Here is a tease for a recent project I completed. Full write-up forthcoming...
DIY Project: Weld-less Heater Element Using Cam & Groove Couplings
DIY Project: Weld-less Heater Element Using Cam & Groove Couplings
DIY: Weld-less Heater Element Using Cam & Groove Couplings
- Thread starter trboyden
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I like the outside the box thinking this but it seems like a ton of area is going to be contained within the type F and it will also require this massive hole in the pot. Is that a 1.5" locknut?
OP
OP
Thanks Bobby, I won my bet that you'd be the first to reply!
Because of the fold-back element, that is a 2" coupling. There isn't enough space in a 1-1/2" to offset the element to keep it from hitting the side of the coupling. That said, I have a second one using a straight element centered in a 1-1/2" coupling.
I won't deny it is a big hole, but only a 1/2" larger than the one required for a 1-1/2".
Keep in mind the cap and F-style coupling overlap, so I wouldn't say there is a ton of space contained in the F coupling. Compared to a welded on tri-clamp fitting, it's probably about the same.
Picture of welded on tri-clamp fitting as comparison:
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Because of the fold-back element, that is a 2" coupling. There isn't enough space in a 1-1/2" to offset the element to keep it from hitting the side of the coupling. That said, I have a second one using a straight element centered in a 1-1/2" coupling.
I won't deny it is a big hole, but only a 1/2" larger than the one required for a 1-1/2".
Keep in mind the cap and F-style coupling overlap, so I wouldn't say there is a ton of space contained in the F coupling. Compared to a welded on tri-clamp fitting, it's probably about the same.
Picture of welded on tri-clamp fitting as comparison:
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I almost attempted trying this last fall, but ended up going a different route because of the cost and not knowing how well it would work. I also changed my plans to use a 5500w ripple element, which I doubt will fit in this method. Back when I used 2 120v heatsticks to brew I had to scrub them hard afterwards and being able to remove them to clean felt like a necessity. I ended up with Bobby's weldless enclosures which went against what I initially felt was important for cleaning. With the big ulwd's I have now it only takes a few wipes to get them clean and couldn't be happier with the cost/effectiveness/function. I look forward to your findings out of pure curiosity though!
OP
OP
What was your biggest cost when you tried it? Just curious if you remember.
I think it was going to be the cost of the larger camlocks that kept me from initially getting them, then I changed designs for my system from 120v to 240v and went with brewhardware's enclosure which is much cheaper and easier. It was kind of a leap of faith that the 5500w ripple elements were as easy to clean as everyone said they were...and they are. For the first month or two I had the cables hard wired to the kettles, which was a real drag as they added a lot of bulk and I was very careful to not put strain on them when moving them around. I just recently added a powercon connector to bobby's enclosure on the bk and it is awesome. It was a huge pain to get everything to fit inside, but now that it is done it rocks. Now to do the hlt...
OP
OP
The ripple element is the real issue there for you as far as fitment goes. I have one too currently on the element I got with my picoBrew eBIAB controller. You pretty much have to direct mount them.
The prices for CamLocks have come way down. $15 for stainless and $5 for aluminum. So I see them as a viable alternative to TC fittings which are more expensive.
I am working on finishing my write-up and doing a video. Haven't had time to work on either recently.
The prices for CamLocks have come way down. $15 for stainless and $5 for aluminum. So I see them as a viable alternative to TC fittings which are more expensive.
I am working on finishing my write-up and doing a video. Haven't had time to work on either recently.
OP
OP
Ok, so my update is well overdue, sorry!!
Here is the link to my DIY article (Downloadable PDF).
So a couple of things with the linked article to note:
Happy Brewing!
View attachment DIY Article - Electric Brewing Heater Element Using Cam & Groove Couplings.pdf
Here is the link to my DIY article (Downloadable PDF).
So a couple of things with the linked article to note:
- I took the "weld-less" out of the name of the article because I was not able to get a good seal on the kettle with a locknut, the "F" style cam & groove coupling, and several styles/materials of O-rings. So I ended up gluing the locknut to the outside of my aluminum kettle (for which this article is mainly focused, because if I had stainless kettles, I would have just soldered a threaded nipple on). I consider that a form of welding, but with an adhesive rather than metal filler and heat.
- I purposely left out costs of parts because: 1) I am not justifying this project based on whether or not it is cheaper than other options, and 2) because costs change frequently and people always seem to find prices cheaper elsewhere or prefer other vendors.
- The outlined procedure and final product has been tested with a couple different kettles and with 2" and 1-1/2" couplings. As a result I am satisfied with how it works and the relative safety of the device, at least as compared to other DIY projects. However consider this the typical disclaimer for projects dealing with electricity and water - use the instructions and resulting device at your own risk, do not exceed your capabilities, and play it smart - use a GFCI safety device and proper grounding with this and any other electric brewing device.
Happy Brewing!
View attachment DIY Article - Electric Brewing Heater Element Using Cam & Groove Couplings.pdf
BillKlineVT
Well-Known Member
Sounds interesting... Link is broken though
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Please explain the powercon connector - it's essentially an electrical plug right at the kettle, so you don't have to worry about the cord when cleaning, right? Is it watertight/safe? Is it rated to 30a/240vac? Where did you buy them? Sounds like an awesome idea, and something I will definitely include in my build...
OP
OP
It should have been just a downloadable PDF, works for me, but I will put it in a blog post and re-post.
So, something like this?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001RGVGEK/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
And the receptacle is hard wired to the element box at the kettle?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001RGVGEK/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
And the receptacle is hard wired to the element box at the kettle?
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OP
OP
Added the PDF document as an attachment.
View attachment DIY Article - Electric Brewing Heater Element Using Cam & Groove Couplings.pdf
View attachment DIY Article - Electric Brewing Heater Element Using Cam & Groove Couplings.pdf
Yes, they are rated for 240v 32amp. It is just an alternative method to doing triclamp or camlock fittings that others have been doing. The cable disconnects from the kettle leaving the element inside the kettle. Some like being able to remove the element for easier cleaning. As I've gotten away from smaller elements to now using the bigger 5500w ultra-low-watt-density (ulwd) ripple elements, I've found that they only need to be wiped off to get them clean. When I used the 120v high-watt-density (hwd) elements and even the low-watt-density (lwd), they needed a bit more vigorous scrubbing to clean them. Depending on your system size and equipment used, each method has its merits. The powercon connections are not water proof, but I would say they are water "resistant." The stars would really have to align for a boilover to be bad enough to reach the inside of the connections. In the unlikely event that this could happen (maybe if you submersed the entire running kettle in liquid?) the ground fault protection (which you should have for safety) would trip, provided you have wired everything correctly.
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Great write up btw!
Thanks. I am doing a kal clone 10/10/10 setup. Of course I'll have GFCI protection!
I just don't want to ever have a scenario where I would be "counting on" that protection. Though in your setup, might a plexiglass shield over the connection work at least for boil overs? Though maybe i would be more concerned with splashing from stirring the mash while doughing in, not seeing it, then turning on the bk element to a surprise... Or drips from the QD when taking off a hose, etc.That said I am actually not interested in easily removing the element - I'm interested in the ability to remove the cable from the kettle so I can clean them without a cord dangling. Although come to think of it, the box would still be cumbersome during cleaning as it is, so maybe the cord isn't such a big deal. So basically your recommendation is that if I get a ripple ulwd element, just hard wire it and plug in at control panel?
I have jammed a neutrik powercon terminal into my small enclosures if having the cable removable is that important to you.
When I said not waterproof, I meant that you can't dunk the whole outside of the kettle in water and expect it to work. Drips and sloshing should be more than fine with a little common sense. Any boilovers are going to run down the side of your kettle and maybe a little over the enclosures that stick out about 3", then run off to the floor. The powercon female ends are recessed in so it would take quite a bit to be able to travel to the contact points. With the smaller 120v elements cleaning was much more of an issue, with the ripple ulwd elements it is a piece of cake. A 4500w ripple would work very well for your size of batches, or the 5500w would get you to your temps faster. About the only element I haven't used is the 240v straight ones, so I can't say much about them, but they likely would be too long for your application.
This is what I did, but beware it is a tight fit! Love the final results though. Sleek and streamlined look. Looks like I bought it that way.
Thanks a lot, spellman and bobby. I think I'll probably go with Bobby's weld less enclosure, but I'll have to see about the disconnect. Last question for spellman: you mean it's a tight fit to make the wire connections from the element to the disconnect receptacle inside the enclosure, right? So once you have it set up, it is not difficult to remove the disconnect, correct? How did you mount the disconnect inside the enclosure so that it doesn't move around every time you connect/disconnect?
Sorry for so many questions! Just seems like such a damn good idea!
It helps to use the wire that's inside SJ cable because it's really flexible. The panel mount powercon32 has two screw holes on the flange. I ended up using appropriate sheet metal screws into the back of the canister.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought high power connections shouldn't be soldered. I thought I read on a post somewhere on here or Kal's site that soldering on the ring terminals causes overheating.
OP
OP
I think it depends on the quality of the solder joint. It is an optional step regardless. You don't even need the lugs, you could just screw down the wires under the screw terminals on the element. Crimped Terminals and solder just provide more structural strength to the electrical connection. If you over do the solder (allow it to wick up the wire as opposed to just the tip of the wire to the terminal), you can make the wire brittle. There is scientific evidence that with modern solders, amp loads over 100 amps can have electron migration, but the typical homebrew application shouldn't approach amp loads this large.
Soldering high current lugs: http://www.mightyboyev.com/High current Crimp Lug tips.htm
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Soldering high current lugs: http://www.mightyboyev.com/High current Crimp Lug tips.htm
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OP
OP
The main issues I have with the powerCon 32A, is one you are utilizing a live male connector (yes, I understand the live leads are protected, and that likely you will only connect/disconnect with the power off, but it is still a safety issue), and two they are not cheap at $30 per connector. Locking L6-30P connectors are $15.
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In fairness, the powercon cord end is $18 and the chassis mount female is $13. Let's say you hard wire at the element, even so, you can use the powercon 32 on the cord and put the female panel mount on the controller. That's $31. The L6-30P AND L6-30R pair will run around $25. Making up double male cords with the powercon32 is nowhere near the same as doing it with a pair of L6-30P. You'd have to try really really hard to touch the contacts, kind of similar to sticking a butter knife into receptacle.
