Brewmation: An amazing turnkey brewery (not a Brew-Magic vs B3, but with comparisons)

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halucin8 said:
I have not received mine yet. He was short one vessel and had to wait for another production run from Polarware.

I can say that Kevin has kept me up to date on the progress of my brewery. He also had no problem using some stainless quick disconnects from my old system.

Hopefully my system will ship out this week.

BTW, anyone looking for 220V GFCI circuit breakers try superbreakers.com as they were almost $70 cheaper than anyone else.

Cheers!
Click to expand...

Halucin8
I am the third man in the "rat pack" waiting on the completion of the brewmation. I have had the electrician in already but he didn't install the 220V GFCI because he wanted to be "sure" I needed it. I guess he has ordered them in the past for customers who decide against in when they learn the cost. I was going to have him order it, but he said it was over $100. I am curious which one you ordered from superbreakers (model or part number would be helpful). Also, it looks like it is superbreakers.net not superbreakers.com.
 
I would seriously consider doing what I did (well, I did it, so of course I would):

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350138274590

30A Ground Fault Interrupt with Male Plug GFI Cord Cable from friesen.com

It's super beefy and $77 w/ free ship.

From what I understand most applications don't require a GFCI, so why not make it more 'part' of your brewmation (and thus more portable). The rig is so light/easy to put in my truck that I can see taking it over to a buddy's place to brew or something.
EDIT: The plug is a standard dryer plug, I think. Even if there's a GFCI wherever you go elsewhere (on someone's dryer plug), 2 in a row isn't going to be a problem, so I've been told. I just wouldn't want to not have one, at least.

Otherwise, the regular breaker, box, and wire was like a $25 Home Depot bill. I got it all myself so there is no opportunity for the electrician to upcharge for them. Just a labor fee.

My cable is $77 and that's pretty much what just a GFCI breaker would cost, too, so I'd say <$150 and that's a decent quote, but >$150 he'd be gouging you.
 
SankePankey said:
I would seriously consider doing what I did (well, I did it, so of course I would):

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350138274590

30A Ground Fault Interrupt with Male Plug GFI Cord Cable from friesen.com

It's super beefy and $77 w/ free ship.

From what I understand most applications don't require a GFCI, so why not make it more 'part' of your brewmation (and thus more portable). The rig is so light/easy to put in my truck that I can see taking it over to a buddy's place to brew or something.
EDIT: The plug is a standard dryer plug, I think. Even if there's a GFCI wherever you go elsewhere (on someone's dryer plug), 2 in a row isn't going to be a problem, so I've been told. I just wouldn't want to not have one, at least.

Otherwise, the regular breaker, box, and wire was like a $25 Home Depot bill. I got it all myself so there is no opportunity for the electrician to upcharge for them. Just a labor fee.

My cable is $77 and that's pretty much what just a GFCI breaker would cost, too, so I'd say <$150 and that's a decent quote, but >$150 he'd be gouging you.
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this is exactly what i was planning to do, then realized the dryer outlet in my apartment is old-school 3 prong. i'm hesitant to use it for brewing, because of safety considerations i've read on here
 
The brewmation does not use the neutral wire. It itself is only 3 wire. But Kevin thinks my GFCI cable would. So, I agree that you shouldn't plug the brewmation into a 3 prong without it having a gfci breaker in the box.
 
SankePankey said:
I would seriously consider doing what I did (well, I did it, so of course I would):

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350138274590

30A Ground Fault Interrupt with Male Plug GFI Cord Cable from friesen.com

It's super beefy and $77 w/ free ship.

From what I understand most applications don't require a GFCI, so why not make it more 'part' of your brewmation (and thus more portable). The rig is so light/easy to put in my truck that I can see taking it over to a buddy's place to brew or something.
EDIT: The plug is a standard dryer plug, I think. Even if there's a GFCI wherever you go elsewhere (on someone's dryer plug), 2 in a row isn't going to be a problem, so I've been told. I just wouldn't want to not have one, at least.

Otherwise, the regular breaker, box, and wire was like a $25 Home Depot bill. I got it all myself so there is no opportunity for the electrician to upcharge for them. Just a labor fee.

My cable is $77 and that's pretty much what just a GFCI breaker would cost, too, so I'd say <$150 and that's a decent quote, but >$150 he'd be gouging you.
Click to expand...

Did you have Kevin wire directly into the GFCI breaker cable, or did you do it yourself? I am wondering if I order it and have it sent to kevin if he can do it all? I like the idea of making it more "portable".
 
Kevin hooked me up. Send it to him, he'll custom it if you want it w/ twist locks or whatever for a nominal fee. Beware that it takes them about 7 days to ship it.

He would just wire it into the brewmation for free, I think.
 
Pulled the trigger on a custom build that I worked out with Kevin, who has been great. I'll start a new thread once I receive parts.
 
sicabeer said:
Pulled the trigger on a custom build that I worked out with Kevin, who has been great. I'll start a new thread once I receive parts.
Click to expand...

Would love to hear about it. Kevin told me some cool plans he had for future breweries. Please include a link on this thread so people may follow if they want.
 
SankePankey said:
Kevin hooked me up. Send it to him, he'll custom it if you want it w/ twist locks or whatever for a nominal fee. Beware that it takes them about 7 days to ship it.

He would just wire it into the brewmation for free, I think.
Click to expand...

SP
Could you post pics of what your cable looks like? I will likely do the wiring myself since I don't want to delay the finishing of my brewmation. It will essentially be an extension cord with a GFCI in it.
 
I can't post pics yet. Once I have some extra $... whenever that is.

I can't seem to find a cable on ebay, so they must just need to repost it.

The seller is:
http://myworld.ebay.com/friesen_auctions/
and the text of my auction was:
30A Ground Fault Interrupt w/ MPlug GFI Cable

Kevin put a surface mount box on the end of the GFCI so I could mount it onto my table and then plug the brewmation into it.
 
My build was for less. Although a future brewery is possibly in the works in the future (5yrs). My town has 0 brew pubs, 0 microbreweries, 1 tap room. I will start a new thread when I get the equipment. So, I ordered on Friday, I will follow up on this thread when the items ship. Realizing that this is not exactly the normal brewmation setup. I hate to say in some ways less impressive since it won't be AG. In some ways much more impressive, since it will not cause so much of an issue with SWMBO. Also Kevin is only 2 hours away from me, so support local, whatever that means / save delivery charges if I want to make the trip.
All I can say is that the square rig is really growing on me, I want a square SS conical fermenter. (also cleared out my PMs)
 
Chimone said:
way too long, didnt read

Anyone have pics?
Click to expand...

Man..? :confused: This is the second one of these on this thread. I never can understand why there is the time to post on a thread about not having time to read it. Thanks for the info, I guess.:drunk: The first paragraph has the brewmation website link with both pictures and videos. My explative details the full auto system which there is not much info about on the website past a paragraph (yet).

I just got my brewhouse a couple days ago and I'm not quite ready to go yet, certainly nothing to take pics of.
 
sicabeer said:
My build was for less. Although a future brewery is possibly in the works in the future (5yrs). My town has 0 brew pubs, 0 microbreweries, 1 tap room. I will start a new thread when I get the equipment. So, I ordered on Friday, I will follow up on this thread when the items ship. Realizing that this is not exactly the normal brewmation setup. I hate to say in some ways less impressive since it won't be AG. In some ways much more impressive, since it will not cause so much of an issue with SWMBO. Also Kevin is only 2 hours away from me, so support local, whatever that means / save delivery charges if I want to make the trip.
All I can say is that the square rig is really growing on me, I want a square SS conical fermenter. (also cleared out my PMs)
Click to expand...

It's funny. The brewmation seems to attract a similar kind of folk. I have the very same conclusions and desires re: my area. (Good think we are all about 2 hrs apart:D).
 
Will be picking mine up tomorrow night. My little brew room is essentially set up. I will likely brew a larger "starter" (and store the wort for starters) to do a dry run. Plan to brew a pilsener first (just built a stir plate and have a starter on it now - WLP800). Will post pics and a review.
 
Sweet. Congrats guys.

That's what I'm going to do too. Want to autoclave jars of starter wort like Jamil does.

I'm still waiting on some bits and pieces to arrive before I can start. You guys will probably be brewing before me on this thing.
 
where's the update on this one? I hope the owner is sending a technical manual for that in case it needs repair. After service is very important for automated stuff.
 
None yet. We are all still putting the bits and pieces together. I don't know about technical manual. There is a 6 page manual that's kinda laymans guide. I wouldn't think it's Kevin's responsibility to provide a technical layout of his entire system including electronics. If he did, we would be importing Chinese versions of his rig as we speak.

He provides 6 months warranty and after that it's a repair. All signs point to that he's going to be great to work with in the future. I certainly broached the topic with him of the 'dangers of buying such a proprietary system' but I think Kevin's going to do whatever it takes to support. I still haven't gotten the software modifications I requested, so I probably will be the last to do a post-review, even though I was the first to receive.
 
SankePankey said:
I wouldn't think it's Kevin's responsibility to provide a technical layout of his entire system including electronics. If he did, we would be importing Chinese versions of his rig as we speak.
Click to expand...

So if you tinker/try to repair your own rig, you have to reverse engineer the damn thing? I thought they looked cool before, but that is kinda BS.
 
K. I just inquired to Kevin about this. His response:

{In any event, I will be adding a technical section to the manual for spare
parts / troubleshooting. It's very straight forward for someone w/ a
technical background to trouble shoot.

Also, if there was a "major failure" in the control panel, the design is
such that the control panel and lower control box can be easily removed and
sent in for repair.}

And, either way, Kevin is very helpful to the tinkerer and can advise. I'm slightly modding my rig and he's given me a hand with info. I'm not modding the electronics though.
 
Well if he has some schematics in the manual that sounds good. The thing is you really need that manual. He may be great with support now, but his side business may fold, life changes happen, etc. Anyway, he may not be there to repair it. Then you are stuck with a kitchen sink. If you have schematics then it is a lot easier to repair it yourself, or be able to find someone to help you.

Wasn't trying to attack him in the prior post (not that you took it that way either). Just figured I should explain a bit more!
 
No worries. There will be a schematic.

Just to point it out again - No one should mistake me as a spokesperson for Brewmation. I'm just a customer who types fast.
 
Chimone said:
omgoodness, that much $$$ for a converted kitchen sink electric brewery?
Click to expand...

I vehemently disagree. I doubt you could build this for any less especially with the peristaltic pumps and adjustable power supplies. While I am not a fan of this brewery, it does have some pretty neat technology like the metering pumps that allow you to pump a precise volume of liquid. I think people sometimes forget how expensive it is to build something here in the US and also forget that the poor guy is trying to sell this to make a profit. If you look closely at the brewery it has much more functionality than the B3 or Sabco neither of which measure volume or can be totally automated. This is the only brewery commercially available to homebrewers that I know of that offers total automation other than adding grains and hops. You can DIY a brewery that is totally automated but it is not a simple task.
 
Sawdustguy said:
I vehemently disagree. I doubt you could build this for any less especially with the peristaltic pumps and adjustable power supplies. While I am not a fan of this brewery, it does have some pretty neat technology like the metering pumps that allow you to pump a precise volume of liquid. I think people sometimes forget how expensive it is to build something here in the US and also forget that the poor guy is trying to sell this to make a profit. If you look closely at the brewery it has much more functionality than the B3 or Sabco neither of which measure volume or can be totally automated. This is the only brewery commercially available to homebrewers that I know of that offers total automation other than adding grains and hops. You can DIY a brewery that is totally automated but it is not a simple task.
Click to expand...

Dude, Ive had 3 sculptures.....I have a pretty good idea of what you should get from what you pay for. The price is entirely too much, especially for an uncreative, no style....kitchen sink setup. Sure it makes beer, but so does everything else.
 
Chimone said:
Dude, Ive had 3 sculptures.....I have a pretty good idea of what you should get from what you pay for. The price is entirely too much, especially for an uncreative, no style....kitchen sink setup. Sure it makes beer, but so does everything else.
Click to expand...

To each their own. From what I've seen, it is a good product at decent price. Some cool stuff included.

Have your 3 rigs been automated to the same degree? Did you pay yourself for the time you took to research/build/procure parts? Did you include a profit?

I do agree that it lacks any aesthetic style though.
 
It's really a rig for those who care more about utilitarian flare than aesthetic. If you can find a kettle that naturally drains at the bottom, etc, like a sink, that would work as good and be prettier, then go for it. And good luck with the programming knowledge. Maybe if you brew in Arizona and find it preferable to brew outdoors- cool, but I can brew indoors in the freeze ass weather in New York for 5 of the 12 months of the year where I otherwise would fight wind and cold. For the most part, I have a level of consistency that mimics a real brewery, not one who has to deal with stupid variables like pilot lights blowing out. (And, I can get the chores done while waiting for the boil alarm to go off..;))

Lets just call it the "Honda Element" of brewhouses (hehe, that's what I drive). You're either into it or your not. For what I got, I think it's a fair price. Especially for what I was going to lay down for a propane rig. And other than that they are unmistakably sinks, I think the aesthetics are just fine. There are a couple of things I'm going over with Kevin that I think need altering, but they are not big things (they are mostly aesthetic, actually). I will leave that for the follow-up review.
 
What is attractive about a keg converted to a kettle? Can you carry a B3 or Sabco system with your wife? Using electric heating elements make for a more efficient and quiet system that doesn't need a heavy duty kettle or old keg. Instead resources are directed towards automation and convenience. As said before on this thread, the system isn't for anyone. But, to my knowledge there is no commercial system with this degree of automation (you have the control to be as hands on as you like). This system has a core "brain" to monitor the whole system. I understand that people love the systems they have or have created. The system Kevin has designed and innovated is what I was looking for, and I could not design a better system and certainly could not build it cheaper. His website does not do it justice. It needs a youtube video to show it in action...
 
RDWHAHB said:
Have your 3 rigs been automated to the same degree? Did you pay yourself for the time you took to research/build/procure parts? Did you include a profit?

I do agree that it lacks any aesthetic style though.
Click to expand...

research? Build? Procure parts?

Why pay yourself for the time and research? The build is all of the fun. ANd the internet provides you with any info you may need. Now with that said, on my current rig I just simply told Morebeer which options I wanted and sat back and waited for delivery.

Im not saying the brewing process that rig uses isn't up to par or anything, Im sure its pretty high tech. All Im saying is that for that price you should get yourself some high dollar vessels and engineering, not some Home Depot kitchen sink.
 
I'm not trying to fuel any flames here.. I know some would rather just buy a rig 'off the shelf' than DIY, but it does seem expensive. Those pumps are cool but can only move ~12 gallons an hour.. That is way to low for how I run my setup.

The rig is a unique idea, but I guess it just isn't my cup of tea.. Much prefer the look of keggles I guess.

Oh, and if anyone is interested, i have about $1,500 in my 2.0 rig, sans programming..
 
SankePankey said:
I have a level of consistency that mimics a real brewery, not one who has to deal with stupid variables like pilot lights blowing out.
Click to expand...

Just so I understand this correctly, you have never brewed on any system correct? B3, Magic, or the one you say you have now?
 
SankePankey said:
It's really a rig for those who care more about utilitarian flare than aesthetic. If you can find a kettle that naturally drains at the bottom, etc, like a sink, that would work as good and be prettier, then go for it. And good luck with the programming knowledge. Maybe if you brew in Arizona and find it preferable to brew outdoors- cool, but I can brew indoors in the freeze ass weather in New York for 5 of the 12 months of the year where I otherwise would fight wind and cold. For the most part, I have a level of consistency that mimics a real brewery, not one who has to deal with stupid variables like pilot lights blowing out. (And, I can get the chores done while waiting for the boil alarm to go off..;))

Lets just call it the "Honda Element" of brewhouses (hehe, that's what I drive). You're either into it or your not. For what I got, I think it's a fair price. Especially for what I was going to lay down for a propane rig. And other than that they are unmistakably sinks, I think the aesthetics are just fine. There are a couple of things I'm going over with Kevin that I think need altering, but they are not big things (they are mostly aesthetic, actually). I will leave that for the follow-up review.
Click to expand...


You brew inside? Hows that working out for you? Im assuming you spent quite a bit on a full CIP system so you dont have to deal with any sort of bad weather correct?

You're rig is doesn't do anything the other rigs do beside cost more and use a kitchen sink
 
Wow, there's a lot of hating in this thread. If it aint your money who cares? Why bash something you've never used or will never buy?
 
Lonnie Mac said:
Just so I understand this correctly, you have never brewed on any system correct? B3, Magic, or the one you say you have now?
Click to expand...

Yes, Lonnie. The force is strong with this one, but he is not a jedi yet. I have been dually lambasted for my lack of first hand knowledge on another thread. I am no stranger to fermentation and distillation equipment, bright tanks and bottling lines having been a cellar rat for a few years, but the brewing process is something I'm new at. I did however spend about 8 months trying to figure out which was the best route to go with ~$4k and thought my experience might be beneficial to (mostly) newbies and people who dig electric rigs. Most of the things I say are just my opinion and I don't mean that they come from years of tinkering with gear (i.e. exactly what I'm hoping to avoid...).

But you can't deny that unless you are brewing in your garage (which I think you do) you are going to have an issue with pilot lights, are you not? (Also and assumption, you can deny :))

As I had mentioned before, I actually took your brutus plans to a couple local welders (single tier with a tippy dump mod on the mash tun) and was appalled at the prices I was quoted just for the frame alone. Also, I was unwilling to wait 12 weeks for a B3, cause I would have purchased one if not (until I got into the idea of electric). Sabco never really interested me, not that it's not a great rig. It just seems, well... overpriced.

For those who think that the DIY aspect is the funnest part of the process, I think that's really great. I'm just not in that crowd. Maybe some day when I get the knowledge I need to do all that stuff, but I'd rather concentrate on brewing now. Life is a learning process.
 
Chimone said:
You brew inside? Hows that working out for you? Im assuming you spent quite a bit on a full CIP system so you dont have to deal with any sort of bad weather correct?

You're rig is doesn't do anything the other rigs do beside cost more and use a kitchen sink
Click to expand...

I will be brewing inside. And I do have a full CIP system with integrated keg washer (also CIP). Other than what came on the brewmation, I spent $63.

I wasn't trying to be hating on you, by saying "Arizona" or anything, but just pointing out that it's probably more logical for you to brew outside than me. I still want to brew beer in the winter (and I don't have a garage).

Peace man. You aren't interested in my review or the rig. Totally cool.
 
SankePankey said:
Yes, Lonnie. The force is strong with this one, but he is not a jedi yet. I have been dually lambasted for my lack of first hand knowledge on another thread. I am no a stranger to fermentation and distillation equipment, bright tanks and bottling lines having been a cellar rat for a few years, but the brewing process is something I'm new at. I did however spend about 8 months trying to figure out which was the best route to go with ~$4k and thought my experience might be beneficial to (mostly) newbies and people who dig electric rigs. Most of the things I say are just my opinion and I don't mean that they come from

But you can't deny that unless you are brewing in your garage (which I think you do) you are going to have an issue with pilot lights, are you not? (Also and assumption)

As had mentioned before, I actually took your brutus plans to a couple local welders (single tier with a tippy dump mod on the mash tun) and was appalled at the prices I was quoted just for the frame alone. For those who think that the DIY aspect is the funnest part of the process, I think that's really great. I'm just not in that crowd. Maybe some day when I get the knowledge I need to do all that stuff, but I'd rather concentrate on brewing now. Life is a learning process.
Click to expand...

No actually. I have never to this day had a problem with my pilots. So sure, I can deny that. On a real windy day, maybe (and of course) they will blow out, (who cares) but you actually gotta go to an outside phun-brew-in to be one my friend and I go to many brew-outs... You won't be bringing your rig anywhere... :)

So it seems that a statement or two has presumed that you will push a plastic led button, do a bit of laundry and out pops a brand new AHA Gold medal award winning beer from this end-all-be-all system, that you otherwise could not accomplish. Yea, though I have a few Golds myself, there are PLENTY of fellas out there kicking my arse at comps all day using two plastic brewing buckets.

Just wanted to make sure that you know you will be making consistently bad beers as well as consistently good beers just as we all do on any system. And I want the noobs whom this thread seems to be geared for to know that as well. Personally, I like to see everyone start out with two plastic buckets but thats me...
 

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