a lower FG and therefore higher apparent attenuation? In other words, it would seem that the cause is still likely to be the wrong mash temp?

I monitored the FG levels and they did stabilise close to the predicted level (Brewer's Friend) but definitely was slightly higher.

You described one of your issues as cloying sweetness, that's not an issue of mash temp. It's an issue of yeast crapping out before consuming all the fermentable sugar.
154 is likely to leave a bit more unfermentable wort products than at, say 148 or 150, which could give you a higher FG, but 154 is not really high enough to leave a noticeably dextrinous wort with a moderate OG and should finish at or below 1.016.