First dead yeast

[billvon]

I had my first case of truly dead yeast last weekend. I was making a raspberry lambic using Wyeast 3278 lambic blend. I activated it about two hours before pitching. There was some swelling but I wasn't sure whether that was from fermentation or the packet just warming up.

I've been pitching at slightly higher temps lately (74-76) to get a more rapid start then cooling the fermentor down to 68-70F by leaving it outside overnight. That worked for the other two beers I made that day, but after 72 hours there was absolutely zero activity from the lambic. Not so much as a bubble. So I got another packet of 3278 (fortunately in stock locally) activated it and pitched it. The packet swelled quickly and I got a good start within 4 hours.

I was surprised I managed to kill it that thoroughly. I thought it would be tough to kill off so much yeast that it wouldn't start up at all.

 

[whatisitgoodfor]

Did you check your gravity at 72 hours, or just trust that bubbles would tell you if it was fermenting?

Having the second inoculation of yeast start up at 4 hours suggests to me that the first batch was just taking its sweet time frolicking in the sugary wonderland you provided it.

 

[wonderbread23]

Pretty unlikely that it was dead. I'm just guessing that it is slower to start than typical yeast because of the bugs that are in the mix.

 

[Revvy]

It's really hard to kill your yeast. If the can survive 45 million years in amber and beer can be brewed from it, it's doubtful your yeast died.

It sounds like you ignored the part of the 72 hours to show visible signs, where we mention that airlock bubbling is NOT a good sign.

The most important tool you can use is a hydrometer. It;'s the only way you will truly know when your beer is ready...airlock bubbles and other things are faulty. So is looking at the amount of foam you have or whether it is still there or not

The only way to truly know what is going on in your fermenter is with your hydrometer. Like I said here in my blog, which I encourage you to read, Think evaluation before action you sure as HELL wouldn't want a doctor to start cutting on you unless he used the proper diagnostic instuments like x-rays first, right? You wouldn't want him to just take a look in your eyes briefly and say "I'm cutting into your chest first thing in the morning." You would want them to use the right diagnostic tools before the slice and dice, right? You'd cry malpractice, I would hope, if they didn't say they were sending you for an MRI and other things before going in....

Thinking about "doing anything" without taking a hydrometer reading is tantamount to the doctor deciding to cut you open without running any diagnostic tests....Taking one look at you and saying, "Yeah I'm going in." You would really want the doctor to use all means to properly diagnose what's going on?

If you hadn't taking a gravity reading, then you can'tm declare your yeast as dead, all you can say is that your airlock wasn't bubbling. Plenty of beers ferment without a blip of an airlock.

 

[mk78]

the question is, can it survive me being an idiot and pretty much freezing the smack pack?

 

[whatisitgoodfor]

Almost certainly.

You can harvest fresh yeast every spring, and it gets below freezing most places. Some of the yeast will die, and the rest will go dormant, so it will probably take longer for them to get started, but it's really hard to kill off all of the yeast.

 

[mk78]

That's good to hear. I figured I'll thaw it out, make a starter, and cross my fingers.

Should I make like one small starter, then dump the wort, and pitch the slurry into a bigger starter? Would that up my chances of plenty of hungry, healthy yeast? Sorry if I've jacked this thread, btw...

 

[ajf]

I had my first case of truly dead yeast last weekend. I was making a raspberry lambic using Wyeast 3278 lambic blend. I activated it about two hours before pitching. There was some swelling but I wasn't sure whether that was from fermentation or the packet just warming up.

I've been pitching at slightly higher temps lately (74-76) to get a more rapid start then cooling the fermentor down to 68-70F by leaving it outside overnight. That worked for the other two beers I made that day, but after 72 hours there was absolutely zero activity from the lambic. Not so much as a bubble. So I got another packet of 3278 (fortunately in stock locally) activated it and pitched it. The packet swelled quickly and I got a good start within 4 hours.

I was surprised I managed to kill it that thoroughly. I thought it would be tough to kill off so much yeast that it wouldn't start up at all.

So you pitched two packets of 3278 approximately 72 hours apart, and after the second pitching, you saw signs of fermentation within 4 hours?
I'd be very surprised if the first packet was dead, as without making a starter, liquid yeast usually takes a long time to start fermenting. My guess is that the fermentation is from the first packet, which was probably a bit old, and took a few days to start fermenting. I've never had a liquid yeast show signs of fermentation within 4 hours of pitching without making a starter. Even with a starter, it often takes much longer than 4 hours before fermentation takes off.

-a.

 

[Pappers_]

But there's no harm in what you did - pitching the second packet won't be overpitching, just more expensive.