CO2 Wars

[RobbieOByrne]

CO2 is CO2 vs. CO2 is not totally CO2 vs. CO2 industrial grade Vs. CO2 Food Grade.

From what I've learned there are specific levels of impurities in Industrial vs. Food grade CO2. They do exist. I've contacted my local gas shop and Homebrew supply, both say they exist. Homebrew store said that he purchases food grade then runs it through an additional filter at his shop.

Let the wars begin, I ask you not to insult other posters. By wars I mean "discussion, debate, etc".

 

[AnOldUR]

For what it's worth, I used to buy (exchange) my CO2 from a weld shop, but I know they also supply the same gas for soda to at least three local restaurants.

 

[Peyope]

From what I've also read, co2 for welding need to be as pure as possible. I buy at a welding store and the owner has commented that he sells his 5# tanks predominantly for beer.

 

[NorthRiverS]

I have a paintball game supplier in the neighborhood. They refill CO2 tanks. How does this measure up for carbonating and serving beer?

NRS

 

[mikescooling]

When they sell CO2 they don't ask what it's for. The same tanks go to bars as the ones used for welding. If you can find and post different grades I'd love to see it? Take me to school.

 

[IPA-Hole]

Interesting...... Just went to the Airgas website and they have a whole slew of C02 grades - including of course Food Grade for beverage dispensing and Industrial for welding. Check out the various grades under Specialty Gases - Sheesh!!!!

http://www.airgas.com/category/Gases/_/N-82b?Nrpp=15

 

[mikescooling]

Interesting...... Just went to the Airgas website and they have a whole slew of C02 grades - including of course Food Grade for beverage dispensing and Industrial for welding. Check out the various grades under Specialty Gases - Sheesh!!!!

http://www.airgas.com/category/Gases/_/N-82b?Nrpp=15

What you linked was for the size of the tank. I used to get gas there, a 20lb tank gets swapped for a 20lb tank. Sheesh!!!! This is airgas description

"Item Details

Carbon Dioxide (CO2) - a nonflammable, colorless, odorless gas. Found in air at concentrations of about 0.03%, carbon dioxide may exist simultaneously as a solid, liquid and gas. Carbon dioxide is used as a shielding gas in the arc welding process. It's the source of the bubbles in soft drinks and other carbonated beverages. And it's used to fill certain types of fire extinguishers that rely on its inert properties, density, and low temperature when released from high pressure storage. In addition to its inert properties, carbon dioxide, as dry ice, is used to freeze a variety of foods. Carbon dioxide is sold by weight (lbs.) and available in high pressure and liquid cylinders, as well as Micro Bulk and bulk deliveries."

 

[grathan]

The biggest thing is probably how clean is the tank? I mean if Hydro is every 5 years and the last slob to use that swapped out tank siphoned some beer into it then let it sit warm for a couple months it doesn't matter what grade gas they fill it with.

 

[dnslater]

The biggest thing is probably how clean is the tank? I mean if Hydro is every 5 years and the last slob to use that swapped out tank siphoned some beer into it then let it sit warm for a couple months it doesn't matter what grade gas they fill it with.

Can this happen? I assumed the manifold would have some sort of a check valve to prevent 2-way flow of gas?

 

[hunter_le five]

For what it's worth, I used to buy (exchange) my CO2 from a weld shop, but I know they also supply the same gas for soda to at least three local restaurants.

Same here. I get all my CO2 from a local welders shop as the "LHBS" is in the next county over. I know they also supply some local restaurants. If it's good enough for them it's good enough for me.

 

[grainbill]

What you linked was for the size of the tank. I used to get gas there, a 20lb tank gets swapped for a 20lb tank. Sheesh!!!! This is airgas description

"Item Details

Carbon Dioxide (CO2) - a nonflammable, colorless, odorless gas. Found in air at concentrations of about 0.03%, carbon dioxide may exist simultaneously as a solid, liquid and gas. Carbon dioxide is used as a shielding gas in the arc welding process. It's the source of the bubbles in soft drinks and other carbonated beverages. And it's used to fill certain types of fire extinguishers that rely on its inert properties, density, and low temperature when released from high pressure storage. In addition to its inert properties, carbon dioxide, as dry ice, is used to freeze a variety of foods. Carbon dioxide is sold by weight (lbs.) and available in high pressure and liquid cylinders, as well as Micro Bulk and bulk deliveries."

Yeah, I checked Airgas out as well. Just bought a brand new 10# aluminum tank. Didn't like the idea of swapping out an unused tank for who knows what. The guy did say to use food grade. I do take it to a LHBS for refills of food grade. I use standard cartridges my 2 1/2 gal cornies when hauling up into the hills...

 

[grathan]

If the empty tank if full of air and they fill it with co2 without some sort of purge, what percentage 02 does the 99.998% pure co2 become?

 

[podz]

Some C02 is filtered for mercury, some is not. Scary stuff.

http://www.ecn.nl/docs/library/report/2012/e12054.pdf

 

[monkeyman1000]

So I called a couple of places around here because, frankly, threads like this are freaking me out. I am just getting into kegging and I had planned on using the paintball tanks since I am extremely tight on space. I already ordered everything and it is on its way. And then I see this thread and start reading others. Crap!! So I call the Oxygen supply place here in town and the Fire extinguisher place and they both told me that industrial grade is actually cleaner than beverage grade. The difference is who has control of the tanks. For it to be considered beverage grade the place you are getting the gas from has to have control of the tanks to ensure nothing funky has been put into the tank (they also clean them I guess). The also told me that a certain supplier of gas, I think it was Airgas, deals only with beverage grade, at least here in town. That put my mind at ease bc I know at least one of the paintball refilling places gets there CO2 from Airgas.

 

[j1n]

The biggest thing is probably how clean is the tank? I mean if Hydro is every 5 years and the last slob to use that swapped out tank siphoned some beer into it then let it sit warm for a couple months it doesn't matter what grade gas they fill it with.

Unless the tank was empty i don't see how this is possible.

 

[grathan]

right, full keg/ empty tank.

 

[j1n]

right, full keg/ empty tank.

Yeah, it would have to be kind of over filled so the in tube is below the beer.

Could have happened to me a couple months ago if i over filled my kegs. would have ruined my regulator too. Even though i don't over fill my kegs i never really thought about this happening.

 

[dnslater]

So regulators don't have check valves?

 

[Brew_Dude41]

I think that this whole debate boils down to the point of certification. Fact: There ARE all sorts of grades of co2 out there. I think it may come to the fact that not every provider meets the standards to call their co2 'beverage' grade. Just like food nowadays: there is organic, sustainable, free range, rainforest freindly....
What is the difference? It is a matter of opinion as far as I am concerned. Sometimes it is just something that you pay a ton of money to get the approval to use a stamp, and then sometimes there is a huge difference in the quality of products. I trust the country Butcher more than the big supermarket stock boy, but what are our options. Personally I am not big on certifications for the sake of certification. I know that my suppliers (gas and food) are reputable and have provided me quality goods. I don't need that sticker telling me it is eco-friendly, and the 'plain' CO2 works well for me.
If you want to spend the time, and pay a premium for it, you might be able find someone that has that grade of CO2 that will put your mind to rest.

 

[doug293cz]

So regulators don't have check valves?

The better regulators and manifolds do. Some don't, but they can always be added at the output. And, should be if the regulator/manifold didn't come with them.

Brew on

 

[brew_ny]

I have a paintball game supplier in the neighborhood. They refill CO2 tanks. How does this measure up for carbonating and serving beer?

NRS

some paintball places have an oil added to the C02 to lubricate the guns so I have read

ask I am sure they will tell you if they do or not

all the best

S_M

 

[63belair]

Does anyone have any documentation that states the hierarchy of the various grades? I've seen dozens of threads about this very same topic, and everyone assumes that industrial grade < food grade, but I've never seen a MSDS or any other sort of documentation verifying that this is the case.

FWIW I've always gotten my tanks filled at welding supply stores and I haven't grown a third ear (yet)

 

[brew_ny]

FWIW I've always gotten my tanks filled at welding supply stores and I haven't grown a third ear (yet)

that is good to know I was hoping for a third arm