Easy Stovetop All-Grain Brewing (with pics)

[MikeRoBrew1]

Any old bucket will do to dispose of the grains.

I am looking for alternatives besides the trash. Compost is okay, but anything better? I dont have doggies so dont really need 9lb of doggie snacks hehehe!

I ended up doing two 5gal BIAB AG batches last weekend, it was super fun and easy. I was able to come closer to a full boil the last time, ending up with about 4.25gal of wort for my Irish Red (topped off with water to 5gal). Justibone, yep thanks for your help.

I am finding my fermentation space is becoming too cold grrr...... Time for lagers I guess.

 

[Justibone]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f56/spent-grain-bread-87486/

Or put them into any beefy soup or stew.

 

[jourelemode]

i'd run a search on this forum "aluminum vs. stainless steel" and you will find a lot of argument that aluminum works just fine.

i've always been a fan of stainless steel just because it's way cooler

from everything i've read, you can mash and boil in aluminum...no problem.

(EDIT: you can boil in aluminum...whoops!)

I can't mash in a aluminum pot?

 

[joeunc]

sure you can, any pot on the stove you can mash in as long as you can hold temps well. Remember aluminum heats up quicker but also cools much quicker, so you may have to monitor your temp and burner more with the aluminum.

 

[jourelemode]

sure you can, any pot on the stove you can mash in as long as you can hold temps well. Remember aluminum heats up quicker but also cools much quicker, so you may have to monitor your temp and burner more with the aluminum.

why did deathbrewer take back his comment stating "you can mash and boil in aluminum" he then said "you can boil in aluminum, whoops" so he took the mashing part back.

 

[Potatosalad]

I just did my first 5 gallon all grain brew using this method! It went pretty smooth, and I nearly hit my OG dead on. Thanks DeathBrewer!!

 

[jourelemode]

hey guys, I want try doing this sometime next week. I got a few question that I'm hoping I can get some answers to.

Can I use just one pot for this method? Meaning, can I mash my grains, transfer to fermenter bucket, then use the same pot to sparge in? Once the sparging is done, I'd take the wort from the bucket and at it to the sparge water where I tea bagged the grains. Can I do that?

The recipe I want to do involves 12.5 lbs of grains. Is that fine or is it too much? DB said about 12lbs is good, I'm wondering if that .5 lbs of grains will ruin things somehow.

Also, my pot is 32 qt. should I just go with DB's suggestion for water of 1.25qt/lbs of grain? If I go with that it would 15.6 qt so I'd use 4 gallons of water for simplicity. would that fit in my pot when I add those grains? And if it does fit, how much head room will I have? I understand that a smaller amount of head room will give me less variation in temperature.

As for sparging, DB says to use as much sparge water as possible because you get higher efficiency. How do you get higher efficiency from using more sparge water. Sorry for the dumb question, but I really don't know and how much sparge water would you guys suggest. I know its a lot of questions. thanks to anyone who'll entertain them.

 

[agenthucky]

hey guys, I want try doing this sometime next week. I got a few question that I'm hoping I can get some answers to.

Can I use just one pot for this method? Meaning, can I mash my grains, transfer to fermenter bucket, then use the same pot to sparge in? Once the sparging is done, I'd take the wort from the bucket and at it to the sparge water where I tea bagged the grains. Can I do that?

The recipe I want to do involves 12.5 lbs of grains. Is that fine or is it too much? DB said about 12lbs is good, I'm wondering if that .5 lbs of grains will ruin things somehow.

Also, my pot is 32 qt. should I just go with DB's suggestion for water of 1.25qt/lbs of grain? If I go with that it would 15.6 qt so I'd use 4 gallons of water for simplicity. would that fit in my pot when I add those grains? And if it does fit, how much head room will I have? I understand that a smaller amount of head room will give me less variation in temperature.

As for sparging, DB says to use as much sparge water as possible because you get higher efficiency. How do you get higher efficiency from using more sparge water. Sorry for the dumb question, but I really don't know and how much sparge water would you guys suggest. I know its a lot of questions. thanks to anyone who'll entertain them.

DB says 12 lbs because of the size limitation with the pot, 32 qts should be more than enough for 12.5 (I've done 12.75 in 22 qt pot). Also, the bags have some sort of theoretical limitation of grains, but 12.5 should be just fine.

You sure can use 1 pot and transfer the wort. There is a convenience of using 2 pots, one being you can have the water already heated, so you remove the grains and sparge without waiting. Doing it your way, the grains would cool, and make it harder to reach a mashout temp. BUT, if you only have 1 pot, give it a try. Be careful transferring the wort, splash it around as little as possible.

With this AG method, you should not be steeping grains, just throw the grains you would have steeped into the mash. No need to make 2 phases out of what can be 1.

As far as mashing with 1.25 qts/lb of water, that is the LOWEST you want to go. I personally like to do 1.75-2 qts/lb, but if you can only fit 1.25, it will work. If possible, add more water (it will reduce headspace). Because of my pot size limitation, I cannot get my full pre-boil amount, so I sparge with more, and save it to add to the boil kettle.

You can check to see how much a certain water/grain ratio will take up here:
http://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml

If you didn't see that in this forum, you didn't read much of it! Part of me thinks DB made that site he promotes it so much (thanks DB btw).

The reason you get more efficiency when sparging with more water is that you are rinsing the grains better. It's quite basic when you think about it (brewing can often seem overwhelming, but in reality, is quite logical in its simplicity), if you have dirt on your hands, using more soap/water would get more dirt off. This is what you're doing to the grains (don't use soap!). The more water you use, the better it gets inside the grains and rinses the extra sugars out. You will always leave SOME water in the grains sparging this way, so you want to leave the lowest possible gravity water behind in the grains, this means diluting it more.

Hope this helps!

 

[jourelemode]

DB says 12 lbs because of the size limitation with the pot, 32 qts should be more than enough for 12.5 (I've done 12.75 in 22 qt pot). Also, the bags have some sort of theoretical limitation of grains, but 12.5 should be just fine.

You sure can use 1 pot and transfer the wort. There is a convenience of using 2 pots, one being you can have the water already heated, so you remove the grains and sparge without waiting. Doing it your way, the grains would cool, and make it harder to reach a mashout temp. BUT, if you only have 1 pot, give it a try. Be careful transferring the wort, splash it around as little as possible.

With this AG method, you should not be steeping grains, just throw the grains you would have steeped into the mash. No need to make 2 phases out of what can be 1.

As far as mashing with 1.25 qts/lb of water, that is the LOWEST you want to go. I personally like to do 1.75-2 qts/lb, but if you can only fit 1.25, it will work. If possible, add more water (it will reduce headspace). Because of my pot size limitation, I cannot get my full pre-boil amount, so I sparge with more, and save it to add to the boil kettle.

You can check to see how much a certain water/grain ratio will take up here:
http://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml

If you didn't see that in this forum, you didn't read much of it! Part of me thinks DB made that site he promotes it so much (thanks DB btw).

The reason you get more efficiency when sparging with more water is that you are rinsing the grains better. It's quite basic when you think about it (brewing can often seem overwhelming, but in reality, is quite logical in its simplicity), if you have dirt on your hands, using more soap/water would get more dirt off. This is what you're doing to the grains (don't use soap!). The more water you use, the better it gets inside the grains and rinses the extra sugars out. You will always leave SOME water in the grains sparging this way, so you want to leave the lowest possible gravity water behind in the grains, this means diluting it more.

Hope this helps!

Oh, I forgot to mention I'll be using an outdoor burner so heating up water again in the boil kettle would probably only take a long as I let the grains drain.

I also changed the recipe a bit, I think I like this one better. Instead of 12.5 lbs of grains, I reduced it to 10 lbs of grains. I tried calculating the water/grain ratio with that calculator, but I think i'm doing it wrong. keeps giving me a ridiculous number :cross: I want to get as much water in the mash as possible because from what I've gathered its better with less headspace. you think 4.5 gal in a 32 qt pot with 10 lbs of grains will do? With that on mind, how much water should I use for sparge?

thanks for the info bro!

 

[agenthucky]

Oh, I forgot to mention I'll be using an outdoor burner so heating up water again in the boil kettle would probably only take a long as I let the grains drain.

I also changed the recipe a bit, I think I like this one better. Instead of 12.5 lbs of grains, I reduced it to 10 lbs of grains. I tried calculating the water/grain ratio with that calculator, but I think i'm doing it wrong. keeps giving me a ridiculous number :cross: I want to get as much water in the mash as possible because from what I've gathered its better with less headspace. you think 4.5 gal in a 32 qt pot with 10 lbs of grains will do? With that on mind, how much water should I use for sparge?

thanks for the info bro!

To save time, I often just fill my 5.5 gallon kettle to the top with anywhere from 8-11 lbs. I recommend that, but I wouldn't go beyond 3 qts/lb. That on its own is really high. If there is too much water, the proteins won't be able to turn the starches to sugar.

 

[jourelemode]

To save time, I often just fill my 5.5 gallon kettle to the top with anywhere from 8-11 lbs. I recommend that, but I wouldn't go beyond 3 qts/lb. That on its own is really high. If there is too much water, the proteins won't be able to turn the starches to sugar.

ok, i think i'll just use 4 gallons of water, that would be 1.6 qt/lbs. That probably wont be enough water, to interfere starch to sugar conversion right?

 

[agenthucky]

ok, i think i'll just use 4 gallons of water, that would be 1.6 qt/lbs. That probably wont be enough water, to interfere starch to sugar conversion right?

That's a great amount

To get an idea, 1.25 is low (thick), 1.5-2 is normal, and more is high (thin)

Some people think 1.5 is low and 2+ isn't high, but there are limits from 1-3 that anything outside that wont work well.

 

[electronjunkie]

That's a great amount

To get an idea, 1.25 is low (thick), 1.5-2 is normal, and more is high (thin)

Some people think 1.5 is low and 2+ isn't high, but there are limits from 1-3 that anything outside that wont work well.

The Aussie BIAB brewers use a high water/grist ratio. They put their entire water and grain into the pot, mash, remove grain bag, then boil. They usually drip the grainbag in an empty bucket and pour that leftover liquid in. It really is pretty forgiving. I am sure this changes the body slightly and may not be suitable for some beer types.

I have tried this Aussie method twice and ended up with a fairly normal FG, but it was a Belgian that used about 20% sugar. YMMV. Tasted great.

I usually do the DB method though btw, not the Aussie method. Its not much harder and I just use a cooler or bucket to sparge in.

 

[DeathBrewer]

Hello everyone! Sorry I've been off the forums lately. I've been busy and without a computer, but I should be back on more frequently now.

Please let me know if you have any questions...I won't be responding to old questions as I'm not sure whether or not they may have been answered (ok, ok...I'm just lazy and taking advantage of the situation )

One thing from this page...I do not remember anything about mashing in aluminum (or posting about it, for that matter.) I'd think it would be fine. Please let me know if anyone has information to the contrary, I'm curious.

 

[agenthucky]

Hello everyone! Sorry I've been off the forums lately. I've been busy and without a computer, but I should be back on more frequently now.

Please let me know if you have any questions...I won't be responding to old questions as I'm not sure whether or not they may have been answered (ok, ok...I'm just lazy and taking advantage of the situation )

One thing from this page...I do not remember anything about mashing in aluminum (or posting about it, for that matter.) I'd think it would be fine. Please let me know if anyone has information to the contrary, I'm curious.

This is my personal philosophy, and has nothing to do with brewing ideology, but I go out of my way to never cook with aluminum.

Cooking in general, and I assume the same goes for brewing, but aluminum can leach out of the cookware and into the food. This is at higher temps and after more use. Can you make good beer in an aluminum kettle, sure, but I would avoid using it in the long term. I cook with either cast iron or glass/ceramic. Stainless steel can take the extreme temperatures for cooking, and I have no problem cooking/brewing with it.

Aluminum is a vary bad metal to have inside the body and specifically the brain. It can lead to Alzheimer’s disease.

http://www.ehow.com/facts_4914271_what-dangers-aluminum-cooking-utensils.html

It is the extreme temperatures that cause the aluminum to leech out of the cookware and into the food. I am not sure if the danger extends to aluminum foil, as the heat index on it is so low, the heat really just passes through it. If I burn the foil though, I am cautious.

In addition to cooking, I stay away from antiperspirant (not deodorant, specifically antiperspirant) If you look, the main ingredient is aluminum based, and long term studies have shown it can deposit it in the body. If you look at what antiperspirant is, it is the same thing as deck (wood) sealant.

Many may think of paranoia, but it's my philosophy, and I just try to stay away when I have the option. You won't die from brewing with aluminum though.

I can't imagine that there would be any OTHER reason not to use aluminum.

 

[jourelemode]

another question, when I'm finished mashing and I transfer my mash wort to another vessel so I can heat up my sparge water, does my mash wort need to be maintained at a certain heat or can I just let it be when I heat my sparge water up to 170 and sparge for 10 minutes? thanks

 

[agenthucky]

another question, when I'm finished mashing and I transfer my mash wort to another vessel so I can heat up my sparge water, does my mash wort need to be maintained at a certain heat or can I just let it be when I heat my sparge water up to 170 and sparge for 10 minutes? thanks

I guess it doesn't really matter too much, but if you have a fee burner, why not start heating it to a boil. My only worry would be the formation of DMS, which happens at certain temperatures that I'm not sure of at this moment in time. I put it on another burner and it works well.

 

[jourelemode]

I guess it doesn't really matter too much, but if you have a fee burner, why not start heating it to a boil. My only worry would be the formation of DMS, which happens at certain temperatures that I'm not sure of at this moment in time. I put it on another burner and it works well.

how about i transfer teh mash wort to another vessel and stick it in the oven at the lowest temp to maintain the heat in it already while I do the sparging etc. willl that work?

thanks for ur help agent!

 

[agenthucky]

how about i transfer teh mash wort to another vessel and stick it in the oven at the lowest temp to maintain the heat in it already while I do the sparging etc. willl that work?

thanks for ur help agent!

I don't think it warrants that much effort. The DMS should be destroyed in the boil anyway, so a nice long boil is good. It's the cooling afterwards that you can't recover from, but I've never really had a problem with that.

I would try it like you originally planned it, if you hate the beer, then look for things to change, but I bet you won't even have a problem. Like I said, I just use an extra burner I have because it saves time when I want to heat the whole thing to a boil.

 

[DeathBrewer]

I always add heat to my first runnings. You can even get it up to boiling before you add the sparge. It will speed up the process and the affects will only be positive. A quick hot break is desirable.

 

[jourelemode]

hey death, is there a reason why there's a limit to the weight of grains for this technique??? What if I had a pot that could accommodate a recipe with a bigger grain bill, can I do it?

 

[agenthucky]

hey death, is there a reason why there's a limit to the weight of grains for this technique??? What if I had a pot that could accommodate a recipe with a bigger grain bill, can I do it?

You'll be fine assuming you can have a good ration of water to grain. Theoretically you can put as much as you want, good luck getting 10 gallons to boil on the stovetop though (If you can' I'm jealous!). Lifting a kettle that big will be difficult as well. Not to mention that the one physical limit to this technique is the size of the grain bag.

Part of brewing is finding what works for YOUR system. Part of doing that is starting small and scaling up. It would be a shame if you started with 10-15 gallons and figured out half way though you can't bring it to a boil.

I am not death, but my advice is to start small and get a feel for your setup. Yes, you can mash more, the limit is just something I don't think he wants to introduce to beginners.

 

[jourelemode]

oh, i wont be doing these on stove top. it'll be on a outdoor burner. even the smaller scale all grain brew that i'm planning will be on an outdoor burner. My stovetop can't get 3 gallons to boil lol. Cause I have another recipe I wanna do, its 15lbs of grain. if I use 1.25qt/pound it would be about 4.25 gallons of water for the mash. Then for sparge, ill have to see how much mash I got and calculate from there cause I need 8gallons of wort preboil. thanks again agent

 

[flabyboy]

Is there any big disadvantage doing this method over the traditional Mash tun.? How much cold water do you top off with?? I haven't tried all grain yet. It seems like a simple process, but am still confused about how much sparge water and now top off water to use to get an appropriate OG

 

[agenthucky]

Is there any big disadvantage doing this method over the traditional Mash tun.? How much cold water do you top off with?? I haven't tried all grain yet. It seems like a simple process, but am still confused about how much sparge water and now top off water to use to get an appropriate OG

As far as taste wise goes, I don't see a difference in this and a 'standard' mashing method. The one thing I do notice is a lot of protein/trub in my carboys. Probably becuase the sparging method is different. This usually gets racked and isn't a problem.

No topping off with cold water for all-grain (unless you want to water down your beer and get more volume). To calculate the amount of sparge water, you need to know what you want to start the boil with. You mash, and calculate how much more you need to start your boil, and use that as the mash. You have to take in account about 10 lbs of grain absorb a gallon of water, and will need to account for that as well.

 

[DeathBrewer]

You can use as much sparge water as you would like, but you risk extracting tannins if you use too much. I usually use a little less or the same amount as my strike water, so if I mashed with 4 gallons of water I would sparge with 4 gallons, and then top off as needed.

If you use a very small amount of sparge water due to limited pot sizes or boil amounts, you may see a decrease in efficiency.

Also, remember that you need room to boil in the pot. I prefer an extra gallon, so if I use a 5 gallon pot to mash, I will use no more than a total volume (including grain, water and bag) of 4 gallons or so.

 

[agenthucky]

Also, remember that you need room to boil in the pot. I prefer an extra gallon, so if I use a 5 gallon pot to mash, I will use no more than a total volume (including grain, water and bag) of 4 gallons or so.

Hah, I remember my first batch, didn't give myself much room, cleaning was a long project!

 

[jourelemode]

well, i did it today...brewed up my first all grain batch of my cascadian dark ale. We'll see how it turns out. I hit my numbers, my pre-boil gravity was 1.044 so thats about right, post boil, it was 1.068 after I added 1.5lbs of D2 belgian candy syrup and some corn sugar good for 1% alcohol boost.

 

[agenthucky]

well, i did it today...brewed up my first all grain batch of my cascadian dark ale. We'll see how it turns out. I hit my numbers, my pre-boil gravity was 1.044 so thats about right, post boil, it was 1.068 after I added 1.5lbs of D2 belgian candy syrup and some corn sugar good for 1% alcohol boost.

Start the waiting!

 

[jourelemode]

i just went to go check on my fermenting bucket and I see a clearly visible division through the bucket. At the bottom there is a layer that is lighter in color to the beer. The layer looks like a yeast cake in style but obviously its not since the yeast hasn't started working yet. What could this be? could it be the dust from the grains? I know its not hops cause I put my hops in a nylon bag when I was adding them to the boil and disposed of them. This sucks cause the layer looks almost 1 gallon thick so im thinking that shouldn't be bottled up when the time comes...so its like I lost a gallon of beer.

 

[agenthucky]

i just went to go check on my fermenting bucket and I see a clearly visible division through the bucket. At the bottom there is a layer that is lighter in color to the beer. The layer looks like a yeast cake in style but obviously its not since the yeast hasn't started working yet. What could this be? could it be the dust from the grains? I know its not hops cause I put my hops in a nylon bag when I was adding them to the boil and disposed of them. This sucks cause the layer looks almost 1 gallon thick so im thinking that shouldn't be bottled up when the time comes...so its like I lost a gallon of beer.

It is protein. Doing this method leaves a lot of that behind. I believe it is a result of using a nylon bag and not filtering it out. It's harmless, but yes, you will get a little less.

 

[jourelemode]

It is protein. Doing this method leaves a lot of that behind. I believe it is a result of using a nylon bag and not filtering it out. It's harmless, but yes, you will get a little less.

alright, thanks agent! so that leaves me with about 4.5 gallons then minus more from the yeast later...sheesh, i thought I was gonna have more than 5 gallons since I ended up with 5.5 gallons in the fermenter, guess not. Oh well...So the only way to get rid of that is doing what method? Buying the additional equipment i'm guessing?? like mash tun etc with false bottom???

 

[agenthucky]

alright, thanks agent! so that leaves me with about 4.5 gallons then minus more from the yeast later...sheesh, i thought I was gonna have more than 5 gallons since I ended up with 5.5 gallons in the fermenter, guess not. Oh well...So the only way to get rid of that is doing what method? Buying the additional equipment i'm guessing?? like mash tun etc with false bottom???

I'm not 100% sure but I think it is the sparge method. When sparging with a classic mash tun, the grains filter the wort. I never get 5 gallons.

 

[jourelemode]

oh yeah, that's right, when you recirculate the wort it filters it making it clearer, i think its termed "vorlauf" the step thats done before sparging I think. this method totally skips that.

 

[agenthucky]

oh yeah, that's right, when you recirculate the wort it filters it making it clearer, i think its termed "vorlauf" the step thats done before sparging I think. this method totally skips that.

yea, its not perfect, but it makes damn fine beer. Living in an apartment, I don't have a great setup for the classic methods, I love BIAB, I usually just top off my fermenter to account for the lost volume. I often get better conversion than expected, so it turns out perfect.

 

[Justibone]

Yeah, I just kegged a BIAB white last night, and I lost about a gallon of beer to the sludge at the bottom. Our barleywine also had a lot of protein, which sucks due to the expense of that particular brew. Two of us went in together on it, and didn't even get a case each.

I like the simplicity of BIAB, but I think I need a traditional set-up. I can't be losing up to a gallon per brew.

 

[agenthucky]

Yeah, I just kegged a BIAB white last night, and I lost about a gallon of beer to the sludge at the bottom. Our barleywine also had a lot of protein, which sucks due to the expense of that particular brew. Two of us went in together on it, and didn't even get a case each.

I like the simplicity of BIAB, but I think I need a traditional set-up. I can't be losing up to a gallon per brew.

I've learned to adjust for it. A lot of people will have 5.5 gallons in their fermenter. If I may make a point, if the protein is at the 1 gallon mark, you aren't losing 1 gallon, more like 1/2 because the protein actually takes up some volume as well. It sucks, but I'd rather make a 4.5 gallon AG than a 5 gallon Extract.

 

[Justibone]

That's a good point. I think I'll keep doing partial mashes until I can get an MLT that I like, though.

 

[electronjunkie]

Yeah, I just kegged a BIAB white last night, and I lost about a gallon of beer to the sludge at the bottom. Our barleywine also had a lot of protein, which sucks due to the expense of that particular brew. Two of us went in together on it, and didn't even get a case each.

I like the simplicity of BIAB, but I think I need a traditional set-up. I can't be losing up to a gallon per brew.

You can always boil 8oz of water with a whirflock or irish moss and add that in your barleywine in secondary or serving keg. Then put it in the fridge. It'll drop out in 48hrs. Or did you mean protein on the bottom?

Also a gallon lost on a wit? I have never wound up with more than about a 1/3-1/2 gallon or so of trub in the bottom of my fermenters and thats with higher gravity beers. Did you crush that grain really fine? I just use a regular crush. A fine crush can lead to more trub in my experience. Maybe it was the wheat. It tends to gum things up more and I have not used more than 10% wheat so far. I'd be careful crushing wheat too fine.

 

[agenthucky]

You can always boil 8oz of water with a whirflock or irish moss and add that in your barleywine in secondary or serving keg. Then put it in the fridge. It'll drop out in 48hrs. Or did you mean protein on the bottom?

Also a gallon lost on a wit? I have never wound up with more than about a 1/3-1/2 gallon or so of trub in the bottom of my fermenters and thats with higher gravity beers. Did you crush that grain really fine? I just use a regular crush. A fine crush can lead to more trub in my experience. Maybe it was the wheat. It tends to gum things up more and I have not used more than 10% wheat so far. I'd be careful crushing wheat too fine.

Oh, wheat will have plenty of extra protein. I get my grains from a LHBS, and they crush it like they do for anyone else, so my experiences aren't from overcrushing the grain. I normally get .5-1 gallon of extra protein/yeast slurry. It usually ends up being closer towards .75 though.

As for the actual beer being cloudy, that shouldn't be a problem, you can leave the protein behind, or it will settle, I get very clear beer even with all that slurry.