ECY04 or Funk Weapon #2 for Primary

[nadeaunm5]

I have a bottle of ECY 04 (brett anomala) and a pack of Bootleg Biology Funk Weapon #2 sitting in my fridge that i want to make a Brett IIPA around 8 abv with Nelson/Vic Secret/Wai-ti/Citra.

I want a real fruit bomb with some brett funk

Does any one have any experience with using either of these for primary fermentation?

Im trying to figure out how much attenuation I can expect and aroma/flavor profiles from either. Would probably leave in Primary for 3 weeks and keg it.

I may just add both and see what happens

 

[Agate]

Definitely the funk weapon #2. Anomala really shines in secondary, but funk weapon 2 is insane fruity/juicy. Mash high and you should end up with some residual sugars... the last one I did was mashed at 158°F and it ended up at 1.008. Fantastic with galaxy.

 

[505-Brewer]

I did a rye saison with Anomala. Pretty mild some fruit some brett but not super fruity. I think it would go great in IIPA but on its own I thought it was mild and versatile. Def can tell its Brett. Would love to hear more about Anomala in secondary.

Can u split a batch and do both to compare?

 

[nadeaunm5]

I think I might actually do the split batch. Brew an 8 gallon batch and split them.

I'm doing a big starter for the FW#2 tonight and going to let it ferment out for a few weeks. Not going to use my stir plate to try and limit any acid production.

I didn't think it would get down to 1.008 at that high of a mash temp. Good thing I asked, i was going to go around 148-150.

I also have Funk Weapon #3 and Dirty Dozen, but was going to use those for a split batch saison in the secondary.

Ill keep adding to this thread when I start to brew it.

 

[505-Brewer]

Curious if you've brewed it yet........FW#2 sounds really interesting.

 

[nadeaunm5]

Curious if you've brewed it yet........FW#2 sounds really interesting.

I Brewed it on Monday. Built a 1.25l starter for the FW#2 (200b cells in packet) with no stir-plate and let it ride for 2 weeks.

I ended up pitching the entire starter and the full bottle of ECY04. The FW#2 had incredible strawberry aroma and the ECY#4 (300b cells in bottle) had some good brett funk aromatics. I thought those two would play well together.

I think I pitched around Lager rates if you calculate out the starter and the bottle of ECY04.

For some reason im seeing no activity in my carboy after 36hrs. So im not sure whats happening. Ill rouse it a little bit give it a few days to see it it takes off.

 

[Agate]

Last time I used fw2, I didn't have krausen until day 5. Very slight pellicle after 36 hours. Brett tests your patience...

 

[505-Brewer]

That sounds awesome. Please do keep us updated. I have some dirty dozen I need to get going. Thinking maybe in a NE style Pale ale or a saison. FW sounds rad.

 

[nadeaunm5]

That sounds awesome. Please do keep us updated. I have some dirty dozen I need to get going. Thinking maybe in a NE style Pale ale or a saison. FW sounds rad.

Will do, I also have some dirty Dozens that im going to co-pitch with the ECY08 Saison Brasserie. Thats going to be one interesting beer with extended aging.

From the smell of the FW#2 Starter I feel this would be an amazing beer with Huell Melon and Belma hops to really push the starwberry notes.

But this was the recipe i used for this IPA, the water profile is based off the NEIPA thread.

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 9.32 gal
Post Boil Volume: 8.07 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 6.50 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.90 gal
Estimated OG: 1.076 SG
Estimated Color: 4.7 SRM
Estimated IBU: 63.2 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 69.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 82.3 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU

15 lbs 10.6 oz Pale Malt, 2-Row (Rahr) (1.8 SRM) Grain 2 80.6 %
14.5 oz Munich I (Weyermann) (7.1 SRM) Grain 3 4.7 %
14.5 oz Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM) Grain 4 4.7 %
12.0 oz Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 5 3.9 %
9.6 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 6 3.1 %
9.6 oz Oats, Flaked (1.0 SRM) Grain 7 3.1 %
1.00 oz Citra [15.00 %] - First Wort 60.0 min Hop 8 36.6 IBUs
0.75 Items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 mins) Fining 9 -
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 15.0 mins) Other 10 -
1.00 oz Citra [15.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 m Hop 11 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Citra [15.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 Hop 12 8.1 IBUs
1.00 oz Galaxy [16.10 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 Hop 13 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Galaxy [13.90 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 Hop 14 7.5 IBUs
1.00 oz Vic Secret [17.90 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 15 9.7 IBUs
1.00 oz Vic Secret [15.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool Hop 16 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Wai-iti [2.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 Hop 17 1.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Wai-iti [2.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 Hop 18 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Brettanomyces Anomala (East Cosat Yeast Yeast 19 -
1.00 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 10.0 Days Hop 20 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Galaxy [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 10.0 Days Hop 21 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Vic Secret [15.50 %] - Dry Hop 10.0 Days Hop 22 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Wai-iti [3.00 %] - Dry Hop 10.0 Days Hop 23 0.0 IBUs
2.50 oz Vic Secret [15.50 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 24 0.0 IBUs
1.50 oz Wai-iti [3.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 25 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Galaxy [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 26 0.0 IBUs


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 19 lbs 6.8 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash In Add 25.28 qt of water at 167.8 F 152.0 F 60 min

Sparge: Batch sparge with 2 steps (Drain mash tun , 5.58gal) of 168.0 F water
Notes:
------
12/19/16- Bootleg Biology Funk Weapon #2 cell count 200b Batch 116 Packaged 11/10/16-
1.25 liter starter in a 64oz growler, no stir plate to try and limit acid production

PLAN-
Whirlpool hops at 2 additions.

Water Profile using Brun' Water Spreadsheet
Calcium 94ppm
Magnesium 13ppm
Sodium 28ppm
Sulfate 71ppm
Chloride 135ppm
Bicarbonate 70ppm
Totla Hardness 289
Alkalnity 58

FLAME OUT PROCESS
1) at flameout add first hops batch, whirlpool for 15min. Then start Immersion chiller and cool to 180deg
2) Add second set of hops and whirlpool for 45min, start chiller last 10min.
3)Chill to pitching temp (~65deg), pull chiller whirlpool for another 10min.
4) drain into carboy

 

[drgonzo2k2]

I just kegged a NEPA that I did with FW# 2 and all Galaxy hops yesterday. It smelled amazing, can't wait to taste it!

I've also done a Brett IPA with the ECY04 and a combo of Galaxy and Kohatu that was one of my favorite beers so far.

 

[nadeaunm5]

I just kegged a NEPA that I did with FW# 2 and all Galaxy hops yesterday. It smelled amazing, can't wait to taste it!

I've also done a Brett IPA with the ECY04 and a combo of Galaxy and Kohatu that was one of my favorite beers so far.

Did it also take awhile before fermentation started? Im 3 days out now but i seem to seem the starter I did acted the same way.

 

[drgonzo2k2]

Did it also take awhile before fermentation started? Im 3 days out now but i seem to seem the starter I did acted the same way.

Here is my fermentation graph for that beer:

You can ignore the part where it seemed to get stuck around the 1.02 range (some gunk got stuck to the probe and threw off the measurements).

It took almost exactly 3 days at 68F for active fermentation to start. That was a 2L starter that spent 7 days on the stir plate on low. Once I ramped it up to 75F though it took off pretty quickly.

I did 5 days at 68F followed by 7 days at 75F, then a 2 day dry hop at 65F, followed by a 2 day cold crash at 33F prior to kegging.

The starter behaved much the same way - not really anything for the first couple of days then a huge krausen.

 

[nadeaunm5]

What are you using for to produce that chart?

 

[drgonzo2k2]

What are you using for to produce that chart?

A Tilt Hydrometer, connected via Bluetooth to an old iPad, that logs to a Google sheet, that I use to generate the graphs and gauges on my website in my signature.

Currently those are empty on my website as I don't have anything fermenting

 

[nadeaunm5]

We have lift off...fermentation kicked off around 3.5 days

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[drgonzo2k2]

Drinking the Funk Weapon #2 and Galaxy now. You will not be disappointed. Juicy fruit bomb.

I've also got a Funk Weapon #1 and Medusa on tap. It's interesting, basically tastes and smells like dank weed.

Both are the same grain bills - about 80% Golden Promise and 20% flaked oats.

Of the 3 100% Brett pale ales/IPAs I've done so far ECY04 and Galaxy/Kohatu is still my favorite.

 

[505-Brewer]

Curious. Can you describe why you prefer the Brett anamola over the Funk Weapon#2? Less..... just fruit with more funk?

 

[drgonzo2k2]

If it makes sense I guess the ECY04 just had more of a fuller, rounder juiciness to it, and I didn't really pick up any funk with it. The FW #2 beer seems to hit you up front with the juiciness, but then it fades a bit as it reaches the back of your mouth. It also has just a very slight funk to it.

Both seem to be good yeasts that I'd recommend for this style of beer though.

To be fair it was a different grain and hops bill for the two beers, so it may be more than just the yeast at play here.

Side note - the ECY04 also did much better at lower temps and finished faster than FW #2. That beer was 5 days @ 68F, followed by 2 days @75F, then a 2 day dry hop @ 65F, and then a 2 day cold crash at 33F prior to kegging.

Those extra days can add up when you're trying to keep a pipeline going.

Still the absolute best yeast I've used for these types of styles is the Conan/WLP644 genetic hybrid, F1 variant, out of Finland.

I did the Ales of the Riverwards Hop Hands clone, using that yeast and substituting Mosaic for Simcoe and was in NEPA heaven!

 

[505-Brewer]

Thank you. Useful notes. I'll add these to my list to brew. Was thinking of trying them in saison split but maybe NEPA it needs to be!

 

[drgonzo2k2]

One thing to note is that I think you would get a different taste profile if you treated the yeast differently, for example, leaving it in the fermenter for much longer than a couple of weeks.

Here we're treating brett pretty much like sach, and I think that leads to different flavors than you'd get if you let it go longer, used it in secondary, etc.

 

[nadeaunm5]

One thing to note is that I think you would get a different taste profile if you treated the yeast differently, for example, leaving it in the fermenter for much longer than a couple of weeks.

Here we're treating brett pretty much like sach, and I think that leads to different flavors than you'd get if you let it go longer, used it in secondary, etc.

Im planning on letting it go around 21 days. 1st dry hop at 10days and second at 16 days. Cold crash last two days and try and harvest a few mason jars of slurry for use next time.

I might skip my usual keg hop in the kegerator so I dont over power the brett aromatics.

 

[nadeaunm5]

I took a sample last night, and I am getting some plastic/band-aid smell and taste. Anyone else get this with either of thee two strands? If so did it fade after an amount of time?

Im fermenting pretty stable at 68degF with a temp controller.

Of all the sours and brett beers I have done, I have never got the "band-aid" smell that I have read about.

I had high hopes for this brew.

 

[505-Brewer]

My rye saison with ECY04 smelled like a freshly opened can of tennis balls near the end of fermentation but it cleaned up nicely. Not sure on the band aid though.

 

[nadeaunm5]

My rye saison with ECY04 smelled like a freshly opened can of tennis balls near the end of fermentation but it cleaned up nicely. Not sure on the band aid though.

How long did it take to clean up? I was hoping to keg this is a few weeks. But i'm going to let it sit if i still pick up on these

 

[secondbase]

I've gotten bandaid/plastic with really hoppy brett beers before. It can come from underpitching, high temps and I've read on MTF that brett can transform some hop oils into the compound responsible for those flavors. Someone else can do a better job at describing this.

 

[nadeaunm5]

I've gotten bandaid/plastic with really hoppy brett beers before. It can come from underpitching, high temps and I've read on MTF that brett can transform some hop oils into the compound responsible for those flavors. Someone else can do a better job at describing this.

Yeah I've read that it can make them unique compounds. I go on milk the funk quite a bit and look around. good material on there.

What did you end up doing with those beers that you had the Band-Aid smell did you wait it out?

 

[drgonzo2k2]

If you're getting a plastic/band-aid smell and taste in your hoppy brett beers, it's likely the result of one of two things:

1 - Chlorine/Chloramine in your water. Perhaps you forgot to treat it or something has recently changed with your water supply

2 - Too many hops in the boil kettle. When you boil vegetal matter it creates caffeic acid, a precursor to vinyl and ethyl catechol. This could get further complicated depending on the strain of brett you use, and you can end up with flavors you really don't want in your beer.

For Brett IPAs going with very little (if any) hops in the boil kettle and stick with sub-180 whirlpool and dry hop additions.

 

[nadeaunm5]

If you're getting a plastic/band-aid smell and taste in your hoppy brett beers, it's likely the result of one of two things:

1 - Chlorine/Chloramine in your water. Perhaps you forgot to treat it or something has recently changed with your water supply

2 - Too many hops in the boil kettle. When you boil vegetal matter it creates caffeic acid, a precursor to vinyl and ethyl catechol. This could get further complicated depending on the strain of brett you use, and you can end up with flavors you really don't want in your beer.

For Brett IPAs going with very little (if any) hops in the boil kettle and stick with sub-180 whirlpool and dry hop additions.

I used a charcoal filter. But I have been noticing a chlorine smell in my city water lately.

I only boil my bittering addition then do a huge whirlpool at flame out.

Must be the water..

Is this something that will clean up with time?

 

[drgonzo2k2]

Unfortunately, probably not. I'd probably go with a campden tablet to avoid any chlorine concerns.

The recipe you posted on page 1 had about an ounce at 60 minutes. I'd advise 1/2 of that or less. If you really want a big bittering charge I'd use hops extract.

 

[505-Brewer]

How long did it take to clean up? I was hoping to keg this is a few weeks. But i'm going to let it sit if i still pick up on these

A couple weeks and all was well.

 

[VT_jlee]

We have lift off...fermentation kicked off around 3.5 days

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Glad to see this, I am at hour 40 into fermentation with Funk Weapon #3 in a 1.054 OG pale ale with citra/mosaic and don't have much going in the fermenter other than a few wisps of pellicle forming. I left the 1.2L starter on the stir plate for 3 days, then let it rest for another 36 hours before pitching.

This is my first 100% brett fermentation, so I am not quite sure what to expect but I've read they can take a few days to get going. It's not helping that this was a split batch with the other half getting styrian goldings and my house saison strain and it's rocking and rolling already. Hopefully will see activity pick up in a day or two!

 

[nadeaunm5]

Mine is now down to 1.012 after two weeks. I'm having a real issue with 4-Vinylphenol from my readings on Milk the Funk. I get a real medicinal/band-aid/smokey smell and taste. I dry-hopped it yesterday and I going to let it go for 2 more weeks to see if it clears up.

If not it will be a dumper for me

 

[505-Brewer]

Mine is now down to 1.012 after two weeks. I'm having a real issue with 4-Vinylphenol from my readings on Milk the Funk. I get a real medicinal/band-aid/smokey smell and taste. I dry-hopped it yesterday and I going to let it go for 2 more weeks to see if it clears up.

If not it will be a dumper for me

Did it clean up per chance?

 

[nadeaunm5]

It's still pretty smokey, with a slight medicinal taste

 

[nadeaunm5]

I'm going to keg it and see how it tastes cold

 

[drgonzo2k2]

It's still pretty smokey, with a slight medicinal taste

Sounds like a Fantome beer!

 

[nadeaunm5]

No kidding right!!! Fantome isn't my favorite. Hill Farmstead on the other hand is my all time favorite brewery for saisons

 

[nadeaunm5]

Just a little update.

Its been kegged for about a week and was cold crashed with gelatin. I didn't seem to pick up the band-aid flavor and smell. It just slightly smokey with some funk. Really starting to get enjoyable.

Its also has a slight tartness that i did not expect to get but really like it.

The gelatin didn't even touch the cloudiness from the brett/hops/oats/wheat.

I am going to do this again and try RO water to see if i get the same phenols from the brett.