Do yourself a favor, get a refractormeter to replace your hydrometer

[Carter1932]

I bought a refractometer a couple of months ago on eBay for about $25 shipped and it is wonderful. Wish I had not wasted money on a three different hydrometers, one of which broke.

Don't be put off by the price of refractormeter @ your LHBS. Find a generic cheap one on eBay and then grab of copy of Morebeer's brix conversion spreadsheet to track your specific gravity for all your batches.

I think you'll be happy with the more exact measurements a refractormeter provides and also only needing to use one drop of wort/beer to attain the result.

Cheers!

 

[LambChop4Prez]

Wow, I just looked at refractometers on ebay. SO MUCH CHEAPER!
Looks like I'm gonna be making a new addition to my brewing arsenal by the end of the day.
Cheers!

 

[Randar]

Yep, I haven't touched a hydrometer on brew day in over 2 years. If you do all-grain and still use a hydrometer, you're even more crazy.

 

[Yooper]

I love my refractometer! But it doesn't replace a good old hydrometer. It's a great tool for preboil gravity, and post boil gravity, but you still need to calibrate it with a hydrometer for the finished gravity. I use the refractometer pre-fermentation, and the hydrometer for post-fermentation.

 

[strat_thru_marshall]

Prost!


I got the AHS Brix/SG model and it RULES

 

[Carter1932]

Yooper, presuming the refractometer is calibrated, why do you find the need to use a hydrometer for post-fermentation, presuming the FG is calcualted using the correct formula for fermented beverage (ie, Morebeer spreadsheet)?

Do refractometers need constant recalibration?

 

[drumming102]

from my understanding alcohol can throw off the reading.

 

[neovox]

from my understanding alcohol can throw off the reading.

That follows what the description on AHS's site says:

Once fermentation has started, the refractometer will no longer accurately read the sugar content of a sample because alcohol is now present. If you are using the refractometer for a final reading calculations are needed.

http://www.austinhomebrew.com/product_info.php?products_id=12574

 

[Carter1932]

That follows what the description on AHS's site says:

Once fermentation has started, the refractometer will no longer accurately read the sugar content of a sample because alcohol is now present. If you are using the refractometer for a final reading calculations are needed.

http://www.austinhomebrew.com/product_info.php?products_id=12574

Thus the need from something like Morebeer's spreadsheet, or abacus.

 

[ksbrain]

I've been longing for a refractometer for a while, but the hydrometer seems to work just fine for me. With a refractometer, I could measure gravity of first runnings, last runnings, pre-boil, etc. But I have never taken these readings and get pretty predictable results, so I don't really see a need to do it. It would be nice to get gravity readings while fermenting with just a drop of beer, but it just never makes it to the top of my list.

 

[weirdboy]

I guess I don't understand the hubub. I take 3, maybe 4 readings total for an AG batch, and usually 2 readings if I'm doing extract. I do have a refractometer, and it's great for preboil gravities, but I am not always checking the gravity of my wort anyway. You are better off just leaving the fermenter alone IMO.

 

[Jawbox0]

I really want to get a refractometer. I find that I don't use a hydrometer because of the need to cool down a wort sample, so I end up just not using it.

 

[ndsgr]

I checked my recent Saison with the refractometer and hydrometer. Both say the same thing, well after the spreadsheet.

Screw the hydrometer. The only cool thing about it was drinking the awesome sample test tube.

 

[samc]

Call me crazy but I prefer Hydrometer as it always will read the exact same in the same liquid at the same temp. My Refractometer (cheapo) will read one thing and then you can lift the plastic cover and set it down again for an entirely new reading. I just don't trust it and rely on the Hydro for real numbers.

 

[bob1852]

My Refractometer (cheapo) will read one thing and then you can lift the plastic cover and set it down again for an entirely new reading. I just don't trust it and rely on the Hydro for real numbers.

Just because there are ATC models, doesn't mean that you can just add a couple drops of boiling (or near boiling) wort and get an accurate read.

I still find for best results that I take ~1 Tbsp and set it aside for several minutes before taking a sample....

I had the same results that you have - and it was really throwing off my numbers until I changed up my process....

It's best to have both your refracto and samples at ~60*F (i.e. don't leave it in the sun)

 

[Jumbo82]

I use precision hydrometers for original and final gravity readings. If you don't have a set, I highly recommend them over the cheap universal hydrometers (much easier to get an accurate reading). I use the refractometer for taking readings during the sparge, pre-boil, and mid-boil. If you don't really care what your alcohol content is, then its probably not worth the effort. But because I sell my beer I have to make sure I hit my numbers. I love both my refractometer and my precision hydrometers. I wouldn't even consider giving up on either.

 

[bob1852]

But because I sell my beer

I hate you (assuming you're legal and such...)

 

[StMarcos]

I have a refractometer but don't use it for brewing anymore. Bought two precision hydrometers (0-1.07 and 1.06-1.13) from cole palmer and can get a more precise reading with them. 0.0005 markings. I always stick an rtd in the cylinder and correct for the temperature. Uses about 200mL of wort, but I don't mind as I like drinking unfermented wort.

You'd be surprised how much a refractometer can be off if you only calibrate with water. I keep mine calibrated at 1.026 for seawater. You'll need to make a reference solution for this sort of calibration.

 

[Randar]

Just because there are ATC models, doesn't mean that you can just add a couple drops of boiling (or near boiling) wort and get an accurate read.

I still find for best results that I take ~1 Tbsp and set it aside for several minutes before taking a sample....

I had the same results that you have - and it was really throwing off my numbers until I changed up my process....

It's best to have both your refracto and samples at ~60*F (i.e. don't leave it in the sun)

I didn't read the rest of the posts following this one, but I call BS right out of the gate. The thermal mass of the refractometer is so significantly greater than the few drops or brief stream of wort that you will still be within ATC range of your refrac.

I find the "formula" for fermented wort to usually be about 2 pts too high in my usual range of OG and FG, but tha;s the only real pt I find a hydrometer to be useful (measuring final fermented wort)

 

[bob1852]

I didn't read the rest of the posts following this one, but I call BS right out of the gate. The thermal mass of the refractometer is so significantly greater than the few drops or brief stream of wort that you will still be within ATC range of your refrac.

Call BS all you want. I speak from lots of experience with my refractometer...

I get a completely different reading if I put a 200*F sample v. a 60*F sample with my ATC refractometer.

I was just sharing my experience with my refractometer for the OP to take into consideration.

If your results are different, good for you - but no need to call BS on my results using my equipment....

And, Randar - have you ever checked your samples after different times to see if they change, or are you just relying on the ATC? I ask that honestly, because I used to not check - just take a reading and run with it. But then realized after time, I needed to make sure the temp was appropriate.

 

[skeeordye11]

I can say that I have had a similar experience to AZ's. I'll take a sample, let it cool a little, take a reading and then set the refractometer down while doing other stuff. I'll come back later, usually when it's time to take another reading and the original reading has changed, I assume because the sample has cooled. That's just my experience.

 

[Special Hops]

Yep, I haven't touched a hydrometer on brew day in over 2 years. If you do all-grain and still use a hydrometer, you're even more crazy.

Call me even more crazy. Seems to work just fine for me.

 

[marnel]

If you read the manual on the refractometer it says to allow the sample to sit on the device window for 30 seconds before taking a reading to allow the ATC to function properly. Also the ATC is only good for a temp range of 45 - 90 degrees F if i recall correctly. When dealing with a few drops of liquid it would probably only take a few seconds to equalize into that temperature range which is why they recommend it I suppose.

 

[smizak]

I have an ATC refractometer and I have never been able to get an accurate reading with wort. I've measured carefully prepared sugar solutions and it will read dead on, but the second wort hits it, it's all over the place. A 1.040 sugar solution and a 1.040 wort yield refractometer numbers that are +/- 15% from each other, and that changes with different worts. I bought it for pre-boil readings, but it has been useless, kinda like to hit my numbers within that percentage.

I don't think it's the instrument, if you mix 95/5, 90/10, 85/15, water/sugar by weight solutions, I get dead on 5, 10, 15 Brix readings after calibration.

Got any tips?

 

[broadbill]

I have an ATC refractometer and I have never been able to get an accurate reading with wort. I've measured carefully prepared sugar solutions and it will read dead on, but the second wort hits it, it's all over the place. A 1.040 sugar solution and a 1.040 wort yield refractometer numbers that are +/- 15% from each other, and that changes with different worts. I bought it for pre-boil readings, but it has been useless, kinda like to hit my numbers within that percentage.

I don't think it's the instrument, if you mix 95/5, 90/10, 85/15, water/sugar by weight solutions, I get dead on 5, 10, 15 Brix readings after calibration.

Got any tips?

Sounds to me a temperature effect, similar to what AZ IPA is talking about. Your pre-boil samples are probably much warmer than what you are reading your water/sugar controls at.

 

[smizak]

Sounds to me a temperature effect, similar to what AZ IPA is talking about. Your pre-boil samples are probably much warmer than what you are reading your water/sugar controls at.

I've tested both at the same temperature.

Like a previous poster said, even if it were boiling, the thermal mass of the refractometer is so much greater than a drop of wort that the temperature change of the instrument would be negligible and at worst, well within the ATC range.

I've read some comments on here that might be confusing. The ATC is a means to correct the temperature changes of the instrument itself, not the sample. Unless you're dunking the refractometer into boiling wort to collect your sample.

 

[Randar]

And, Randar - have you ever checked your samples after different times to see if they change, or are you just relying on the ATC? I ask that honestly, because I used to not check - just take a reading and run with it. But then realized after time, I needed to make sure the temp was appropriate.

I have checked both ways and get consistent readings. I also place the small amount directly onto the glass, let it sit for 10 seconds to normalize and then read it.

Numbers are consistent, repeatable, and confirmed by readings within the ATC temp range. ATC is not "at all temps". It is only a window typically 50-85 degrees F or so.

But the method is exceedingly simple. The thermal mass of the refrac and glass is far greater than the small sample size of liquid, so the liquid will be drawn to the temp of the refrac. Putting a few drops of boiling wort onto the glass and closing the lid, the sample will be at or near nominal ATC range within seconds. I brew indoors in my basement (except the burner itself) so the refract is usually 65-70 degrees when I am using it. If you're using it outdoors in the sun in Arizona in July, sure, it might be off and you might have trouble with having to "cool" the wort first. But IMO it's about knowing the limitations of your equipment.

And after all of that, if you still have problems with your refrac, I would start looking at the refrac itself as it may be damaged or of exceedingly low quality.

 

[Randar]

Call me even more crazy. Seems to work just fine for me.

I didn't say it wouldn't work or doesn't work. It certainly does. But the frequency you can verify and the simplicity of the method to do so with a refrac vs a hydro is just a million times better, IMO.

 

[samc]

Back to what I posted - with more clarity, which was that I can put several drops of cool wort on my refractometer and read it. I can come back a few minutes later and read it again and it will be fairly close, however if you lift the plastic cover and set it back down, it will usually give you a totally different reading, which leads me to believe that the way the light goes through the sample on my refractometer is totally useless.

I usually use mine during mashing and write the numbers down, but I don't adjust my brewing based upon the results because I wouldn't know what number to work with. I don't really expect precision from some cheap China knock off junk.

 

[bob1852]

I don't really expect precision from some cheap China knock off junk.

That's another point I was going to bring up...

Where is everyone getting their refracto's from?

My ebay one was cheap, and shipped from Hong Kong....so, yeah; I'm expecting a little less quality....

 

[Randar]

I got mine from Northern Brewer long before I knew about the ones on eBay. Not sure about any differences in quality, but it's a real possibility.

Also, I seem to be able to get reproducible results from samples taken from the same source (within 0.2 Brix), so that gives me the requisite confidence.

 

[BendBrewer]

I only use mine on brew day but a lot of times that is the only day I take readings. If I do take a reading later on, I use the hydrometer.

Go visit a local brewery. Chances are you'll see a couple of hydrometers before seeing anyone use a refractometer.