Choosing a false bottom

[sallso10]

I have been building a ims system over the last couple of months and after finally completing the electric side of things, the last major purchase i need to make is the false bottom.

My pot is not made by a major manufacturer so I am faced with two options:

1. a domed (not perfectly fitted for my mashtun style false bottom from the likes of more beer/northern brewer etc or,

2. A customised perfectly fitted false bottom from norcal brewing solutions.

The price difference between the two is substantial so I am curious as to the benefits I will observe in opting for the custom one. Will this boost my efficiency compared to the domed option? does anyone have any experience in a similar situation that they could share to assist me in my decision?

Thanks in advance,
Steve

 

[cantrell00]

Mash tun have a flat bottom?

 

[sallso10]

Yes, perfectly flat

 

[cantrell00]

I'd go with a dome assuming the ID of the kettle isn't significantly larger the diameter of the dome.

I'd buy the one sold by adventures in homebrewing with the slits, not perforated.

I'd also rigidly attach it to bulkhead . Not with vinyl.

 

[Bmoney1215]

Nor Cal Brewing Solutions. Check them out. They do all sorts of custom orders, their false bottoms are really good quality. Dude drove a truck over one he made and it was not damaged at all.

 

[RM-MN]

The purpose of a false bottom, bazooka tube, or a manifold is to separate the wort from the grains. None of them are made to increase your brewhouse efficiency. If you want higher efficiency you create a system which can better deal with finer milling as the finely milled grains increase the amount of sugars that are converted and dissolved into the wort.

Your false bottoms are sexier, but a fine mesh bag will do a better job, will keep you from getting a stuck sparge, and will be much cheaper.

 

[cantrell00]

Sorry if I missed it but what sparging method are you going to do?

Fly sparging "should" provide a better extraction efficiency.

 

[blizz81]

The purpose of a false bottom, bazooka tube, or a manifold is to separate the wort from the grains. None of them are made to increase your brewhouse efficiency. If you want higher efficiency you create a system which can better deal with finer milling as the finely milled grains increase the amount of sugars that are converted and dissolved into the wort.

Your false bottoms are sexier, but a fine mesh bag will do a better job, will keep you from getting a stuck sparge, and will be much cheaper.

I'll second and add my experience here that on my RIMS with a 0.028" crush, even with a generous amount of rice hulls on a few beers, I ran into flow issues on my bottom-draining mash tun with a normal false bottom. I also would filter the output when draining because even after recirculating over the course of the mash, the first little bit I would drain both first runnings & batch sparge would have particulate matter.


I've started using a BIAB bag. I still put the false bottom in as I suppose it creates almost sort of a "grant" for the pump re: recirc and keeps the bag away from the suction (though if you didn't have one, I don't think you'd need one). I haven't had any issues since.


I'll note that 1) I condition my grain and generally have a fair amount of fluffy husk material in the bed, so I would say more lautering aid there vs. not conditioning and grinding husk material down and 2) the beers I had problems with weren't wheat or rye-heavy. I will also note that though I have pretty little space between my (120V 1500W LD) element and my temp probe in my RIMS tube, and use an Auber PID + SSR, I did experience scorching of the wort when I had flow issues. To me, it's not worth the worry of a "will this grain bill have flow issues / scorch" guessing game, and it's easier than trying to run a flow meter hooked up to the element, and also just generally more effective re: lautering. Pretty inexpensive too. Just my trials and tribulations, since you said you were RIMS.

 

[Bowtiebrewery]

So wait a second, are you suggesting that manufactured false bottoms like the Blichmann, norcal solutions, and others are inferior to a mesh bag?

I have an e-herms system and I never had a problem with my FB until I did a 35# grain bill with no rice hulls. I think someone like Kal might be valuable to chime in here since he has a the Blichmann false bottoms in his Mash tun.

 

[blizz81]

So wait a second, are you suggesting that manufactured false bottoms like the Blichmann, norcal solutions, and others are inferior to a mesh bag?

I have an e-herms system and I never had a problem with my FB until I did a 35# grain bill with no rice hulls. I think someone like Kal might be valuable to chime in here since he has a the Blichmann false bottoms in his Mash tun.

I'm more giving my personal experience than suggesting anything.


But, I suppose in general terms of construction, it seems with the BIAB bags that both the openings are far smaller, and there is a lot more surface area allowing liquid to flow through. In terms of brewing application, I'm not sure that a lot of brewers crush aggressive enough (or want to crush aggressive enough) that they are running into problems with traditional false bottoms. This brewer mentioned seeking higher efficiencies + RIMS, so I figured there was relevance.

Also in terms of brewing application, at least to me, if you did happen to run into a runoff / flow issue, lifting a bag up is a good deal more simple than trying to cleanly blow through to clear a stuck drain in a system piped for continuous recirc.

 

[Bowtiebrewery]

I've never had to blow through mine, however I see what you are saying. I personally am considering upgrading my mash tun as its currently a keggle. Maybe for my next brew I'll use a BIAB in addition to my domed false bottom and see what kind of performance I get out of it.

That would be a heck of a lot cheaper then spending $400-$500 on a new piece of equipment.

 

[cantrell00]

I have seen really high mash efficiency numbers (90%+) with rice hulls, HERMS recirculation, & the false bottom I mentioned in a earlier post. 10 gallon cooler.

Corona mill crush also. I attribute it more to the rice hulls & a really slow fly sparge than anything else.

 

[Bowtiebrewery]

I typically only fly sparge for 45 minutes... My patience starts to wear pretty thin at that point. I do 90 Minute mashes so I compromise and do a 45 min sparge.

It seems painfully slow to me though hahah

 

[LandoLincoln]

I have a 25g Concord pot with a Blichmann false bottom, btw. There is a 3/8" gap all around between the FB and the pot that needed to be filled, so I purchased a 3/8" thick piece of silicon hose and cut a slit along the length of it and that works just fine.

 

[cantrell00]

I typically only fly sparge for 45 minutes... My patience starts to wear pretty thin at that point. I do 90 Minute mashes so I compromise and do a 45 min sparge.

It seems painfully slow to me though hahah

You are not alone!

90 minute mash is tough too.

 

[douglasbarbin]

Morebeer also makes a custom false bottom

 

[RM-MN]

I typically only fly sparge for 45 minutes... My patience starts to wear pretty thin at that point. I do 90 Minute mashes so I compromise and do a 45 min sparge.

It seems painfully slow to me though hahah

That does seem slow. With the bag to be the strainer and milling as fine as I can, my mash is done in less than half an hour and I do a pour through sparge while the wort is getting to the boil. That seems a lot faster than your 2+ hours.:rockin:

 

[cantrell00]

Anyone game for a pissing contest?

Sheesh

 

[Bowtiebrewery]

That does seem slow. With the bag to be the strainer and milling as fine as I can, my mash is done in less than half an hour and I do a pour through sparge while the wort is getting to the boil. That seems a lot faster than your 2+ hours.:rockin:

Sigh... Wish mine was faster, but i can say that I am always measuring my pH and I can make mineral additions on the fly to compensate. Do you measure your pH at all"

Anyone game for a pissing contest?

Sheesh

More like a Sparging match...

 

[cantrell00]

Sigh... Wish mine was faster, but i can say that I am always measuring my pH and I can make mineral additions on the fly to compensate. Do you measure your pH at all"



More like a Sparging match...

Heh... Good point...

Two hours in my garage making beer is typically better than any two hours I spend doing something else.

Why the damn rush, ya know?

 

[Bowtiebrewery]

To be fair, My brewery is in my basement (electric) and I have a theater down there and can pretty much just set it and forget it on my end. Imagine Kal's setup but much less amazing... Kal is my hero... The only thing his basement is missing is a cigar room lol.

 

[RM-MN]

Heh... Good point...

Two hours in my garage making beer is typically better than any two hours I spend doing something else.

Why the damn rush, ya know?

Oh? You've never had a girlfriend? I could think of several ways to spend 2 hours than sitting in my garage doing most anything.

Sigh... Wish mine was faster, but i can say that I am always measuring my pH and I can make mineral additions on the fly to compensate. Do you measure your pH at all"

I've taken the pH several times but only at the start of the mash because with the fine milling I do the mash is over quickly. I take the pH of one, then make corrective additions to the next based on what I have seen from the previous one. By the time I get the wort cooled enough to measure the pH it's too late for any addition to have much effect.

 

[cantrell00]

Oh? You've never had a girlfriend? I could think of several ways to spend 2 hours than sitting in my garage doing most anything.



I've taken the pH several times but only at the start of the mash because with the fine milling I do the mash is over quickly. I take the pH of one, then make corrective additions to the next based on what I have seen from the previous one. By the time I get the wort cooled enough to measure the pH it's too late for any addition to have much effect.

Nah man. Not at all,

On top of your amazingly efficient 30 minute mashes you tag some poon too?

Excellent.

Puberty is such a rush bro,..

 

[RM-MN]

Nah man. Not at all,

On top of your amazingly efficient 30 minute mashes you tag some poon too?

Excellent.

Puberty is such a rush bro,..

Sure is! I get my first Social Security check next week.