hedonist91
Well-Known Member
Hey Guys,
Ever feel like you go through so much preparation and then stuff still goes wrong on the brew day? Ugh. I had a couple issues this time, and they seem to be recurring, so I'm sure there's something I'm overlooking or that I shouldn't be doing. I figured I'd use you guys as sort of a sounding board. Worst part about this brew day is it was a buddy's first time doing all grain and I was supposed to be "showing" him how I do it so that when he upgrades to all grain he's got a grasp of it.
I run a HERMS, and I generally have all of the kinks out of the system, I did an IPA last week with a step mash and didn't have a problem. Not that I needed the steps but I wanted to see how my system reacted after tweaking/tightening it up. So no problems there. My system seems to HATE stouts. Every time I do a stout I get a stuck mash.
btw-this is a 10 gallon system, using a 20 gallon boilermaker w/false bottom for a mash tun.
Problem-Stuck Mash. Well, right before I got into dough in temperature, I thought I'd dump 2 lbs of rice hulls in, so they'd sorta go to the bottom of the tun, helping filter out the stuff that doesn't have hulls naturally in the mash (we were doing an oatmeal stout so, flaked oats, and some of the toasted grains that didn't have husks). I dumped them in all at once and it just balled right up and stopped the return flow of the herms instantly.
Lessons learned
-2 lbs of rice hulls seems to be excessive for a 18 lb grain bill. That was a lot of hulls.
-Don't dump them all in like a badass all at once and then decide to put the bag in the garbage, and casually come back to stir it all in. Balled right up. Even the hulls i discarded clogged my sink up. No mystery that they clogged up the herms.
Question/Comment-maybe I don't need rice hulls at all with this brew? I'm probably being paranoid about the oats and de-husked grains. I don't need it for grain bills that are 50% wheat, why would I need it for this? Hmm.
So then we ladle out all the mash water with a pot with a handle, clean out the mash tun (huge rice hull ball that collected all around and under the false bottom and near the valve), got rid of 90% of the hulls, and started again.
Seemed to be still some particles coming out of the herms coil, but we had pretty strong flow so our morale increased. Then, dough-in. So, things go smoothly, we hit our mash temp no problem, and then periodically, it seems that we loose flow. I mess with the bleeder valve, get it going again for a minute or two, and then it stops again. Play with the bleeder, repeat, and I keep doing that until I gather all of the wort in the mash tun at mash-out.
Things it could be-Rice hulls were stuck in the coil. they would move periodically, then find a new place in the coil to stick, causing the intermittent problems, and inconsistent, slightly successful flow.
-Our phantom stout problem, caused by a ghost living in the house who hates stouts.
-Insert actual reason here.
Lessons LearnedI wish I had something here for this one. This has only been happening with stouts. I do a hefeweizen that is 50% wheat, with no hulls, nothing and it doesn't stick the mash. I did an IPA last week, didn't stick the mash. Before every brew I run PBW through the coil and a rinse cycle to get the crap out. Nothing different on this brew. Again, I had our phantom "stout stuck" mash. No idea. The only way I'll know for sure is doing another stout. That's coming on Wednesday, so I guess I got my wish. The only thing I can think to do is better preparation, and run boiling pbw through it the coil, maybe hit it with an air compressor a few times, and run more boiling pbw through it again. And this time, no rice hulls at all. If I still have problems, and again, it seems to be only with stouts, I'm clueless.
Moving on now, to our sparge which was smooth as butter. Nothing stuck at all. At least we know the false bottom is doing its job, so we know whatever problems we were having in the mash was pump or coil related (although i take apart the head on the pump and pbw it every brew).
The boil moves on without a hitch, and we're ready to chill. ::sigh:: So, I've had problems with the chiller in the past. It's a dudadiesel large 40-plate chiller i got off ebay. Works great when it works, but it gets clogged, and I don't know why. Firstly, I use pellet hops. I clogged it in the beginning, when first using it and quickly realized I need to use a hop bag of sorts. So I adapted the paint strainer bag method, using a 4'' pvc coupling and suspending it over the top of my BK so I can chuck the pellets right in there. On this stout, there's only 2 oz of hops for 10 gallons, so I wasn't really concerned with clogging the thing. Furthermore, when we did eventually get to the bottom of the BK, there was no hop crud to be found. Before doing this brew, I had problems with the chiller, and followed the advice of many people on HBT, cooking my chiller in the oven at 550 for an hour, then boiling it in PBW. Got an amazing amount of crap out of it. Then, flushing it with water, I noticed there was more. I boiled it again in PBW, and flushed it with water, and it came out crystal clear. Then just running some regular pbw and starsan through it, and then flushing it with water and tasting it, i was satisfied that there were no flavors being imparted and we put it to use yesterday with the same clogging issue. Confused on this one.
Things it could be
-Even though I only had two ounces of hops in a 10G batch, hop pellets still found their way through the strainer bag, through the boil screen at the bottom of the BK, and into the chiller, clogging it. (not likely).
-Only whole leaf hops should be used, in a bag, when using a plate chiller.
-The cold break, because we're going from 200+ to 65 deg, is getting caught in the chiller. (more likely)
-Need to do a hot whirlpool before passing through chiller, to create a cone of anything that might be in there, even if I have a hop bag.
-There's still crap in the chiller even though I have water going in and coming out clear with no off flavors or anything, and I need to bake and boil it 5,854 more times until it's actually more than a really heave piece of 350 dollar stainless steel.
-I'm exceeding the flow rate for the chiller, and something inside doesn't like that. (Not likely, I think, because I pump PBW and starsan through it at the same rate).
-Wort thickness too much for chiller (not likely, it chilled about 7G's and then gave up.)
-The beer gods are making the chiller not work because every time we take it out someone has to sing "Chiller" to the tune of "Thriller."
Lessons Learned-Although very pretty and less ghetto looking than a CFC, or a submerged coil, with a jiffy mixer to whirlpool, it's problematic, harder to clean, and can't be taken apart like the commercial-grade brewery plate chillers.
Anyway, have fun with this one guys, I've done a lot of thread searching on these matters, but you know when you spend money and prepare and it still goes wrong? I hate that. Also, I don't feel like selling my chiller, which should work with all the prep I do, and getting something else.
Brew on homies.
Ever feel like you go through so much preparation and then stuff still goes wrong on the brew day? Ugh. I had a couple issues this time, and they seem to be recurring, so I'm sure there's something I'm overlooking or that I shouldn't be doing. I figured I'd use you guys as sort of a sounding board. Worst part about this brew day is it was a buddy's first time doing all grain and I was supposed to be "showing" him how I do it so that when he upgrades to all grain he's got a grasp of it.
I run a HERMS, and I generally have all of the kinks out of the system, I did an IPA last week with a step mash and didn't have a problem. Not that I needed the steps but I wanted to see how my system reacted after tweaking/tightening it up. So no problems there. My system seems to HATE stouts. Every time I do a stout I get a stuck mash.
btw-this is a 10 gallon system, using a 20 gallon boilermaker w/false bottom for a mash tun.
Problem-Stuck Mash. Well, right before I got into dough in temperature, I thought I'd dump 2 lbs of rice hulls in, so they'd sorta go to the bottom of the tun, helping filter out the stuff that doesn't have hulls naturally in the mash (we were doing an oatmeal stout so, flaked oats, and some of the toasted grains that didn't have husks). I dumped them in all at once and it just balled right up and stopped the return flow of the herms instantly.
Lessons learned
-2 lbs of rice hulls seems to be excessive for a 18 lb grain bill. That was a lot of hulls.
-Don't dump them all in like a badass all at once and then decide to put the bag in the garbage, and casually come back to stir it all in. Balled right up. Even the hulls i discarded clogged my sink up. No mystery that they clogged up the herms.
Question/Comment-maybe I don't need rice hulls at all with this brew? I'm probably being paranoid about the oats and de-husked grains. I don't need it for grain bills that are 50% wheat, why would I need it for this? Hmm.
So then we ladle out all the mash water with a pot with a handle, clean out the mash tun (huge rice hull ball that collected all around and under the false bottom and near the valve), got rid of 90% of the hulls, and started again.
Seemed to be still some particles coming out of the herms coil, but we had pretty strong flow so our morale increased. Then, dough-in. So, things go smoothly, we hit our mash temp no problem, and then periodically, it seems that we loose flow. I mess with the bleeder valve, get it going again for a minute or two, and then it stops again. Play with the bleeder, repeat, and I keep doing that until I gather all of the wort in the mash tun at mash-out.
Things it could be-Rice hulls were stuck in the coil. they would move periodically, then find a new place in the coil to stick, causing the intermittent problems, and inconsistent, slightly successful flow.
-Our phantom stout problem, caused by a ghost living in the house who hates stouts.
-Insert actual reason here.
Lessons LearnedI wish I had something here for this one. This has only been happening with stouts. I do a hefeweizen that is 50% wheat, with no hulls, nothing and it doesn't stick the mash. I did an IPA last week, didn't stick the mash. Before every brew I run PBW through the coil and a rinse cycle to get the crap out. Nothing different on this brew. Again, I had our phantom "stout stuck" mash. No idea. The only way I'll know for sure is doing another stout. That's coming on Wednesday, so I guess I got my wish. The only thing I can think to do is better preparation, and run boiling pbw through it the coil, maybe hit it with an air compressor a few times, and run more boiling pbw through it again. And this time, no rice hulls at all. If I still have problems, and again, it seems to be only with stouts, I'm clueless.
Moving on now, to our sparge which was smooth as butter. Nothing stuck at all. At least we know the false bottom is doing its job, so we know whatever problems we were having in the mash was pump or coil related (although i take apart the head on the pump and pbw it every brew).
The boil moves on without a hitch, and we're ready to chill. ::sigh:: So, I've had problems with the chiller in the past. It's a dudadiesel large 40-plate chiller i got off ebay. Works great when it works, but it gets clogged, and I don't know why. Firstly, I use pellet hops. I clogged it in the beginning, when first using it and quickly realized I need to use a hop bag of sorts. So I adapted the paint strainer bag method, using a 4'' pvc coupling and suspending it over the top of my BK so I can chuck the pellets right in there. On this stout, there's only 2 oz of hops for 10 gallons, so I wasn't really concerned with clogging the thing. Furthermore, when we did eventually get to the bottom of the BK, there was no hop crud to be found. Before doing this brew, I had problems with the chiller, and followed the advice of many people on HBT, cooking my chiller in the oven at 550 for an hour, then boiling it in PBW. Got an amazing amount of crap out of it. Then, flushing it with water, I noticed there was more. I boiled it again in PBW, and flushed it with water, and it came out crystal clear. Then just running some regular pbw and starsan through it, and then flushing it with water and tasting it, i was satisfied that there were no flavors being imparted and we put it to use yesterday with the same clogging issue. Confused on this one.
Things it could be
-Even though I only had two ounces of hops in a 10G batch, hop pellets still found their way through the strainer bag, through the boil screen at the bottom of the BK, and into the chiller, clogging it. (not likely).
-Only whole leaf hops should be used, in a bag, when using a plate chiller.
-The cold break, because we're going from 200+ to 65 deg, is getting caught in the chiller. (more likely)
-Need to do a hot whirlpool before passing through chiller, to create a cone of anything that might be in there, even if I have a hop bag.
-There's still crap in the chiller even though I have water going in and coming out clear with no off flavors or anything, and I need to bake and boil it 5,854 more times until it's actually more than a really heave piece of 350 dollar stainless steel.
-I'm exceeding the flow rate for the chiller, and something inside doesn't like that. (Not likely, I think, because I pump PBW and starsan through it at the same rate).
-Wort thickness too much for chiller (not likely, it chilled about 7G's and then gave up.)
-The beer gods are making the chiller not work because every time we take it out someone has to sing "Chiller" to the tune of "Thriller."
Lessons Learned-Although very pretty and less ghetto looking than a CFC, or a submerged coil, with a jiffy mixer to whirlpool, it's problematic, harder to clean, and can't be taken apart like the commercial-grade brewery plate chillers.
Anyway, have fun with this one guys, I've done a lot of thread searching on these matters, but you know when you spend money and prepare and it still goes wrong? I hate that. Also, I don't feel like selling my chiller, which should work with all the prep I do, and getting something else.
Brew on homies.
