First All Grain Brew - Check My Plan

[jrsdws]

I'll be brewing my first AG this weekend. It'll either be a SA Boston Lager clone or a simple California Common.....haven't decided yet and it might come down to what LHBS has available for ingredients.

I have my 10 gallon Igloo round beverage cooler and LHBS is going to help me convert it for my mash tun. I will be batch sparging.

The process is where I need confirmation from you all.

My grain bill will be 10lbs for a 5 gallon batch.

1. Mash in with 3.50gal of water. Strike temp 166F (grain temp 70F).
2. Sacch' Rest at 152F for 60 minutes
3. Start heating 5.50gal of sparge water to 185F
4. Vorlauf then drain into boil kettle
5. Add sparge water and stir thoroughly
6. Vorlauf and drain into boil kettle
7. Bring to boil as normal with hop additions etc etc etc proceeding as usual

I used a mash and sparge water calculator from "Brew 365" website.

Please make any corrections or adjustments and suggestions as I'm anxious to learn AG brewing.

 

[MrHadack]

That looks good on the surface. I do have a few questions about details though:

1. Have you given any thought to the mash pH?

2. What is your planned procedure for adding the water and grain to the mash tun? Which goes in first, etc.?

 

[jrsdws]

I have not given any thought to PH at this time.

I was planning on pre-heating the mash tun with hot water then draining it back for use as sparge water. I planned on adding staggered additions of grain while stirring it in with about 1/3 of the water to start......water...grain...water...grain....water....grain....all while stirring.

 

[Croyzen]

No need to preheat and drain. Preheat and use the water. If your strike temperature is 166, I'd heat the water up about 10 degrees more @ 177, close the cooler and let it preheat. Let the temp fall down to 166 (check in 5 minutes) and then mash in. If you don't do this you'll be having fun wondering why instead of 152 you're several degrees low. If you are a few degrees warm by the time you stir you'll fall down to the temp which is much easier than trying to raise the temp of a cooler. If I need to be at 152 then I like being a couple degrees warmer because it stirs out quickly. Anything more will take longer or you may need to use ice.

Without knowing your target pre-boil volume, listing how much water doesn't really help. Remember you'll be losing about .10-.125 gallons/lb to grain absorption.

If you're batch sparging, normally the goal is to get equal runnings. This would mean the first volume in step one would be whatever mash ratio you decide 1.25-2.00qts/lb is generally accepted. After the 60 minute mash, top up with some water (165-190F) to account for grain absorption and then drain into the kettle. Next, batch sparge (anywhere 165-190F if you want to try and raise the grain bed temp up close to 168F is great but not required) with an amount of water that will yield an equal amount for second runnings. At this point you should get out what you put in. Also, be sure to calculate your mash tun deadspace before the first brew. I'm a mash tun tipper and if you are it may take a few brews with it to really know how much your are leaving behind. Always measure the volume in the kettle after each running to help with that.

Here is the calculator that allows accounts for this method. The "grain absorption" field is the volume used to top up before collecting the first runnings.

http://onebeer.net/batchspargecalc.shtml



Unless you're using massive amounts of grain, just dump it in at a moderate pace and stir all at once. Whenever I watch YouTube videos of all grain I can't stand the ones where it takes someone 15 minutes to pour 10 lbs of grain into the tun and they are stirring it like they are afraid of it. Just pour it all in at once stirring then stir well and close it up. It should only take a couple of minutes to do and stir out any dough balls.

With water I would worry about chlorine/chloramine when it comes to water as you don't need a water report to filter out chlorine or use campden. Filtering out these things is a simple and important step. Good luck!

 

[jrsdws]

No preheat makes sense and saves time with the method you described, thanks.

My target pre-boil volume is 6.5 gallons. My expected boil off rate is one gallon per hour.

I'm accounting for a .125 gallon/lb absorption rate.

Using the calculator provided, I guesstimated a .25gal deadspace. It's just a guess as I don't have the tun finished to test. I come out with an 8 gallon total water volume.

Should I just split the two runs equally at 4 gallons each?

I'll be using bottled water such as Nestle Purelife. I do have campden, but not sure of it's use for this?

 

[Croyzen]

Your total water needed is 8 gallons due to grain absorption. At 10 pounds of grain figure 1.25 gallons absorbed during mash in. So if you mash close to 1.25qt/lb you'll mash in at about 3 gallons. Let it rest for 60 minutes or what your recipe calls for then after the 60 minutes is up and before your drain your first runnings add 1.25 gallons of water at anywhere between 165-190F. If you want to raise the grain temp closer to the magic 168 mash out temp then add hotter water. I don't know that it matters. I then give this a quick stir maybe 30 seconds or so and let sit again for about five minutes and then vorlauf and drain. You should get about 3.25 gallons out for first runnings. Now measure what you actually got in the kettle. It should be close. I use a wooden stick marked in half gallons. Next add sparge water to get up to 6.5 gallons. In theory this is 3.25 gallons, there is no loss to grain absorption at this point.


Experimenting with the mash ratio, "mash out step", grain crush, and of course practice will all improve your efficiency. I would plan on 70% for your first batch and don't be surprised if its lower or higher. That's the fun!

Unless your tap water is bad I would suggest using that filtered with carbon and be sure there are no chlorine/chloramine in it. Campden will treat brewing water for chlorine/chloramine. It's used in much much smaller amounts than in wine making. Standard advice is 1 tablet per 20 gallons of water. So with 8 gallons I'd cut a little less than half of one, crush it up and add it accordingly to strike and sparge water as they are heating up and before the grain and water mix.

 

[wilserbrewer]

Ok your total water needed is 8 gallons, then strike with 4.5 and sparge 3.5, this will give you close to equal runnings.

If you want to be more precise, measure your first runnings, and make your sparge the needed amount to reach your pre boil volume.

Calculators are great! But it is also very easy to simply sparge to a needed volume.

Cheers!

 

[jrsdws]

Thanks for the help everyone. I'll come up with some sort of measuring stick and I see I'll have to be really precise with my note taking when I brew.

I've found a bunch of the calculators, but I'll admit, I was ignorant to what they were asking for in every field. I do appreciate the education.

 

[kymalt]

What is your intended volume into your fermenter? If you are shooting for 5-5.5 gallons you may need a little bigger boil than 6.5 gallons to account for shrinkage and hop trub left at the bottom of your boil kettle.

 

[SeeMont]

You have done your home work and I bet you have a list all printed out. Lot of good info on mash and volumns. After your first brew, you will know your boil loss. How are you weighing out you hops? I weigh out and put in plastic containers, easy organization. How are you going to chilling down? Transfer? Pitch, Hydrate? Good luck.

 

[jrsdws]

Hops are weighed out by LHBS and put in labeled bags. On my first 5 gallon partial mash I let it stand overnight to cool....so no chill I guess. Today I'm going to look into a wort chiller while in the store. I'll transfer with an autosiphon and reydrate Saflager 34/70 and pitch around 50F.

I'm still not sure on the chiller....I know it needs to happen but I'll have spent a fair amount on my brewing this week. I'm not sure how da boss will feel about another $60 or so.

 

[Campbell3074]

Maybe I've been doing it wrong but I've always sparged and laughtered at the same time. After I get the grain bed set I don't disturb it.


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[LowNotes]

Hops are weighed out by LHBS and put in labeled bags. On my first 5 gallon partial mash I let it stand overnight to cool....so no chill I guess. Today I'm going to look into a wort chiller while in the store. I'll transfer with an autosiphon and reydrate Saflager 34/70 and pitch around 50F.

I'm still not sure on the chiller....I know it needs to happen but I'll have spent a fair amount on my brewing this week. I'm not sure how da boss will feel about another $60 or so.

I do BIAB, so I can't comment on the mash process you are using, although it sounds like it should be good from all the comments.

For chilling, I know a lot of people do no-chill, so I imagine that would work. If you want an inexpensive option to chill it faster (which will give you a nice cold-break, and generally considered more important for all grain, but not essential), a water bath can work. If your sink is big enough, you can do it right in there, replacing the water as it warms up periodically. You can also add ice near the end to get it down those last 10-20* which can take awhile. Before I made an IC I would make extra ice in my freezer the night before, or if it was a cold night I would leave a bucket of water outside overnight (or just for a few hours if it is so cold it would freeze solid). If you don't have a big enough sink, you could use a big rubbermaid tub, or I guess even your bath tub if you protect it from possible damage from the heat/weight of the full kettle. A lot of deciding the best method comes down to how your house and brew area are setup. I brew in my kitchen so my sink water is right there, and my sink was luckily large enough to hold my 10g pot. If you are outside you would probably be better off with a rubbermaid tub and a hose, but again, it all depends on what you have to work with.

Good luck, going all-grain was the best decision I ever made in homebrewing!

Edit: You should also get some whirlfloc or irish moss. All grain results in a massive increase in the things that cloud your beer. Between whirlfloc, hot break and cold break you should get a pretty clear beer. I am starting to use gelatin finings too, but haven't tried the first beer I used them for yet.

 

[ScottG58]

Do an iodine test at the end of the sacharisation rest.

 

[tehnick]

Relax, don't worry. If this is your first venture into AG, don't get caught up in worrying about PH or other details. That comes later. Worry about getting your water ratios and temps dialed in first. Most modified grains these days will handle pH well without too much tinkering. Once you have that down, add a couple more steps. I don't preheat my cooler. I do other tests now like PH and iodine tests but I never used to and never had problems before. You have taste buds, so sample the wort to see if it gets sweet. If it does, yay, you have conversion. I do some things the lazy way and others the detailed way. It just depends on the brew at hand.

Your biggest concern should be sanitation and sterilization. That will make the most difference. Missing your mash temp by a few degrees or the target OG by a few points won't matter much. The beer will still be drinkable. It took me a few months to get dialed in and I am still making minor tweaks 3-4 years later. This hobby has lots of different ways of doing things and whatever works for you is what you should go with. It's easy for experienced AG brewers to rattle off what you should do, and they aren't wrong but you don't want to overwhelm yourself at first. Keep of simple, then grow from there. I went balls to the wall right out of the gate and learned the hard way.

Single malt and single hop beers are a great place to start and great for learning how the ingredients taste for figuring out what hops and grains you like the most.

 

[adixon3]

Everyones talking about sparging and water volume but no ones talking about PH the pH of the mash is very important for proper conversion of sugars during the mash and also due to its effect on finished beer. Mashing should always take place at a pH between 5.1 and 5.3. However, its important to note that we are talking about the pH of the mixed mash, which depends on the color and quantity of malts added to the beer. Because you didn't list the grain bill we have no idea of how to alter the water but in most cases the mixed mash will be slightly alkaline (pH above 5.3) and require an acidic addition or buffer to bring it down to 5.2. Since this is your first AG batch your LHBS may carry an additive called 5.2 stabilizer. This is a powder you can add to the mash to lower the mash pH to 5.2. It consists of buffers that reduce the alkalinity of the mash to reach a 5.2 level. As long as your starting water is not completely out of kilter, this is a good simple solution for many homebrewers.

 

[adixon3]

Everyones talking about sparging and water volume but no ones talking about PH the pH of the mash is very important for proper conversion of sugars during the mash and also due to its effect on finished beer. Mashing should always take place at a pH between 5.1 and 5.3. However, its important to note that we are talking about the pH of the mixed mash, which depends on the color and quantity of malts added to the beer. Because you didn't list the grain bill we have no idea of how to alter the water but in most cases the mixed mash will be slightly alkaline (pH above 5.3) and require an acidic addition or buffer to bring it down to 5.2. Since this is your first AG batch your LHBS may carry an additive called 5.2 stabilizer. This is a powder you can add to the mash to lower the mash pH to 5.2. It consists of buffers that reduce the alkalinity of the mash to reach a 5.2 level. As long as your starting water is not completely out of kilter, this is a good simple solution for many homebrewers.

Your right tehnick but this is just a simple solution for him for right now to help him with efficiency after some time 5.2 Stabilizer may not do the job.

 

[jrsdws]

Okay so after doing some measuring to see what my tun dead space is and my kettle volume per inch, I started my first ever batch of all grain!!

This ended up being a California Common with a 9.5lb grain bill. I brought 4.75 gallons of water to 166F and poured it into my tun. Then steadily stirred while slowly pouring the grain in. We stirred for another minute or so and added the thermometer and put the lid on. After 5 minutes it was still 160F. After another 5 minutes it was still 160F. I poured in a quart of cold water 50ish degrees and stirred. After another 5 minutes I was sitting right on my desired 152F mash in temperature.

Do I start my 60 minute rest time from the first time I put the lid on or from when I got it to 152F?

Hopefully somebody sees this soon. If not I'm going to let it rest for a full 60 minutes after getting to 152F. It doesn't seem like it should hurt anything and perhaps only make for a better conversion?

 

[bpnc9702]

Okay so after doing some measuring to see what my tun dead space is and my kettle volume per inch, I started my first ever batch of all grain!!

This ended up being a California Common with a 9.5lb grain bill. I brought 4.75 gallons of water to 166F and poured it into my tun. Then steadily stirred while slowly pouring the grain in. We stirred for another minute or so and added the thermometer and put the lid on. After 5 minutes it was still 160F. After another 5 minutes it was still 160F. I poured in a quart of cold water 50ish degrees and stirred. After another 5 minutes I was sitting right on my desired 152F mash in temperature.

Do I start my 60 minute rest time from the first time I put the lid on or from when I got it to 152F?

Hopefully somebody sees this soon. If not I'm going to let it rest for a full 60 minutes after getting to 152F. It doesn't seem like it should hurt anything and perhaps only make for a better conversion?

Thought I would chime in just in case someone doesnt within the time you are doing your mash - I recently went to all-grain, I think I'm in my 3rd brew. I have tried a slightly different process each time but its a modified BIAB. That being said, with your time (60 mins when to start the clock), I dont think it really matters. Start it when you started the process. From my knowledge that seems all around the starch conversion process. I've read where some folks say they can get the conversion process in less time, use the iodine test and that will tell you if the starches have converted to sugars (changes to black in starch present, maintains tinted red if not, do this in a separate plate and dispose afterwards). I'll tell you that the all-grain process takes a few to get under your belt and it seems that we all end up creating a process that works for us. Honestly, my first two all grains had 60 min mash, I got distracted and lost track of time, one I know went 90 mins. Came out fine. My hardest part was getting the water quantity down (considering boil off etc & getting the correct gravities) but you will find that you get the hang of this after your first brew or two.

 

[tehnick]

Okay so after doing some measuring to see what my tun dead space is and my kettle volume per inch, I started my first ever batch of all grain!!

This ended up being a California Common with a 9.5lb grain bill. I brought 4.75 gallons of water to 166F and poured it into my tun. Then steadily stirred while slowly pouring the grain in. We stirred for another minute or so and added the thermometer and put the lid on. After 5 minutes it was still 160F. After another 5 minutes it was still 160F. I poured in a quart of cold water 50ish degrees and stirred. After another 5 minutes I was sitting right on my desired 152F mash in temperature.

Do I start my 60 minute rest time from the first time I put the lid on or from when I got it to 152F?

Hopefully somebody sees this soon. If not I'm going to let it rest for a full 60 minutes after getting to 152F. It doesn't seem like it should hurt anything and perhaps only make for a better conversion?

As I posted earlier, this is why I said not to worry about all the BS others have posted in terms of pH, etc. Gotta get basics dialed in first and add another step to the mix later.

If you plugged your equipment into a website and it gave you those values, next time try water a little cooler in the strike. I use beersmith and I find when I tell it to adjust temperature for equipment I end up mashing a lot higher in temp and getting the wrong body profile.

I use a 10 gal round cooler for my tun and found if I leave that option unchecked I get my strike in range. Last beer I brewed I mashed in at 156 and in the time it took to stir the mash and get the lid on, I was down to 148-149 and only lost 1 degree in a 90 min mash. Ambient temp was 45-47ish. The beer before that was supposed to be a medium body at 152ish but beersmith jacked me with its recommendation for temp at 166.7 degrees. Sound familiar? It put me at 160-162 for mash and I had issues getting the temp in range. The beer was still drinkable, just a bit more sweet and malty from the unfermentable sugars.

This won't help now, but man, it takes time and you'll still make mistakes on occasion. The beer will still usually be drinkable unless you get an infection. Sanitation is key. A lot easier to swallow beer that isn't what you hoped than watching gallons dump down the sink.

 

[jrsdws]

Sounds familiar indeed!! I am also using a 10 gal round cooler and I am impressed at how well it held it's temperature.

I'll be doing batch #2 late this afternoon/early this evening and the grain bill is the same weight and Sacch' rest goal is 152F again so I'm going to try strike temp of about 158 to 160F.

The first batch ended up with a starting gravity of 1.044. The goal was 1.047. The first lautering gave me a darker sweet wort. The sparge was way way lighter in color and not nearly as sweet tasting. The color looks good after combining and boiling. Hopefully the slightly lower gravity means I didn't make it too sweet. Either way I'm sure it'll be good and drinkable.....I hope.

 

[tehnick]

Sounds like you still got a decent extract. The sparge after draining first runnings will always be lighter and less sweet. Did you check gravity of the second runnings to see how much sugar was left behind? A few points off isn't too big of a deal. The gravity you got is less sweet than target and when you boil you increase the gravity a bit. Is that your gravity post boil or pre boil?

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[Dmanshane]

What is your intended volume into your fermenter? If you are shooting for 5-5.5 gallons you may need a little bigger boil than 6.5 gallons to account for shrinkage and hop trub left at the bottom of your boil kettle.

I currently do full boil extracts, I start out with about 6.25 gallon of water. then you have to take into effect my lme im adding which is normally .5 gallon if I get it from northernbrewer.com so 6.75 gallon of worn, then I do a 2000ml yeast starter, I dump that in my carboy first then do my transfer, right when the carboy gets to the 6 gallon mark the brew kettle runs out of wort minus the hops and junk in the bottom below the bulkhead fitting, when I go to keg I am able to fill a 5 gallon keg full and have about an 1/16 inch layer of beer above trube leval. by doing it this way I have minimized floaties and had amazing clear beer with out any clarifier, today I brewed a irish red ale and used wirlfloc for the first time, I will see what my clarities are like in about weeks. theres my ideas on boil volume

 

[jrsdws]

Sounds like you still got a decent extract. The sparge after draining first runnings will always be lighter and less sweet. Did you check gravity of the second runnings to see how much sugar was left behind? A few points off isn't too big of a deal. The gravity you got is less sweet than target and when you boil you increase the gravity a bit. Is that your gravity post boil or pre boil?

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I didn't think to check gravity of each running separately. My 1.044 reading was post boil. I think it'll turn out okay.

My buddy and I ran the wheat beer batch tonight. With the same amount of grain, I lowered strike water temp to 158. At the end of the 60 minute rest it was still 155. Sparged with 185 degree water for 15 minutes and barely made 1.042 gravity. The target was 1.049. I did end up with more pre-boil wort so that could be why. Maybe the different grain has different absorption and conversion also?

 

[tehnick]

I didn't think to check gravity of each running separately. My 1.044 reading was post boil. I think it'll turn out okay.

My buddy and I ran the wheat beer batch tonight. With the same amount of grain, I lowered strike water temp to 158. At the end of the 60 minute rest it was still 155. Sparged with 185 degree water for 15 minutes and barely made 1.042 gravity. The target was 1.049. I did end up with more pre-boil wort so that could be why. Maybe the different grain has different absorption and conversion also?

Take notes on what you get number wise, keep a brew diary. That will help you dial in. FWIW, I leave the lid off until it drops to about a degree above target mash temp and then I seal the tun. It should keep heat well. Part of the reason I don't preheat the cooler is so it absorbs that extra heat.

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[jrsdws]

Thanks for the great tips. I've started my brew diary on these two batches and know it will help a lot. I made significant changes just between my two batches yesterday and I think we'll get 10 gallons of decent beer. The best is yet to come.