Boiling Over?? more newbie questions

[curbdawg]

Newbie here with a few more questions. I'll be making 10 gallons of cider I got from my local orchard. I have 2 plastic 5 gallon Carboys and 2 plastic 6 gallon fermention buckets with lids. I remember back in the day helping my stepfather make cider in 50 gallon Whiskey barrels and there was a point of "Boiling Over" were we let it foam out the top before airlocking the bunghole. Am I going to want to let my carboys boil over after pitching the yeast and sugar? When I fill my carboys should they be airlocked right away?

Question 2:. Is racking off mostly just for getting all the clear juice from one container to another, while leaving all the setiment in your primary fermenter?
Do you airlock your secondary or just bung it and let it sit. Sorry for all the questions. Thanks in advance.

 

[Yooper]

I just cover my fermenter with a loose clean towel during the early phases of fermentation- the "primary" phase when fermentation is really kicking and co2 is actively being produce. After about 5-7 days, though, it should be airlocked to prevent oxygen from effecting it. Oxygen is very good in the beginning for yeast reproduction, but bad after fermentation is about 1/2 finished (since the yeast are no longer using that o2 and the fermentation becomes anaerobic) and oxidation can then ruin your cider.

Racking is simply siphoning from one container to another, so that you remove the cider off of the lees- the dead yeast and other things (like protein, etc) that sit on the bottom of the vessel. Leaving wines and ciders too long on the lees can cause off-flavors from the decaying yeast. I rack about every 30-45 days whenever I have lees, or earlier if the lees are 1/4 inch thick (not common for cider, but more for fruit wines).

Let us know if you have any more questions!

 

[Tink]

Yooper helped answer some of my questions too. So is there a rule of thumb or hard and fast rule for when to airlock the carboy? You mentioned 5-7 days, but what's the guideline for when to add it. I've got mine open right now (just the rubber stopper in) while it boils over (although after day 1, there hasn't been any more movement up the neck of the carboy).
And then for racking off, is it just when the SG has stabilized for a few days in a row?

Sorry, as an engineer, I like rules!

 

[curbdawg]

THANKS! So the guy at the beer and wine shop said to put a hose in my bung and then into a bucket of water while it foams over. Would that get enough oxygen? Should I be adding cider as the old cider foams out? On average how much sugar gets converted on the primary phase? Thanks again

 

[Yooper]

Yooper helped answer some of my questions too. So is there a rule of thumb or hard and fast rule for when to airlock the carboy? You mentioned 5-7 days, but what's the guideline for when to add it. I've got mine open right now (just the rubber stopper in) while it boils over (although after day 1, there hasn't been any more movement up the neck of the carboy).
And then for racking off, is it just when the SG has stabilized for a few days in a row?

Sorry, as an engineer, I like rules!

As a rule, I airlock when the SG gets to 1.020-1.010. That way, plenty of oxygen was available during the primary phase, but after fermentation slows down it's protected by airlock. If you don't have a hydrometer, this usually happens in about 5 days but not always! You can tell when fermentation is winding down, though. It'll be churning less, and less foamy. Sometimes that happens in just a day or two, sometimes a week.

THANKS! So the guy at the beer and wine shop said to put a hose in my bung and then into a bucket of water while it foams over. Would that get enough oxygen? Should I be adding cider as the old cider foams out? On average how much sugar gets converted on the primary phase? Thanks again

You could do that- it's called a "blow off tube", but no oxygen will get in there. It's commonly used for beer and other more explosive fermentations. No harm will come if you do that, but I just cover with a clean towel until it's ready to have an airlock.

I wouldn't add more cider as it foams out- you'll just keep cleaning up more foam. You can wait until the biggest part of fermenation is over, then top up with more cider if you need to. On average, how much sugar gets converted in the primary phase? I'm not sure I know what you're asking. I mean, eventually all of the available sugar will be fermented out if the yeast can handle it. So, you might get as low as .990 (completely dry) in just a few days. Or, fermentation can go much slower, and it'll putt along for three weeks. I'm not sure there is a correct answer to your question.

 

[curbdawg]

Thanks again. I guess my question was more on if you can go dry just of the primary fermentation. After the foaming calms down I will check the SG and see were I'm at. Hopefully my cider will be ready today, I have to call the orchard. I didn't think i'd be this excited about my first batch!

 

[Tink]

Thanks again, Yooper. So I don't have much foam anymore, which was what was worrying me. I took an SG this morning and it was 1.052 (OG-1.060). I locked it only because I have no foam anymore, and from what I understand the foam is the protection from bacteria and other junk getting in there. I still have lots of little bubbles heading up to the top of the juice, but no more foam. Not sure if locking it now was the right way to go. Hopefully I won't come home from work to find my airlock blown off!

 

[curbdawg]

So my Belgian yeast cider took off right away and foamed hard for 2days. The foam become very light and airy so I decided to bung and air-lock.

The other cider which I used a Hefeweizen is just starting to work 2 days later.

Should I let the 1st cider go longer without air-locking?

edit: The foam was a lot lighter than this picture

 

[gratus fermentatio]

I try to avoid blowouts/foaming over simply because it's very messy. I always leave some room in my primary fermentation vessel (head space) for just this reason & top up later if needed. Regards, GF.