Does aerating make better beer?

[poptarts]

I'm conflicted about buying an oxygen system to aerate my wort. From what I can read adding o2 helps yeast growth thus giving a stronger faster fermentation. However, I make a massive starter for all my beers, and temp control all my ferments. I did a 10% stout and a 11% Belgian recently with this method. Fermentation was super fast and strong and I hit my FG numbers spot on. So will I notice a difference if I drop 50$+ on a O2 system or should I just stick with my wine degasser and drill that I have been doing and it appears to work fine. Has anyone been in this situation and noticed a change when switching to O2? I want to make the best beer I can but I also don't want to drop 50$ on something that I don't need. What are your thoughts, does using O2 make the beer taste better?

 

[wanders]

If your fermentations are already going well without it then I don't think you are going to see much of an improvement with it. We bought an O2 stone setup simply to save us the hassle of what we were doing before: pouring the wort back and forth between containers. I don't think it has improved the flavor of our beers.

But the only way to tell that for sure would be to split a batch and do one half with normal aeration and the other half with dissolving pure oxygen. Hopefully someone who has done just that will throw in their two cents here.

 

[poptarts]

Yea that would truly be the way to test, sadly I cant really do that since my ferm chamber can only hold one carboy. But yea that was my thinking as well that if I already have fast and clean fermentation then it might not be needed. However I'm at very high altitude, almost 8000, so I would imagine the amount of O2 I'm putting in my beer with the wine degasser is probably very minimal. So I know that it would defiantly add a lot more O2 to the beer but like I said, just not sure it will make a difference in the end result of the beer.

 

[johngaltsmotor]

As the O2 is to ensure a healthy yeast reproduction phase then you are likely compensating by pitching a larger starter. (Large starter could be seen as overpitching but with less dissolved oxygen you may end up with the same ideal total yeast population.)
If you end up with clean flavors (not stressed yeast) and you're not launching your airlock due to turbo fermentation then your pitch rate is probably well matched and oxygen won't help, it may in fact lead to being overpitched unless you reduce your starter sizes.

 

[julioardz]

I use mostly dry US or English yeast strains, with the occasional Belgian or Hefe liquid strain with an appropriate starter and have yet to find a need for an oxygen system to aerate. I slosh around my immersion chiller for a bit once the wort has cooled below 100F and that's as far as my aeration goes. This has worked great for all my batches.

 

[ram5ey]

I think the key to all of this is the same with the rest of the hobby...what do you want out if it? Are you looking to always try to find a way of making the absolute best beer possible? Or are you looking to make beer that you enjoy? You can make this as difficult or simple as you want. If you enjoy your beer and don't want to invest more money in something that may not make you any happier, then why do it. I personally think 02 provides more consistent results and is easier, but I was making high scoring beers by swirling so I'm sure there is a case to be made on either side...but it's what you want.

 

[TAK]

My guess is you probably wouldn't notice the improvement, but that doesn't mean it wasn't there.

I think it's the accumulation of best practice steps that make better beer. Just like the starters and other things you're probably already doing. You won't notice on your next batch that it's notably better, but as you make improvements to your process and look back, I think you'll see your beer is better than it used to be.

I recently bought an O2 setup. It's definitely easier than the paint mixer style I was employing before. Also, yeast need O2, and big starters imply lots of yeast. So, big starters, in turn need more O2 to be healthy and do good work.

As a side note, I feel the O2 was an investment in the improvement in my foam and head retention as we'll. Foam is made up of one-use-only proteins, and those paint mixers whip up a bunch of foam in the carboy that could otherwise been in my beer class down the line.

 

[AerationStation]

In a batch pitched with a new, started yeast the difference will be pretty minimal. The reason you want O2 is to build sterols for a nice healthy cell membrane.

If you don't get the proper O2 con'c in your brews the yeast will lose the nice permeable membranes that make budding successfully possible. So the first gen will be ok but if you keep repitching over several generations you'd probably notice a difference in overall yeast health.

 

[poptarts]

Cool thanks for the input. Maybe I will get a recipe I like brewed up a few times and then one time borrow an O2 system from someone if I can find anyone that has one and see if it makes a difference for me.

 

[kanzimonson]

Another question revolves around repitching yeast. Have you done any of this? The Yeast book (White and Zainasheff) suggests that successive generations of under-oxygenated yeast perform worse and worse.

 

[poptarts]

I repitch but I build up and grow yeast on the starter so they have plenty of O2 while they are growing.

 

[Homercidal]

The question is, do you want to brew good beers by simply pitching correct amounts of healthy yeast, or make good beers by following every single best practice suggested in homebrewing.

Adding oxygen will supply the young yeast cells with the ability to produce sterols needed for strong cell walls. This is important because healthy cell walls allow yeast to tolerate higher alcohol levels, and to better tolerate the effects of scarring from budding into new cells. In dry yeast, the yeast have already done that, so many experts say you can safely forego adding oxygen to wort when using dry yeast. Then again, if you want your dry yeast to continue to reproduce, then having oxygen on hand, might help future generations of cells grow strong and healthy cell membranes.

There are many different methods for doing most things in homebrewing. In this case I personally feel that if you are pitching an appropriate amount of healthy yeast, then adding an oxygen kit to your supply list probably isn't going to noticeably improve your beer. If you harvest and re-use your yeast, as has been mentioned, then using oxygen at each pitch might improve your overall yeast health from batch to batch, making each generation a bit better over the long term.

At some point, when you've gotten some of the other equipment and are looking for something to spend your money on, then it wouldn't hurt to have a regulator and O2 tank on hand. Or, you might want to pick one up earlier for that very special HIGH GRAVITY brew, or wine or mead, which can always benefit from good oxygenation, and perhaps, a second dose the day or two after pitching.

Summary, if you are pitching plenty of healthy yeast, O2 is probably optional.

 

[bja]

I'm conflicted about buying an oxygen system to aerate my wort. From what I can read adding o2 helps yeast growth thus giving a stronger faster fermentation. However, I make a massive starter for all my beers, and temp control all my ferments.

I used an oxygen system for about 3 years. I then began using 2-3 liter starters and stopped using the oxygen altogether. There were no detectable changes at all. None.

 

[Hello]

I used an oxygen system for about 3 years. I then began using 2-3 liter starters and stopped using the oxygen altogether. There were no detectable changes at all. None.

That is interesting. I just bought an oxygen aeration system (the hose and the tank ~$50) but I don't think I could tell whether it was useful. It is nicer on my shoulders which aren't super awesome, so that is good. I also know a brewer who told another home brewer about aerating his beer so I'd like to think there is something to it. But I also think that you are right in pitching healthy yeast and enough yeast can trump the need to aerate your beer a bunch.

OP, this is a great thread.

 

[RM-MN]

This is just anecdotal, not scientific but here is my take on this. It takes a certain number of yeast cells to make the best beer. Whether you add that many yeast cells or add fewer and have them multiply doesn't change that. If you are pitching fewer cells and wanting them to multiply you have to provide what they need for multiplication, one of which is oxygen. If you can get sufficient oxygen into your beer the yeast will multiply and be healthy.

Now for the anecdotal part. For lagers you need more yeast added to get the start they need to ferment at the lower temperatures....or do you? Most calculators would have you add a big starter but Gordon Strong makes lagers by pitching just a single vial of yeast but to do that and still make good beer, he provides the oxygen that the yeast need for the healthy multiplication.

 

[TAK]

It takes a certain number of yeast cells to make the best beer. Whether you add that many yeast cells or add fewer and have them multiply doesn't change that.

I don't agree with this. The flavor characters from any particular yeast strain are largely driven by the growth phase. During that period is when they throw the majority of they're esters or phoenols. If you over pitch and the yeast population doesn't grow, sure they'll turn sugar into ethanol, but it'll lack character. The best beer is made by pitching the proper amount of yeast, providing them with food and nutrients so they can reproduce and make good beer.

 

[boydster]

If you are using yeast from a well-aerated starter or properly hydrated dry yeast, and you are pitching at a rate that is >= .75 million cells/ml/°P, the yeast will have enough of the compounds required for sterol synthesis during fermentation before it ever hits your wort, making dissolved O2 much less important. If you pitch at or below that amount, or if you are direct pitching your yeast (no starter or pitching dry), then adding oxygen or aerating is great insurance.