Considerations for switching to 10 gal batches?

[slcdawg]

I am considering buying a 15gal kettle to do 10 gal batches and want to make sure I have all my ducks in a row before going down this road. My primary goal is keeping costs at a minimum. I do not want to have to buy anything substantial, hoping most of my existing equipment will suffice. I'm very happy with my current setup - it produces great beer. I just want to increase output to reduce overall brew time. Originally I was just going to buy another turkey fryer and do 2 5gal batches simultaneously (offset by 45 min), but I found a great deal on a 15 gal aluminum kettle.

Current setup:
1. 7.5 gal kettle.
2. 50' 3/8" dia copper immersion chiller
3. BIAB - AG
4. Aerate by pouring between kettle and FV. This works awesome - no issues.

To buy:
1. 15 gal Aluminum kettle
2. Weldless fittings to attache a ball lock
3. New BIAB bag.
4. A tube and syphon sprayer to aerate since i can't pour 10 gal into a FV.

Questions:
1. Can I use my 50' immersion chiller in 10gal of wort? Or, will this just not be enough to cool it down?
2. I plan to use Beersmith to scale my recipes. Any other considerations? Anything I am missing in this plan?

 

[LandoLincoln]

1. Yes, I believe a 50' immersion chiller will still work fine for a 10 gallon batch. It'll just take longer.
2. Absolutely.

You can also aerate by rocking the FV buckets or carboys for 90 seconds each FV.

I can't really think of anything else that a 10 gallon batch needs that a 5 gallon batch does not, other than twice the FV space and twice the amount of ingredients. A bigger burner, perhaps? A backup propane tank?

 

[LandoLincoln]

Oh. You'll probably want a dip tube to go with that ball valve.

 

[finsfan]

you may consider using 2 or 3 BIAB bags as 20+ pounds of wet grain gets very heavy. also, if you are using a hose with your IC, you should get a big tub (cheap from walmart), put most of your hose in an ice bath in the tub for a pretty cheap pre-chiller for your water, should cut chill time down nice.

 

[slcdawg]

Thanks for the feedback. I was planning on a 50,000 BTU Burner. Probably the bayou classic square burner.

Good idea to submerge the house in ice water!

 

[Onkel_Udo]

you may consider using 2 or 3 BIAB bags as 20+ pounds of wet grain gets very heavy.

That or plan on using some mechanical advantage like a block and tackle or simple pulley. Of course this works best if you brew where there are exposed rafters. If you brew truly outside, build a collapsible tripod.

 

[finsfan]

Thanks for the feedback. I was planning on a 50,000 BTU Burner. Probably the bayou classic square burner.

Good idea to submerge the house in ice water!

go with the bayou classic which is 210,000 btu's! you will never have to upgrade again. I just purchased one and for a $100 its a steal, the thing is a tank! ive heard you can boil up to a bbl on it. I did 2.5 5gal brews on one tank of propane too, very conservative!

 

[slcdawg]

Maybe you missed the part about keeping costs down? would love a 200k BTU burner as well as a number of other upgrades but the goal is to use existing equipment if possible. Now if you're saying I can't boil 11 gal with a 50k BTU burner, then that is useful info.

 

[finsfan]

Maybe you missed the part about keeping costs down? would love a 200k BTU burner as well as a number of other upgrades but the goal is to use existing equipment if possible. Now if you're saying I can't boil 11 gal with a 50k BTU burner, then that is useful info.

im not sure about that cuz i do not have experience with a 50,000 btu burner. Im sure it could boil that much, it just may take longer and use more propane.

 

[cabbie92]

I'd recommend using the "can I mash it" website to get an idea on whether your recipes will fit in a 15 gal pot using BIAB. As a reference, I got a 15 gal pot to do 10 gal batches using BIAB and unfortunately I can't fit all my water and grain in the pot. I end up having to add/sparge water after my mash is done. In hindsight, I wish I had gotten a 20 gal pot.

 

[slcdawg]

Thanks for the feedback. Are you really only getting 2.5 5 gal brews on a tank of propane? I haven't counted, but think I get at least 6-8 5gal brews with my burner. Someday I'll get a banjo burner.

 

[TheZymurgist]

Fermentation space is another consideration, not sure whether you've factored that in or not. That's the only thing keeping me from doing 10 gallon batches since I use a temp controlled freezer that only has room for one carboy. If that's not an issue for you, then disregard.

 

[sweetcell]

also, if you are using a hose with your IC, you should get a big tub (cheap from walmart), put most of your hose in an ice bath in the tub for a pretty cheap pre-chiller for your water, should cut chill time down nice.

hoses don't transfer heat very well, so i wouldn't expect much benefit from this.

you should get a pre-chiller (just another immersion chiller) to put in the ice bucket/tub and run your water through that. or, get a cheap submersible pump, use a garden hose to feed the ice bucket from the top, and pump out from the submersible into a hose, and feed your IC with that. this will allow the water to have direct contact with the ice.

 

[slcdawg]

Good point. I do have to sparge now with my 7.5g kettle with a mash thickness of 1.5-2.0 qt/lb and was planning on the same process with a 10g batch. It would be nice to not have to sparge - but 20g is out of the budget.

I'd recommend using the "can I mash it" website to get an idea on whether your recipes will fit in a 15 gal pot using BIAB. As a reference, I got a 15 gal pot to do 10 gal batches using BIAB and unfortunately I can't fit all my water and grain in the pot. I end up having to add/sparge water after my mash is done. In hindsight, I wish I had gotten a 20 gal pot.

 

[slcdawg]

For budget comparisons:

Option 1: Buy another turkey fryer (burner and 7.5gal kettle) for $50 to do 2 5gal batches simultaneously. But this isn't upgradable (like my current setup).

Option 2: Buy a 50k BTU square Bayou Classic burner and 8gal kettle for $100. The burner would allow me to use a larger pot in the future if I ever wanted to upgrade and do 2 5gal batches simulataneously.

Option 3: Buy the 50k BTU burner and a 15gal kettle for $160. Do 1 10gal batch and 1 5gal batch simultaneously! :rockin:

Oh...the slippery slope of brew budgets.

 

[NathPowe]

Good point. I do have to sparge now with my 7.5g kettle with a mash thickness of 1.5-2.0 qt/lb and was planning on the same process with a 10g batch. It would be nice to not have to sparge - but 20g is out of the budget.

Just my two cents, and I hope this doesn't come across as snarky because it isn't meant that way, but if it were me I'd wait until the 20 gallon pot was in the budget. I've only BIAB'd a couple times, but for me the whole advantage of the method is not having to sparge. Just seems like sooner or later you're going to wish you had the 20gal. YMMV. Good luck with the upgrade and enjoy the brew.

 

[heywatchthis]

Honestly, since moving to 10 gallons myself, the biggest thing I would say to watch out for is that you have enough fermenters to handle all the beer you're gonna make. I run out of keg and fermenter space regularly now.

 

[DoWBrewer]

Moving to 10 gallon batches really changes things. I do 12-gallon batches, but I quickly bought a large Speidle Fermenter (16 gallon) and a pump. One of the things that I overlooked is that you really cannot lift the kettle safely when you go to 10-gallon batches. Everything will take longer, heating water, cooling and transferring. You also need to up your yeast count and probably need starters. Harvesting yeast from batches is even better because it saves a lot of money.

I would defintely go with a more powerful burner. I own these two:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001FTS32W/ref=s9_simh_gw_p86_d0_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=096PZCT6Y2EYB2M8QJ19&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=1389517282&pf_rd_i=507846

210K BTUs and it is $67. It does not sip propane, but you can bring liquids to a boil quickly and then turn the burner way down. I also wrapped the burner in tin foil to trap heat which helped.

For about twice as much money you can get this brew rig:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00264G584/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_9?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

I brewed on this for the first time this weekend and it was pretty great.

 

[slcdawg]

Good info! Really appreciate the feedback. Think I may buy a larger kettle now but just do 5gal batches until I can save up for a new burner. Then I can do no-sparge BIAB now as well as two staggered 5 gal batches. 10 gal batches will have to wait until the next purchase.

That brew rig looks sweet!