Cost Effective?

[jdr01]

I just started my third step up on a starter. OLY-024, Belgian A. So far I have used four cups of DME. Two, two litre starters and now a five litre starter. The DME is about eighteen dollars for three pounds.
Seems like a lot of work and money. For 11 gallons of 1.070 wort I could almost get away with two packages of yeast.

Am I wrong. I think the only benefit is that I could save some of the starter for another beer.

Am I wrong?

 

[pshankstar]

I typically use about 200-225 grams (7-8oz) of DME for my average starter (+/- 2L starter in a 4L flask). I don't do multiple starters, just a single step starter. I overbuild my starters too so I can save half to use in a future batch. Yes this is about a half pound of DME but that gets me about 6 starters out of one 3lbs bag of DME. I haven't calculated the cost, but not having to buy a packet of yeast for each brew, I feel like I am saving money over the long run with this method.

Quickly trying to figure out what it costs me. My last 3lbs bag of DME cost about $15. If I can get 6 starters out of it, then each starter costs about $2.50. If I use one packet of yeast at $10 and use it six times, then each time it costs about $1.66. Therefore each starter runs me about $4.16 plus my time. If I add a pinch of yeast nutrient, that's pennies so I won't bother figuring that out. Now, yes the time factor plays a part in all of this, but I look at that as just part of my brew day.

Now I am looking at making pre-made starter wort following these instructions. I figure by doing this the cost will be in the same ballpark. If I can spend an evening or afternoon making a lot of starter wort, then it will make it easier and faster when the time comes to make a starter and this will be worth its weight in gold to me.

Anyhow, this is what I've been doing and it seems pretty reasonable to me. I'm not sure if this helps you out but maybe it will give you something to look into.

 

[jdr01]

That's great info. and it gives me some more to think about while I figure this out.
Thanks

 

[Chrisbrewbeers]

There's also some weird info I've read about yeast not actually multiplying in the expected way during this process. This info was from this forum and white labs said it. Debatable I guess but I can say that I believe repitching slurry is good practice, although use of whirlfloc tabs greatly dilutes it. Also many times I got a fresh liquid yeast and made 2 l starter had best fermentations. I just had a batch I pitched bry -97 in no whirlfloc and the whole yeast cake fit into a mason jar so it got pitched into the brew yesterday. See what happens I guess?

 

[pshankstar]

I forgot to mention this is for a 5.5 gallon batch. You stated you were doing an 11 gallon batch.

Also, what are you using to calculate the starters you need to make for your brew? I've been using the following site (http://www.brewunited.com/yeast_calculator.php) to determine the starter I need for my upcoming batch. It has served me well and I continue to follow it.

 

[MaryB]

I just looked at that calculator and it seems excessive to me. 4 step starter??? Why? How many chuck a packet of dry yeast in 5 gallons and turn out perfectly fine beer,note I am not talking competition level beer, just everyday beer to drink, will I notice the difference between a massive starter or just rehydrate and pitch. Instead of rehydrate I build a 1 liter starter but I have done it both ways and the only difference was about 12 hours of lag for just pitching. My taste is not that refined to pick one form the other!

 

[MaryB]

If you have deep freezer space you can make your starter and put it in pint or quart jars(depends on how big of a starter you need) then freeze it. Leave an inch of head space and don't tighten the lid down until after they have frozen. I thaw in hot water, add to my flasks and bring to a boil. Cool, pitch my yeast and go from there. But I don't worry so much about big starters as just making sure the yeast is viable and giving it a bit of a head start.

I typically use about 200-225 grams (7-8oz) of DME for my average starter (+/- 2L starter in a 4L flask). I don't do multiple starters, just a single step starter. I overbuild my starters too so I can save half to use in a future batch. Yes this is about a half pound of DME but that gets me about 6 starters out of one 3lbs bag of DME. I haven't calculated the cost, but not having to buy a packet of yeast for each brew, I feel like I am saving money over the long run with this method.

Quickly trying to figure out what it costs me. My last 3lbs bag of DME cost about $15. If I can get 6 starters out of it, then each starter costs about $2.50. If I use one packet of yeast at $10 and use it six times, then each time it costs about $1.66. Therefore each starter runs me about $4.16 plus my time. If I add a pinch of yeast nutrient, that's pennies so I won't bother figuring that out. Now, yes the time factor plays a part in all of this, but I look at that as just part of my brew day.

Now I am looking at making pre-made starter wort following these instructions. I figure by doing this the cost will be in the same ballpark. If I can spend an evening or afternoon making a lot of starter wort, then it will make it easier and faster when the time comes to make a starter and this will be worth its weight in gold to me.

Anyhow, this is what I've been doing and it seems pretty reasonable to me. I'm not sure if this helps you out but maybe it will give you something to look into.

 

[max384]

I just started my third step up on a starter. OLY-024, Belgian A. So far I have used four cups of DME. Two, two litre starters and now a five litre starter. The DME is about eighteen dollars for three pounds.
Seems like a lot of work and money. For 11 gallons of 1.070 wort I could almost get away with two packages of yeast.

Am I wrong. I think the only benefit is that I could save some of the starter for another beer.

Am I wrong?

There's no way two liquid yeast vials would even be close to the cell counts of a three step starter, ending at 5 L, unless your technique is way off. For liquid yeasts, it will almost always be cost effective to make a starter, as opposed to buying multiple vials. For dry yeasts, I've done the math, and you usually break even... Though I usually do starters for dry yeasts just so I am pitching more active yeasts. YMMV though.

 

[pshankstar]

If you have deep freezer space you can make your starter and put it in pint or quart jars(depends on how big of a starter you need) then freeze it. Leave an inch of head space and don't tighten the lid down until after they have frozen. I thaw in hot water, add to my flasks and bring to a boil. Cool, pitch my yeast and go from there. But I don't worry so much about big starters as just making sure the yeast is viable and giving it a bit of a head start.

This is another idea and I will keep it in mind. My biggest thing was wanting to make starter wort that is ready to be pitched when needed (no boil needed). Similar to the "Fast Pitch" product from Northern Brewer. This way all I have to do is sanitize the equipment, warm up the yeast to room temp, pitch the starter wort and place it on the stir plate.

 

[addled_mind]

I make up several batches of starter and can them. There was an article somewhere on here about doing it, and the author does it almost same way as I do.

I had about 10 pounds of LME that was old and probably oxidized so I didn't want to use it for brewing. I just made up about 2 gallons of starter (obviously didn't use all the LME) and put it into one pint Mason jars. Then I just used my pressure cooker and canned about five jars at a time, let them cool and then put them on the shelf. Now anytime I want a starter I just grab a jar, pour it into a flask, and pitch the yeast.

Edit: Found the link. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/wort-canning-to-save-time.html

 

[jdr01]

http://www.brewersfriend.com/yeast-pitch-rate-and-starter-calculator/
I have been using this one.

I always use whirlfloc. Did not know how it affected the yeast cake.