Brewery Pump

[Hoppslover]

Has anyone used this pump. Any reviews or concerns I should have about this pump? http://www.ebay.com/itm/24V-6m-19ft...9be7b9a:g:jPQAAOSwqu9U1KoV&afsrc=1&rmvSB=true

 

[poptarts]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=375904
This is the thread you are looking for.

 

[ThomasPaine]

I just purchased one from Amazon. I got all ss connections and a valve. I am planning on using only for recirculating. I am planning to get it all screwed together and tested this evening or tomorrow. I'll post a video

 

[dude_brewery]

Has anyone used this pump. Any reviews or concerns I should have about this pump? http://www.ebay.com/itm/24V-6m-19ft...9be7b9a:g:jPQAAOSwqu9U1KoV&afsrc=1&rmvSB=true

I currently am using this pump to recirculate and sparge out my mash. (Doing five gallon all grain batches with an igloo cooler mash tun) I've used my pump for about 5-10 brew sessions, and have not had any issues.

A couple of really thick mashes required some coaxing of the lines to get the sediment laden mash started through the pump, but most of my mashes have cycled through without any trouble at all.

It has sufficient power to overcome any rise in height your set-up may have.

I can get it to mash out at about a half gallon per minute by partially closing my valve. And without any kinks/restriction to the lines, it easily pumps at about 1-2 gpm.

I'm happy with it (but have also never shelled out for a chugger pump, so cannot directly compare the two).

 

[Owly055]

This is basically the same pump I used in my "suck start" recirculating BIAB system. The pump works great once primed. The idea in my case was to use copper pipe to feed the pump. From the pump which was on the stove top, a pipe went up, and over and down to the bottom of the pot, then a short distance horizontally under a false bottom. The outlet of the pump was a hose, and I simply sucked on the hose to get the wort flowing through the pump, and then the hose returned the wort through to the mash. The circulation worked extremely well, and circulated the wort past a thermocouple that ran a hot plate to maintain mash temp.

The only issue I had with this system had nothing to do with the pump, it had to do with the bag clogging with fines. I'm NOT an advocate of recirculating BIAB for this reason. This system used a valve on the pump outlet which allowed me to hook my hose up to a return manifold built into a lid for the tun. Once the pump is primed, it remains primed. The false bottom is critical....... a bag sucked up against the inlet will kill the flow.

People scoffed at "suck start" and I had all kinds of comments about scalding your mouth, sanitation, etc....... all of which were utter nonsense. Mash temps of 150 or so do not pose any real risk, about the serving temp of coffee, nor is it necessary to get a mouthful of hot wort to start the siphon. Sanitation is obviously NOT an issue as you are boiling the wort after the mash.

Seems to be a good pump, but I didn't run it that long...... My next plan is an "in bag circulator" using what in effect is a "trash pump" that will move grain as well as wort.

H.W.

 

[augiedoggy]

Has anyone used this pump. Any reviews or concerns I should have about this pump? http://www.ebay.com/itm/24V-6m-19ft...9be7b9a:g:jPQAAOSwqu9U1KoV&afsrc=1&rmvSB=true

I have 3 of the 12v versions and then upgraded to the better 24v versions and they work great. I have mine plumbed into my setup with camlocks and use them for all my tranfers as well as recirculating through my rims and transferring boiling wort through my plate chiller and never had an issue.... I normally brew 6 or 11 gallon brews with them.
as long as you pre filter the grain from getting in them and use the correct power supply voltage which meets the minimum amp requirement you should be fine with them.

the 24v version is capable of 3.2 gallons per minute.... I have a flow meter inline to my mashtun from my rims and it usually reads 1.8-2gallons perminute while pulling through the false bottom and stainless braid screen I put under than to catch whatever falls through the false bottom... considering the 3 height its pumping from the rims up and the fact that its pulling through the grainbed that very good and the perfect flow rate in my opinion for steady even temps.

BTW hooking two up in a series does raise the flow about 1/3rd.... so you can get about 4-5 gallons per minute with two pumps. I use pwm speed controllers to control flow rather than mechanically restricting them with ball valves which increases wear.

 

[Owly055]

I have 3 of the 12v versions and then upgraded to the better 24v versions and they work great. I have mine plumbed into my setup with camlocks and use them for all my tranfers as well as recirculating through my rims and transferring boiling wort through my plate chiller and never had an issue.... I normally brew 6 or 11 gallon brews with them.
as long as you pre filter the grain from getting in them and use the correct power supply voltage which meets the minimum amp requirement you should be fine with them.

the 24v version is capable of 3.2 gallons per minute.... I have a flow meter inline to my mashtun from my rims and it usually reads 1.8-2gallons perminute while pulling through the false bottom and stainless braid screen I put under than to catch whatever falls through the false bottom... considering the 3 height its pumping from the rims up and the fact that its pulling through the grainbed that very good and the perfect flow rate in my opinion for steady even temps.

BTW hooking two up in a series does raise the flow about 1/3rd.... so you can get about 4-5 gallons per minute with two pumps. I use pwm speed controllers to control flow rather than mechanically restricting them with ball valves which increases wear.

I do not agree that mechanically restricting flow increases wear........ Unless someone's dumb enough to do it on the suction side and get cavitation. Restricting flow on the pressure side unloads the pump.... One of the principles of centrifugal pumps and fans..... You can observe this easily by the sound....... Pump RPM goes up..... that indicates less load, less strain on the motor, an amp meter will confirm this. You are deceiving yourself if you think using a PWM is easier on the pump / motor than throttling the output...... I work with pumps all the time.

H.W.

 

[ThomasPaine]

[ame]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=neYwVru6HTE[/ame]

 

[ThomasPaine]

I did a small test run. Works very well. You can thread silicone hose onto the pump with no leaks.

 

[PlexVector]

this is the speed controller I use for my 24V DC pump. Works great and the display reads 0-100. I use it for recirc and makes it easy to get back to a previous setting and easier to control than using a ball valve.

Motor DC 6-30V
12V 24V Max 8A PWM Speed Controller
With Digital Display & Switch (261678264066)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/26167826406...l?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=261678264066&_rdc=1

 

[cilestiok]

I do not agree that mechanically restricting flow increases wear........ Unless someone's dumb enough to do it on the suction side and get cavitation. Restricting flow on the pressure side unloads the pump.... One of the principles of centrifugal pumps and fans..... You can observe this easily by the sound....... Pump RPM goes up..... that indicates less load, less strain on the motor, an amp meter will confirm this. You are deceiving yourself if you think using a PWM is easier on the pump / motor than throttling the output...... I work with pumps all the time.



H.W.

Agreed. Magnetic pumps typically have to center themselves when turning off and restarting as well. A PWM will actually shorten the life of the pump due to shortcycling.

 

[chudsonvt]

this is the speed controller I use for my 24V DC pump. Works great and the display reads 0-100. I use it for recirc and makes it easy to get back to a previous setting and easier to control than using a ball valve.

Motor DC 6-30V
12V 24V Max 8A PWM Speed Controller
With Digital Display & Switch (261678264066)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/26167826406...l?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=261678264066&_rdc=1

I tried a 12V pump for the first time on Saturday. I was controlling with a ball valve and it was definitely interesting to say the least. I didn't realize these controllers were available so cheap!I just ordered one of these PWM controllers. Thanks for posting!

 

[PlexVector]

Agreed. Magnetic pumps typically have to center themselves when turning off and restarting as well. A PWM will actually shorten the life of the pump due to shortcycling.

DC motors are typically controlled by variable voltage or PWM.

 

[chudsonvt]

DC motors are typically controlled by variable voltage or PWM.

Right, and if the PWM is generating a hard, ON OFF, it can actually be filtered with a capacitor to cause it to to be a DC voltage (with some serious ripple, of course). I have designed PWMs for running fans at various drive strengths. Brushless DC motors may not operate properly if the DC is too low. Another alternative is to have a very low frequency for the PWM. However, I do not think that is an option with the recommended PWM. It is fixed at 17kHz. So I will run it either as it or put on an oscilloscope and check to see what the waveform looks like and maybe throw on some capacitance.

 

[PlexVector]

Right, and if the PWM is generating a hard, ON OFF, it can actually be filtered with a capacitor to cause it to to be a DC voltage (with some serious ripple, of course). I have designed PWMs for running fans at various drive strengths. Brushless DC motors may not operate properly if the DC is too low. Another alternative is to have a very low frequency for the PWM. However, I do not think that is an option with the recommended PWM. It is fixed at 17kHz. So I will run it either as it or put on an oscilloscope and check to see what the waveform looks like and maybe throw on some capacitance.

I was planning on designing a PWM, but when I saw that controller it was worth the risk for how inexpensive it is. I could not DIY it for that! If it didn't work I was going to use it on some LED lights. The reason I went with the small DC pump was to get more control on my re-circulation, which it does very well. Next rainy Saturday I plan to do gpm curve based on the PWM percentage on the display and maybe even with different head pressures.

Edit: @chudsonvt, I was a little worried about the frequency when I ordered it, but for a small motor I didn't expect the inductance to be a problem, as it turned out not to be. I wouldn't worry about a cap--that could be problematic since your driving an inductive load. That little motor seems to have no issues with straight PWM drive. That said I should probably hook up the current probe and look at the signal on the scope.

 

[augiedoggy]

I do not agree that mechanically restricting flow increases wear........ Unless someone's dumb enough to do it on the suction side and get cavitation. Restricting flow on the pressure side unloads the pump.... One of the principles of centrifugal pumps and fans..... You can observe this easily by the sound....... Pump RPM goes up..... that indicates less load, less strain on the motor, an amp meter will confirm this. You are deceiving yourself if you think using a PWM is easier on the pump / motor than throttling the output...... I work with pumps all the time.

H.W.

You have every right to your opinion, My experience have been increased restriction on the pump impeller to push harder (even on the pressure side ) puts more of a side load on the shaft and bushings... I Too have been dealing with pumps a long time especially this type of pump which is often used in aquariums...I have a box of dead pumps and parts from my reef tank. Yes turning them off and on wears them out faster (as I learned years ago with my wave maker) But with pwm this doesnt really happen to this damaging degree since the motor does not stop moving between pulses like a full on off cycle.

In any case my argument would be, $5 24khz pwm controller is more precise, cheaper and has less maintenance than a ballvalve which needs to be disassembled and cleaned...

I have many many hours and about 55 brew sessions as well as hours of pbw cycling time on my pumps and no signs of wear or issues in the last 3 years... at $18 a piece with shipping I believe its a moot point.

 

[augiedoggy]

I was planning on designing a PWM, but when I saw that controller it was worth the risk for how inexpensive it is. I could not DIY it for that! If it didn't work I was going to use it on some LED lights. The reason I went with the small DC pump was to get more control on my re-circulation, which it does very well. Next rainy Saturday I plan to do gpm curve based on the PWM percentage on the display and maybe even with different head pressures.

Edit: @chudsonvt, I was a little worried about the frequency when I ordered it, but for a small motor I didn't expect the inductance to be a problem, as it turned out not to be. I wouldn't worry about a cap--that could be problematic since your driving an inductive load. That little motor seems to have no issues with straight PWM drive. That said I should probably hook up the current probe and look at the signal on the scope.

The pwm control often gets flack here because of the common black non food grade topsflo style "solar" pumps have MPPT booster tech designed to buck voltage and increase current to the motor will not work well at all with pwm controllers especially the ones with lower frequencies designed for dimming leds and not driving motors... the speed control with these is often very poor and less linear from my experience. I tried a few different types and frequency pwm controllers and some do work better than others... I have one for my DC driven stirrer and for my diy stirbar setup as well.

I looked at the ones you have but honestly my 12x12 panel is just too packed now.

 

[PlexVector]

Yea I got two pumps and two controllers with the other as backup, but I took my stirrer apart and it uses an lm317 with a pot on the feedback to control speed, so I'm thinking of using the other controller with the display to spice the looks up as well as know what the relative speed of the stirrer is.

 

[chudsonvt]

Yea I got two pumps and two controllers with the other as backup, but I took my stirrer apart and it uses an lm317 with a pot on the feedback to control speed, so I'm thinking of using the other controller with the display to spice the looks up as well as know what the relative speed of the stirrer is.

I think we hi-jacked this thread, lol.

That is nice idea. Be careful if you decide to re-use the LM317 circuitry for something else. Being an LDO regulator, if you have too great of current with too great of an input to output voltage drop, the IC will exceed its rated wattage and burn out.

 

[augiedoggy]

I think we hi-jacked this thread, lol.

Well We answered his question so.... The thread had kinda ran its course when another thread with more info was linked.

I ordered another pump myself as a spare since I found one for under $18 shipped... these seem to be creeping up in price for the most part, it seems people are catching on that they are a great value.