Grain Bill

[sbsmann]

One of the things that always seems to trip me up on every recipe I do is the tedious search for my grain bill in the Beersmith app. I'm definitely not expert on grains, but I'd think some of the common ones would be clearly identified in the app. It seems I either can't find the grain at all or I have several to choose from what I "think" is the right choice and I'm never real confident I have it right. It doesn't seem like this step should be so difficult, but for some reason it is for me. On this simple recipe I can't confidently find any of these in the app. What exactly am I missing or doing wrong?

1.25 lbs Crystal Rye
0.75 lb Belgian Cara 45
0.125 lb Roasted Barley
8.5 lbs Briess 2-row

 

[Rhaop]

Beersmith has a generic 2-row, the nice thing is that most maltsters have a lot of data on their websites, if you don’t find a particular malt on beer smith you can add the malt and input the data points you need such as diastic power, lovibond and the amount of extract points

 

[sbsmann]

Beersmith has a generic 2-row, the nice thing is that most maltsters have a lot of data on their websites, if you don’t find a particular malt on beer smith you can add the malt and input the data points you need such as diastic power, lovibond and the amount of extract points

Ah, okay that definitely helps me.

 

[day_trippr]

fwiw, I was able to find all four of those grains in BS2.
But I've installed a crap ton of BS add-ons, and they may be contained therein.
If you haven't walked through all of the available add-ons I suggest you take the time to do so...

Cheers!

 

[Amadeo38]

Agree with day_trippr - all the missing common grains from different maltsters are located in the add-ons section. I added Golden Promise manually before I found this out and downloaded the Simpson’s add-on.

 

[Jtk78]

In addition to the grain, there's quite a fwe hops in the add ons as well. I check for new ones every now and then too.

 

[sbsmann]

Oh boy, I see TONS of add-ons that I need to download. That probably explains my issue. Thanks fellas.

 

[waldoar15]

I'm using the older registered version of BS and run into it. My version doesn't list Golden Promise (for example) , so I use the data for Maris Otter, which is close enough for me.

 

[sbsmann]

Interestingly I added the grains but stumbled across what I think is a bona fide software bug with the mobile app. I think it occurs specifically for new grains that that get added (using the "Install Add-Ons" menu). I went in there and had quite a few grains to add so I added them all. After doing that I was able to find and add all my grains to my newly created recipe. This recipe had 4 different grains but for some reason when I looked at the "timer" section in the app that shows the brew details, it appeared there were only 2 of the 4 grains listed in my recipe. This was after saving it obviously. But even more concerning was that the water volumes were being calculated on the grain weight of only 2 of these 4 grains (so WAY understated water amounts). In my case it was excluding 3 pounds of grain providing and very low mash water volume and an awful water/grain ration of like 1.000 qt/lb. That would have insured a clogged drain in my system. I tried a million things to get the grain to show up in my recipe, but nothing would work. Finally after going into each of the grains under the "Ingredients section" and saving each one individually, they all magically appeared in my new recipe. And the water totals were then correct.

To me, this is a pretty major flaw in the phone app and I posted this in the Beersmith forum (with nobody responding). For me I feel like I have lost confidence in the app if it can't handle something as simple as that and it certainly makes me want to go back to using my simply spreadsheet that I built myself. That's kind of a shame.

 

[day_trippr]

It's possible bugs like that remain latent because so many BS users construct their recipes and maintain inventory on a PC, push the recipe to the cloud, pull the recipe down to their mobile device for brew day and data recording, then push the updated recipe back through the cloud to the pc.

That's what I do so I would never run into what you found...

Cheers!

 

[sbsmann]

Yeah, that's a shame because today people want mobile apps and online web based services for most things. Something as rudimentary as a beer making tool fits that bill perfectly. I suppose if you've already paid for and installed the software on a PC, it probably works fine (at least for now before you buy a new PC). Unfortunately I suspect I am not alone in being someone who would only use the mobile app and who also desires something much more robust online that can be accessed anywhere easily through a browser. I honestly don't know many people today who still install software on their PC for anything. I was kind of shocked when I found out that was required in order to fully utilize Beersmith. Anyway, Beersmith would be best served at fixing their mobile app and also quickly trying to adjust to the times by offering a web based product before they find themselves in a situation where they can no longer support their antiquated system. In the meantime I'll probably have to go back to my Excel Spreadsheet and simply user Brewersfriend for my recipes.

 

[kh54s10]

Yeah, that's a shame because today people want mobile apps and online web based services for most things. Something as rudimentary as a beer making tool fits that bill perfectly. I suppose if you've already paid for and installed the software on a PC, it probably works fine (at least for now before you buy a new PC). Unfortunately I suspect I am not alone in being someone who would only use the mobile app and who also desires something much more robust online that can be accessed anywhere easily through a browser. I honestly don't know many people today who still install software on their PC for anything. I was kind of shocked when I found out that was required in order to fully utilize Beersmith. Anyway, Beersmith would be best served at fixing their mobile app and also quickly trying to adjust to the times by offering a web based product before they find themselves in a situation where they can no longer support their antiquated system. In the meantime I'll probably have to go back to my Excel Spreadsheet and simply user Brewersfriend for my recipes.

I have to start off by saying that I have never used the BS app. I had the PC version before the app was created. It works great and I just take my laptop to the brew area when brewing. I couldn't justify the expense of having both the PC version and the app when I can use the laptop.

That said, I doubt that I would like working with my recipes on a phone or tablet. A keyboard and mouse make it so much easier to navigate.

Even if you get all the add-ons there is often still some editing to be done. For instance hop Alpha Acid #s change with every season. I also just found the tool to correct the alpha acid % for age of the hops. So I have more editing to do.

 

[Jtk78]

I have used the app exclusively to brew with, but also have the PC version and will view it either way. That being said I do not use either for volume calcs. I added to EZ water to get my mash and sparge volumes.

 

[sbsmann]

I have to start off by saying that I have never used the BS app. I had the PC version before the app was created. It works great and I just take my laptop to the brew area when brewing. I couldn't justify the expense of having both the PC version and the app when I can use the laptop.

That said, I doubt that I would like working with my recipes on a phone or tablet. A keyboard and mouse make it so much easier to navigate.

Even if you get all the add-ons there is often still some editing to be done. For instance hop Alpha Acid #s change with every season. I also just found the tool to correct the alpha acid % for age of the hops. So I have more editing to do.

Oh, I agree doing it on a PC is the way to go. But Beersmith should be web based & not require an application to be installed. If it is web based you could use it on any PC anywhere with ease...kind of like homebrewtalk. The app is just handy to have on brewday if you don't want a laptop cluttering up the space. Either way works, but if Beersmith is going to create an app like they did, it should work!

 

[sbsmann]

I have used the app exclusively to brew with, but also have the PC version and will view it either way. That being said I do not use either for volume calcs. I added to EZ water to get my mash and sparge volumes.

I do like having everything in one place. Since I entered all my equipment, etc into the app, it just made sense to use it for water volumes for mash, mashout & sparge. As well as strike water temp and mashout water temp. But of course if the water volumes are not accurate in the app, then it definitely does not make sense to use it.

 

[Jtk78]

I do like having everything in one place. Since I entered all my equipment, etc into the app, it just made sense to use it for water volumes for mash, mashout & sparge. As well as strike water temp and mashout water temp. But of course if the water volumes are not accurate in the app, then it definitely does not make sense to use it.

Have you tried finding an email address for Brad Smith to let him know so he can try to correct it?

 

[sbsmann]

Have you tried finding an email address for Brad Smith to let him know so he can try to correct it?

Yup...I attempted to email the Beersmith site which took me to a Beersmith forum which I posted the issue. Nobody responded in a couple weeks, so not sure if anyone monitors that. I also gave the mobile app a bad rating and brief description on Google Play. That's about all I can do from a user side.

 

[ESBrewer]

Did you notice the 'recommend mash' field initially when adding the grains. If grains are not meant to be mashed the water volume during mash is not adjusted. I noticed (Android) that on default many add-on malts have 'recommend mash' unchecked. Even if you add these malts in a recipe they won't appear in the mash unless you check this box in the malt details.

 

[sbsmann]

Did you notice the 'recommend mash' field initially when adding the grains. If grains are not meant to be mashed the water volume during mash is not adjusted. I noticed (Android) that on default many add-on malts have 'recommend mash' unchecked. Even if you add these malts in a recipe they won't appear in the mash unless you check this box in the malt details.

Ironically I did. And perhaps you have uncovered another bug in the mobile app. I had wondered what that checkbox was for and I figured it did exactly what you indicated, but I also noticed a very large % of the grains in the list have that box unchecked (which seemed odd for so many that you would use in a mash). Furthermore I also looked back at my previous recipes and many of those recipes had grains in them with the box unchecked but they were definitely used in the water volume calculations. So either that box doesn't work intuitively like we would think or it also has a bug. Also I suppose it should be noted that realistically I would think the app should have the default as checked for all grains to be used in the mash and let user decide to uncheck if they need to for some odd reason.

 

[ESBrewer]

I haven't noticed the bug really, but most programs contain some so I wouldn't be surprised. Most base malts have "recommend mash" checked and they appear in the mash timeline. Most specialty grains have this box unchecked probably because extract brewers tend to steep these grains (no mashing at all). Such grains seem to appear during the boil in the app unless teh box is checked.

 

[day_trippr]

[...]But Beersmith should be web based & not require an application to be installed. If it is web based you could use it on any PC anywhere with ease...kind of like homebrewtalk.[...]

No thank you!
I often take my rig up to my cabin deep in the White Mountains where we have literally zero connectivity. Zip. Zilch. Nada.
I'm ok with it, it's not supposed to be just another room in my primary residence.

My rig doesn't depend on electricity, and I sure as heck don't want the tools I use to depend on internet availability...

Cheers!

 

[sbsmann]

No thank you!
I often take my rig up to my cabin deep in the White Mountains where we have literally zero connectivity. Zip. Zilch. Nada.
I'm ok with it, it's not supposed to be just another room in my primary residence.

My rig doesn't depend on electricity, and I sure as heck don't want the tools I use to depend on internet availability...

Cheers!

You are in the minority but its cool that feature works for you!

 

[sbsmann]

I haven't noticed the bug really, but most programs contain some so I wouldn't be surprised. Most base malts have "recommend mash" checked and they appear in the mash timeline. Most specialty grains have this box unchecked probably because extract brewers tend to steep these grains (no mashing at all). Such grains seem to appear during the boil in the app unless teh box is checked.

So are you saying the total grain weight depends on whether the grain is mashable or not (checkbox on or off)? I've always been under the belief that mash water volume in quarts is equal to mash thickness X total grain weight. Whether the grain is mashable or not I didn't think mattered in the total grain weight?