engineering or physics? i hate math =(

[zbeeblebrox]

I'm sitting here, drinking my ESB, and looking into transferring into a college for my degree. problem is I'm still not sure what major i want to do. engineering and physics are the two i am debating between. you see i love building stuff, was in high school construction club, and i have always loved science and theory(i have read physics books on my own time), so both are very interesting to me. either way i go i will have to do the same amount math. there is a lot of math, as i am sure some of you know, but its all so damned tedious. not really hard, but just annoying. has anyone else ever had this problem? not really the physics engineering thing but you all know what i mean.

 

[Professor Frink]

If you hate math, I'd have to go with neither. But if you can tough it out and you like building stuff, maybe civil engineering.

 

[zbeeblebrox]

well like i said its not that i really hate it. its just tedious. so i can stick it out no problem.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

I don't hate Math but, I never gave it time in HS. So, now that I am 35 and pursuing a Physics-Acoustics Discipline degree I have to go back to the beginning and learn it all. Logarithms Ugggg.

 

[Two Minutes]

Go with physics; Do you know hedge fund companies are hiring physics grads to mine data for new ideas?

The key is Big time math (not biz math) and finance. You'll pull 6 figures within 5 years of graduation; unless you're ambitious and go the home grown route -- in which case the sky is the limit.

 

[Judd]

If it was me, I'd go with engineering. My roommate's in physics, and he just does calculus and labs all day, never gets to build anything.

What about architecture?

 

[Fingers]

(i have read physics books on my own time),

but its all so damned tedious. not really hard, but just annoying.

What kind of physics books were you reading? All the ones I've looked at are full of pretty much nothing but math.

 

[Two Minutes]

If it was me, I'd go with engineering. My roommate's in physics, and he just does calculus and labs all day, never gets to build anything.

see, that's the thing. With physics and math you do math all the time in college, but once you're out its your analytical abilities that companies want. Rarely will you apply math other than as a tool in analysis.

My engineering friends are all building stuff like robot helicopters and next gen battleships -- but they don't get to use their creativity. Every thing they do is tried and true.

Can you tell the path I took? I'm only a little biased...

 

[Judd]

see, that's the thing. With physics and math you do math all the time in college, but once you're out its your analytical abilities that companies want. Rarely will you apply math other than as a tool in analysis.

My engineering friends are all building stuff like robot helicopters and next gen battleships -- but they don't get to use their creativity. Every thing they do is tried and true.

Can you tell the path I took? I'm only a little biased...

Cool! I want to be an engineer. Screw Early Modern Studies (my current field). I wonder if I can transfer...

 

[Ryanh1801]

If you hate math that much you can do a MET, degree. They only have to go through cal. 2.

 

[Thirdeye]

Im four years into a physics phd. If you wanna really understand all those equations that most engineers simply just use, or more likely, just type into their design software, then go physics. Only problem with physics is that you really need a phd to be marketable and respected by your peers. With an engineering degree, youre fairly marketable with your BS, especially if you did an internship while you were in school. Speaking from experience, as I changed my undergrad degree to physics after putting in three years as a Chem E with an internship at ExxonMobil. The work/school just wasnt satisfying enough.

But yeah, like you said, the math is pretty much just tedious. If you can tough it out you eventually learn that physics is about the physics, not the math. Math is just a tool we use. Its very gratifying to me. And when I finish my phd, I will have a fairly decent chance of getting a pretty good job.

 

[zbeeblebrox]

whichever route i go i want to get more then the 4 year. also i would like to do an internship somewhere and i know you can get them for engineering but are there any out there for physics.
and Fingers when you don't know the math its good to find books that just explain the theory.

boy i sure wish i had thought this far ahead while i was still in high school.

 

[zoebisch01]

I have both a degree in EE and Physics. And I hated math. Actually when I went to speak to an advisor he told me "Don't become and Engineer". What happened to me was rather interesting. My love of Physics drove me to want to learn Mathematics. Mathematics is the language of Physics (and many other things ) and I crossed through a point where I needed the Math to explain to me what the Physics was saying. You'll see this especially in things like Electromagnetic Wave Theory or Thermodynamics where some things just don't make sense otherwise. You can grasp an idea, but without the Mathematics you really can't do much with it.

Oh sorry, forgot to add....if you want to research the frontiers of theory, go Physics. If you want to use your life to build/design things go Engineering. Not saying that you can't cross over from one to another. I know people who have gotten Engineering jobs, and they have a Physics degree and I have a job where I use both aspects really. I prefer Physics, and I think if I ever returned to study more, it would probably be something like Quantum Physics or Particle Physics, etc.

 

[njnear76]

I'm a computer engineer myself, which is a hybrid Electrical Engineering/Computer Science degree. It's pretty awesome and honorable work. It pays well to boot.

I think you can't go wrong with Physics or Engineering. Like Zoebisch01 said, there is overlap. Engineering is a bit more practical while Physics is a bit more research based. Both are fun. You should decide by the type of person that you think you are.

I hate the fact that many people are scared away by these fields because of the math (I know your not). I was pretty much a B student throughout high school and I was able to get a Masters Degree.

 

[Beerthoven]

I have graduate degrees in applied mathematics and economics. If you don't like math then engineering or physics would be poor choices for you. Mathematics is the language of those disciplines and if you don't want to speak it then you'll evenutally start to hate your choice.

I say you should study statistics. Its super applied and the math is not that hard.

Or become a carpenter. You still get to build stuff but don't have to do any math at all.

 

[njnear76]

I have graduate degrees in applied mathematics and economics. If you don't like math then engineering or physics would be poor choices for you. Mathematics is the language of those disciplines and if you don't want to speak it then you'll evenutally start to hate your choice.

I say you should study statistics. Its super applied and the math is not that hard.

Or become a carpenter. You still get to build stuff but don't have to do any math at all.

Shrug. I don't agree. It depends on what you are interested doing. Not every job requires a daily usage of Calculus. Most likely you will never use it at a job.

For example, you could write complex algorithms for video processing chip on a video card. There you might need to understand and use complex math.

I've never had to use Calculus for the stuff that I've coded, which ranged from microcontrollers to embedded linux drivers to SQL code.

 

[jbford]

If you don't see calculus and Dif E as basic math, then stay away from physics

 

[iamjonsharp]

Civil Engineering! As long as its not structural Engineering!

I haven't done any calculus since college.

 

[zoebisch01]

While there is no getting around the fact that you will use the Math (especially when you are learning the fundamentals of either Physics or Engineering) I have to contest the idea of not venturing down the path if you don't like it. In my case, as I mentioned, it was more of learning to appreciate Mathematics. I think I never really saw the application at the time I was learning it in High School. I have grown to appreciate and even enjoy working out complex equations because they tell me things that I cannot understand any other way.

If your heart is seeking to understand the mysteries around us, I'd say don't let anything stop you. I believe in your case, it sounds like you are capable of learning the Math, so I would not let that hinder you. If you are incapable of learning the Math then I would say venture elsewhere. I won't lie to you, there are some courses that are going to bend your mind and stretch you to the limit.

 

[Brewing Clamper]

If you really don't like math, go for a history degree... but you'll probably end up in the same job you have now...

 

[mrkristofo]

[soapbox]

I'm just going to put this out there...but I'm quite fond of chemistry myself. You can take it from the abstract/theoretical perspective like physics and do physical/computational chemistry...or you can do the engineering side with materials chemistry....or you can do the biological side with biochemistry...or any multitude of other things in-between.

The math's not bad either: 3 semesters of calc, 1 semester dif e, 1 semester linear algebra.


[/soapbox]

 

[Beerthoven]

OK, you guys do have a point. Much of what gets taught in school isn't used daily in the workplace. So a math-intensive curriculum doesn't necessarily mean a math-intensive job. And a joyous love of math shouldn't be a requirement for pursuing a technical career. I know some fantastic economists who wouldn't know a derivative if one ran them over in the parking lot.

Still, I think the OP needs to objectively weigh how much he dislikes math and take that into consideration. A serious math aversion could limit his success in school, which would then limit his job choices later on down the road.

Saying you don't like math but want to be a physicist or engineer is a bit like saying the sight of blood makes you faint but you want to be a nurse. If that's the case, then you either have to get over it or make choices in nursing that limit your exposure to blood. Same thing here.

 

[zoebisch01]

Saying you don't like math but want to be a physicist or engineer is a bit like saying the sight of blood makes you faint but you want to be a nurse. If that's the case, then you either have to get over it or make choices in nursing that limit your exposure to blood. Same thing here.

I guess I am the exception . I really had a strong aversion to Math, but in my case I grew to appreciate it because of my love of Physics. The Engineering application is quite a bit more dry though.

I do use advanced Mathematics quite often in my work, but I think I use the principles of Physics more.

 

[Beerthoven]

I guess I am the exception . I really had a strong aversion to Math, but in my case I grew to appreciate it because of my love of Physics. The Engineering application is quite a bit more dry though.

I do use advanced Mathematics quite often in my work, but I think I use the principles of Physics more.

I think your story should be an inspiration to the OP.

Several people in my graduate math department left for other disciplines (like engineering and economics) because they realized they wanted to use mathematics as a tool, not be a mathematician. I'm one of 'em.

 

[zbeeblebrox]

wow great info guys. i never really had a problem learning math it was always just tedious. unfortunately i didn't take enough math in high school so i am one class behind calculus. but next semester i will be taking calc1. what really annoys me about my community college is that fact that the one engineering class here has a long list of pre- requisites where as the first physics class has no pre-requisites.

 

[zoebisch01]

wow great info guys. i never really had a problem learning math it was always just tedious. unfortunately i didn't take enough math in high school so i am one class behind calculus.

Hehe, that was the situation I was in precisely. Calculus is actually very cool Math. Anyways, DO NOT take a non Calculus based Physics course. Most Universities/Colleges will require you to take it, so you will be wasting your time. I would also suggest not taking them concurrently. Get well ramped up on the Calculus prior to taking the Physics.

 

[njnear76]

Hehe, that was the situation I was in precisely. Calculus is actually very cool Math. Anyways, DO NOT take a non Calculus based Physics course. Most Universities/Colleges will require you to take it, so you will be wasting your time. I would also suggest not taking them concurrently. Get well ramped up on the Calculus prior to taking the Physics.

He's absolutely right. If you are going to be a physicist or engineer you have to take ones slotted for Engineers and Scientists.

I really enjoyed Calculus, but it was a bit of a struggle for me at times. Calclulus one I almost bombed. Calculus 2 and 4 I got 4.0s. Calculus 3 was a struggle.

When you take these courses make sure that you go to a mathematics help room. It is worth it to ask for help if you need it.

I think you will find that your success in school is completely based on your work ethic and your willingness to seek help when you need it.

Even the smart kids get help from time to time. Actually they are probably the ones making office hours.

 

[njnear76]

Civil Engineering! As long as its not structural Engineering!

I haven't done any calculus since college.

Awww.. crap. Are we supposed to be pimping our disclipines? Computer Engineering* all the way!!! :rockin:

Note: Computer Engineering will not help you get laid in college. There are very few hot girls in the Electrical Engineering and Computer Science programs. Besides there is very little time after studying. Time which would be better spent drinking. Computer Engineering might help you get laid after college.

 

[zoebisch01]

Note: Computer Engineering will not help you get laid in college. There are very few hot girls in the Electrical Engineering and Computer Science programs. Besides there is very little time after studying. Time which would be better spent drinking. Computer Engineering might help you get laid after college.

LAWL. Tis' true (not that it was my goal, I was already married by the time I started back to school )...but basically ALL of your time will be spent studying and doing homework. Even the people who just have a tremendous mind for Math, etc, will still have to put the time in for homework. You will have very little spare time if you want to do well. It is a very rigorous curriculum.

 

[uwjester]

I read something along these lines somewhere. Funny but true.

In college they label all of the majors wrong.
Biology is really chemistry.
Chemistry is really physics.
Physics is really mathematics.

I ended up going the engineering route which really just steals the big ideas from the above disciplines and tries to make them profitable.

 

[skeeordye11]

I don't mean to hijack, but reading this thread gets me thinking again about persuing a career change. I was good in math and physics back in the day, although it was the non-calc based physics as stated by a previous poster, but I did very well in calc 1 in college. I've looked into it a bit and I think it would take 3 years to get an engineering degree, but maybe longer since it was suggested to beef up on the calc before beginning the physics. I'm already freaking broke though, so I don't know how I would do it, or if I'd be able to work and go to school and study. Guess I just need to **** or get off the pot and quit thinking about it...

 

[david_42]

Why chose? Cornell's Engineering Physics program was ridiculously difficult, but really interesting. Mainly aimed at people who were planning to go into the research end and need to know how to build stuff.

 

[Philip1993]

If it was me, I'd go with engineering. My roommate's in physics, and he just does calculus and labs all day, never gets to build anything.

I would concur with that. My degree is in physics.

And if you're a math hater, the previous poster is right. Avoid either. A physicist/engineers first language is math and their second is english..

 

[Two Minutes]

I'm sticking with the physics recommendation. Physics will help you learn to analyze; and great analytical skills is what's going to land you a good job or prepare you for your own entity. Eventually, companies won't care what the specialty says on the piece of paper, they will however respect that you know how to approach and solve problems.

Someone on this thread mentioned they can always go back to a book to refresh their memory on a particular formula. That is dead on. If you know the theory, its easy to find the right math tool. If you only know how to apply, you'll be lost unless someone tells you which formula to use.

I also suggest you keep one foot in finance and economics. The big money is made analyzing in financial industry.

 

[njnear76]

I don't mean to hijack, but reading this thread gets me thinking again about persuing a career change. I was good in math and physics back in the day, although it was the non-calc based physics as stated by a previous poster, but I did very well in calc 1 in college. I've looked into it a bit and I think it would take 3 years to get an engineering degree, but maybe longer since it was suggested to beef up on the calc before beginning the physics. I'm already freaking broke though, so I don't know how I would do it, or if I'd be able to work and go to school and study. Guess I just need to **** or get off the pot and quit thinking about it...

I know a guy who didn't even complete high school who got his GRE and then went on to get a bachelors in Physics. Anything is possible if you put your mind to it. Only the haters will tell you different.

Getting money can be a b*tch though. It's a shame that Uncle Sam can't provide more funding for the sciences. This country has a shortage of engineers, scientist, and mathematicians (No offense to the great guys and girls from around the world that I have had the pleasure of working with in the field.). That is going to hurt us in the future big time.

My solution would be either low interest loans for those fields or the government pays half or more based on the grades that you receive.

 

[Two Minutes]

Note: Computer Engineering will not help you get laid in college. There are very few hot girls in the Electrical Engineering and Computer Science programs. Besides there is very little time after studying. Time which would be better spent drinking. Computer Engineering might help you get laid after college.

Here here. Thoiugh I did get the last laugh with my cool, girl-a-week touting, partying engineering friends -- years later I make more than double them, and their work still keeps them late while I'm home everyday by 6 to my beautiful, hot wife. (whom, defying all odds btw, was one of three girls in my comp sci department. So not only is she hot, she's rich.)

 

[Philip1993]

I'm sticking with the physics recommendation. Physics will help you learn to analyze; and great analytical skills is what's going to land you a good job or prepare you for your own entity. Eventually, companies won't care what the specialty says on the piece of paper, they will however respect that you know how to approach and solve problems.

Very true. I'm in IT and get paid very well to analyze and solve problems that stump other IT people. Physics *certainly* pounds system/problem analysis skills into your head....

 

[njnear76]

I'm sticking with the physics recommendation. Physics will help you learn to analyze; and great analytical skills is what's going to land you a good job or prepare you for your own entity. Eventually, companies won't care what the specialty says on the piece of paper, they will however respect that you know how to approach and solve problems.

Someone on this thread mentioned they can always go back to a book to refresh their memory on a particular formula. That is dead on. If you know the theory, its easy to find the right math tool. If you only know how to apply, you'll be lost unless someone tells you which formula to use.

I also suggest you keep one foot in finance and economics. The big money is made analyzing in financial industry.

Wow. Lots of misinformaiton about my field. You have to do analysis and solve problems in engineering as well unless you want to fail. I think the skills are transferable to many areas.

It's true that physics is a bit more theoretical than engineering, but it's not like an engineer is incapable of doing the same work as a physicist and vice-versa. Hell, when there was an engineering shortage in the 70s I heard that some business people were doing engineering and research work.

 

[njnear76]

Here here. Thoiugh I did get the last laugh with my cool, girl-a-week touting, partying engineering friends -- years later I make more than double them, and their work still keeps them late while I'm home everyday by 6 to my beautiful, hot wife. (whom, defying all odds btw, was one of three girls in my comp sci department. So not only is she hot, she's rich.)

Yeah. There were a few more women in the Computer Science department. The pickings were slim on the Engineering side. I think there was one girl who looked like the girl in the Smashing Pumpkins. Kind of hot, but by that time most of us lost our skills to even converse with women. I wasn't immune. No matter, I still ended up happily married.

 

[njnear76]

Crap. Why does homebrewtalk sometimes double post? Shrug.