Decent Sour Beer with Malt Extract

[mikerlynch26]

Possible? I don't have the equipment any more for big batches, or full boils even, but I'd like to get a carboy or two of sour beer going. I know malt extracts have come a long way, but just wondering if anyone has a tried and true recipe for a decent golden/red sour base beer with extract and steeping grains. I can boil up about 3 gal at a time, so I can double up for a 6 gal batch.

I'm thinking of going with a sacc primary and then pitching a culture my friends have going in one batch and some dregs into another. Will there be sufficient protein/long chain sugars to support mixed brett/lacto/pedio cultures from extract? Anyone done this before and had wild success/unbelievable failure?

 

[shanecb]

You definitely can make a nice sour beer using extract. Like you said, extract has come a long way, and you can make a nice beer in almost any style using extract.

This might be a good starting place just to take a look at someone else's recipe: http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2015/11/extract-lambic-recipe.html

 

[porterpounder]

Can be done. Try a wheat extract (it's a blend of barely and wheat usually) and maybe some maltodextrine to add some long-chain snacks for the bugs.

 

[NTexBrewer]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=500143

Here is a link to a sour with extract that I brewed. Turned out great. Only have one bottle left so I may be doing this recipe again soon.

You should be able to scale the recipe and hops since I listed the hops as AAU.

I would think that taking any recipe and converting to extract would work well for a sour. If color is a concern then use more dry malt extract. I have always heard that extract has more dextrin compared to all grain so this again would be good for sours.

 

[rhoadsrage]

I love Jolly Pumpkin beers but bottles price keeps going up as the size goes down, so I can't afford to buy them like I used to. I used this Lambic recipe, but for yeast I made a starter out of the dregs from 3 bottles of fresh (within 6 months) Jolly Pumpkin beer, inwhich I ramped it up a few times.
I did a 5 gal. batch that turned out pretty solid, but after I pulled it off the yeast cake I poured another 5 gal. batch on top. That 2nd batch is amazing. More tartness, fruity brett flavors and lots of depth. I keep meaning to enter it in a competition but I keep drinking it.

 

[Weezy]

Sour? yes. (Wheat DME is all you need for a good Berliner Weiss). funky? not so much, since there isn't much complex carbs there for Brett to munch on long term. Adding maltodex, like mentioned, can help, but you might consider partial mash with some dextrinous malts like torrified wheat.

 

[NothingRhymesWithCurtiss]

I've had my eye on the Bruery Tart of Darkness kit from More Beer for quite a while https://www.morebeer.com/products/bruerys-tart-darkness-extract-beer-kit.html, and based on the reviews it seems more than "decent." Especially since a single bottle is over $20 here in Michigan.

 

[LakesideBrewing]

This

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=322168

Edit: Sorry, I just noticed this was already posted.

 

[burninator]

Sour? yes. (Wheat DME is all you need for a good Berliner Weiss). funky? not so much, since there isn't much complex carbs there for Brett to munch on long term. Adding maltodex, like mentioned, can help, but you might consider partial mash with some dextrinous malts like torrified wheat.

I'd have to disagree there. If he's co-pitching a mixed culture, the brett should get to work pretty quickly. Additionally, if I want brett character in, say, a saison, I let my primary yeast dry it out to 1.002-1.004 and then add brett. This method works great for getting that funky character. It's the esthers and phenols you're after, for letting brett do its thing.

 

[oli-aus]

I've just bottled a spontaneous fermented lambic style beer with wheat extract.
Funkiest beer I've ever made, great Brett aroma.
Also I've heard extract loses its fermentability for sach as it gets older, so that would be good for long term food for bugs.

 

[505-Brewer]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1481170800.725640.jpgView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1481170835.162370.jpg

Bugs seem to like extract plus maltodextrin just fine. This one is 6 months in.

 

[mikerlynch26]

That is some FUNKY looking pellicle you got there, impressive. I was definitely planning on using the wheat liquid extract, seeing as how it's really only 50-60% wheat. Anyone have any favorite steeping grains? I'm wondering what the real impact of them might be, I'm not sure things like pilsner or even flaked barley are going to add much in the way of complexity.

I was thinking of focusing on the phenols the brett would be working on later, so I was looking at using the Belle Saison strain for primary. I've had a lot of luck with that strain, takes it super dry, not temperature sensitive, and it doesn't throw as much of the banana that I hate in general. I am thinking of doing three main batches, one base sour, one fruited with cherries, and another with apricot or peach (whichever I can get my hands on). Any experience with this kind of approach? Should I be looking at a cleaner US-05 for primary to let the fruit shine through, or maybe split: US-05 for the soon-to-be fruited batches and Belle for the unfruited?

Shooting for a golden sour base, with tropical fruit esters and a solid tartness, but nothing berlinner-level.

 

[Weezy]

Here's a graph from Wild Brews simplifying the discussion of long term fermentation of mixed culture lambic brewing:

Note the FG at the end of the saccromyces cycle. 1.015? There's a good reason the Belgians use raw wheat.

 

[jfolks]

I brewed a lot of brett beers this year, but have yet to dive into pedio/lacto sours, but as far as brett beers go:

Extract brett beers are passable, but aren't nearly as good as solid all grain recipes. I make quick and easy brett beers using the wheat extract people have mentioned, but they just don't stand up to my all grain brett beers (I use about 40% 2 row, 40% vienna, and 20% rye). Adding fruit to extract brett beers really helps - makes for quite a crushable fruited brett beer.

So it's better than nothing, but not nearly as good as the real deal IMO

 

[secondbase]

I have an extract solera going. I use wheat extract and maltodextrin with aged hops. It's been about a year and I'm about to make my first pull. Aside from being a little too sour (pH 3.1) I don't think I could tell you it was an extract in a side by side comparison with my other solera project.

 

[kingwood-kid]

Most of my spurs are 100% 2-row, although sometimes I add oats. I think that the grain bill is not that important for these types of beers. I'm sure extract will be fine. The mix of microbes you add is the biggest factor in the beer. You just have to give them time and keep out oxygen while they work.