BIAB Dunkelweizen

[EllisTX]

Brewed and all grain Dunkelweizen last night. For about 10 lbs of grain I used 2 nylon paint bags instead of the one large one. I was scared to death about efficiency but ended up with 74%. This was my first all grain. It's bubbling away like crazy right now. The only thing is that I boiled off about a gallon more than I was expecting.

 

[Brewman79]

Good job

 

[EllisTX]

Thanks. Unfortunately my 66-68 degree spot in the house has warmed up about 5 degrees in the past week. I've had to rig up a swamp cooler to keep the temps down. I hate to say it but I need it to be cold for another month.

 

[ultravista]

What do you use for mashing (tun) and boiling?

 

[EllisTX]

What do you use for mashing (tun) and boiling?

I did everything in my 10 gal brewpot. It was just barely big enough for all the water and grain. Mashed with my full water volume adjusted for boil off and absorbtion.

 

[kable]

Isn't the BIAB, Full Volume, No Sparge pretty cool. I have done a couple a brews (.054, .065) and have had good efficiencies. Did you mill your own grain very fine or just standard milling from LHBS like I did?

 

[EllisTX]

Isn't the BIAB, Full Volume, No Sparge pretty cool. I have done a couple a brews (.054, .065) and have had good efficiencies. Did you mill your own grain very fine or just standard milling from LHBS like I did?

I don't have an LHBS but I ordered it milled from AHS. No special grind. Great way to start all grain.

 

[Brewman79]

I sparge when doing a BIAB

 

[kappclark]

I want to try this = who sells the bags?

 

[tippetsnapper]

I want to try this = who sells the bags?

Paint strainer bags are available at Lowes/Home Dizzler

 

[kable]

I went to Joann's and bought a yard of the curtain voile material that a lot of people have been referencing. Then you just need to sew it into a pillow case. Sew it extra strong so that there isn't any risk of ripping a stitch while pulling out 20lbs of wet grain. Fold over the top and sew in a small pocket along the top for a draw string.

The rule of thumb is that your pot should fit inside the bag. The grain should have full access to your pot and the bag is just there to help you pull the grains out.

 

[gunner65]

Careful this BIAB thingy is addictive! I hit 78 percent this past weekend never got close to that batch sparging.

 

[iijakii]

I have a proper Rubbermaid MLT and still prefer BIAB.

Cheers,
welcome to the club.

 

[gunner65]

I have a proper Rubbermaid MLT and still prefer BIAB.

Cheers,
welcome to the club.

Yep that is what I have sitting in the tool shed too.

 

[ASantiago]

Please pardon my ignorance, but what exactly is "BIAB"? I see it all over the place.

 

[gunner65]

BIAB=Brew in a bag

which means just that. All grains go into mesh bag and are mashed at full wort volume then the bag is removed and the boil started in the same vessel. It makes AG brewing a single vessel process and produces relatively high efficiency. Also, the beer turns out just fine.

 

[iijakii]

Please pardon my ignorance, but what exactly is "BIAB"? I see it all over the place.

It's a method of AG brewing that uses a single-vessel and no-sparge. You place your total water volume in your boil-kettle and then line it with a bag and dough-in and mash like any other AG. Then you simply remove the bag, let it drain a bit, and voila! AG.

It's the easiest, simplest way to get into AG brewing. There really isn't any downside to it besides the lack of bling-factor. Which, I won't lie. If I had $4,000 to spend on brewing I'd have a badass automated 3-vessel system as well. The biggest negative you'll hear about BIAB is that you get lower efficiency. Sure, maybe compared to RIMS and what not, but most people easily manage your standard 70s, and it's not too difficult to get low 80.

 

[ASantiago]

Wow... Never heard of BIAB before. Other than effort level (including less cleaning), how does it compare with "standard" mashing (you know, converted 10 gallon cooler, batch sparging, etc, etc)?

And if it is equivalent, why would anyone do it any other way?

 

[gunner65]

Wow... Never heard of BIAB before. Other than effort level (including less cleaning), how does it compare with "standard" mashing (you know, converted 10 gallon cooler, batch sparging, etc, etc)?

And if it is equivalent, why would anyone do it any other way?

"The world may never know"

It compares fairly well. I just hit 78 percent never got close to that with my mashtun cooler. Could I have kept going with my mashtun and hit those numbers evetually ABSOLUTELY! I just started reading about BIAB one day and thought I would give it a try and loved it. I was making amazing beer (too me) before and now I am still making amazing beer. There are many factors that play into any style of brewing no matter what level of equipment you can afford. There are people that win contests with extracts there are people that make crappy beer with three vessel systems. Knowledge and technique make great beer. If you want a lot of info on BIAB check out BIABinfo.com

 

[ASantiago]

"The world may never know"

It compares fairly well. I just hit 78 percent never got close to that with my mashtun cooler. Could I have kept going with my mashtun and hit those numbers evetually ABSOLUTELY! I just started reading about BIAB one day and thought I would give it a try and loved it. I was making amazing beer (too me) before and now I am still making amazing beer. There are many factors that play into any style of brewing no matter what level of equipment you can afford. There are people that win contests with extracts there are people that make crappy beer with three vessel systems. Knowledge and technique make great beer. If you want a lot of info on BIAB check out BIABinfo.com

Gotta love this hobby. There is always something new to learn.

I'm dead smack in the middle of my move to "traditional" AG, so BIAB will have to wait. But it will definitely be on my mind.

BTW, I tried to go to the BIABinfo.com web site you indicated, but it's either down or the name doesn't exist. Can you verify it?

 

[gunner65]

Gotta love this hobby. There is always something new to learn.

I'm dead smack in the middle of my move to "traditional" AG, so BIAB will have to wait. But it will definitely be on my mind.

BTW, I tried to go to the BIABinfo.com web site you indicated, but it's either down or the name doesn't exist. Can you verify it?

Sorry it was .info

http://www.biabrewer.info/

 

[ASantiago]

So, let me get this straight...

1. You put all the grains, including adjuncts, into a big a** bag.
2. You put the bag in the water (preferably a boil kettle with the full amount of water)
3. You heat up the water to the appropriate temperature, including any rests you want to have along the way.
4. You steep the bag in the water for the same amount of time you would on a regular mash schedule.
5. You take the bag out (letting as much of the sweet stuff drip out as possible).
6. You get the same efficiency as a regular mash.
7. You proceed with the rest of the brewing process.

This simple? Did I miss something?

 

[gunner65]

So, let me get this straight...

1. You put all the grains, including adjuncts, into a big a** bag.
2. You put the bag in the water (preferably a boil kettle with the full amount of water)
3. You heat up the water to the appropriate temperature, including any rests you want to have along the way.
4. You steep the bag in the water for the same amount of time you would on a regular mash schedule.
5. You take the bag out (letting as much of the sweet stuff drip out as possible).
6. You get the same efficiency as a regular mash.
7. You proceed with the rest of the brewing process.

This simple? Did I miss something?

You missed nothing except you can squeeze the bag and if you so choose you can leave a couple of gallons out of the mash and heat seperately to do a sparge in a second vessel but I do not do this. The Aussies (who invented this method) do a no sparge no chill method and pitch the yest the next day.

 

[gunner65]

Doubled

 

[ASantiago]

No chill as well? They just let the wort sitting there for several hours while it cools down? What about the risk of bacterial infection? What about the cold break?

This is bewildering...

 

[starrfish]

You got it!

Doing my first full BIAB mild this weekend... I am using the 19"x36" filter bag. however I may use a 10gal rubbermaid cooler for the mash. (1) because I just got it & (2) I'm not sure how well my burner will hold a low temp like 150° for an hour with out going over... never tried to hold a specific temp on that burner (Square 14" Bayou Classic). Usually crank it up and get it to a boil ASAP! Adjustments seem difficult.

I don't think I'd be doing big beers this way, but milds, bitters and wheats in the mid-low gravity range should be just fine.

I will be Immersion chilling... I've done the no chill thing in the past pour off into bucket top off with cold water seal the bucket and pitch the next morning. never had an issue, but now that I've found immersion cooling... I've never looked back!

 

[jeffmeh]

FYI, the BIAB write-up that sold me is here.

 

[EllisTX]

The one big think with BIAB is whether or not to squeeze the bag or not. Do any of you squeeze your bags?

 

[gunner65]

No chill as well? They just let the wort sitting there for several hours while it cools down? What about the risk of bacterial infection? What about the cold break?

This is bewildering...

Just think of it this way....Did the middle aged Monks have plate chillers, ICs, or CFCs? Our methods for quick cooling were developed relatively recent as far as brewing is concerned. You will get cold break using modern chilling methods that goes into our fermenters no problem thus far.

 

[gunner65]

The one big think with BIAB is whether or not to squeeze the bag or not. Do any of you squeeze your bags?

I squeeze, spin, then squeeze again, till I go blind

 

[ASantiago]

Just think of it this way....Did the middle aged Monks have plate chillers, ICs, or CFCs? Our methods for quick cooling were developed relatively recent as far as brewing is concerned. You will get cold break using modern chilling methods that goes into our fermenters no problem thus far.

I get the gist of what you are saying and agree.

<Joking>On a related note, I'm always skeptical about references to how people used to do it before. No one knows what the beer monks made centuries ago really tasted like. My money would be on them tasting a lot closer to cr*p than we imagine and I'd bet even bigger on beers made before that.</Joking>

 

[gunner65]

I get the gist of what you are saying and agree.

<Joking>On a related note, I'm always skeptical about references to how people used to do it before. No one knows what the beer monks made centuries ago really tasted like. My money would be on them tasting a lot closer to cr*p than we imagine and I'd bet even bigger on beers made before that.</Joking>

I dont think they were as bad as you would imagine.

 

[EllisTX]

I squeeze, spin, then squeeze again, till I go blind

This was my first BIAB and I gave it a gentle squeeze but I was afraid to really wring it out.

 

[gunner65]

This was my first BIAB and I gave it a gentle squeeze but I was afraid to really wring it out.

Dont be shy sqeeze that puppy!

 

[jeffmeh]

I pull the bag, throw a grill grate on top of the kettle, twist the top of the bag and tie it off so that it is small enough so that all the dripping will go into the kettle, and squeeze away.

 

[Bombo80]

Well, I just did a widmer hef clone yesterday. I really like the ease of BIAB, but my efficiency was terrible. I got under 50%, ended up with 4 gallons instead of 5, and missed my OG by 5 points. I think it will still turn out to be a great beer, it's just that the effieincy is bothering me.

I was doing more of a modified BIAB. I started with 4 gallons of water heated to 130, then added my grains and stirred them in for my protiein rest and I didn't wrap the keggle, I figured for 30 minutes it wouldn't loose that much. Boy was I wrong. After I added 2 more gallons of water at 191, I still had to turn the heat on full for 10 minutes to get it to the 152 degree mark. The hard part of mashing in the garage in Feb. in Minnesota. Once I got to the mash temp. I stuck the keggle in a box and wrapped it with an old sleeping bag. I only lost 3 degrees in an hour. Pretty good there. I then added my last 1.6 gallons of water at 195, and still needed to put the heat to it to actually get to 170 for the mashout.
Once that was finished I just pulled the bag and hung it over the keggle and let it drip the entire boil time. when it was all done, I just dumped the grains in a small garbage bag and put the keggle outside in the snow bank for a while, covered of course. Once it had cooled off a bit, I brought it back into the garage and let it sit on the concrete for a few more hours before taking it to the basement. This morning I racked the wort into my sanitized fermenter, checked my SG (1.042 adjusted for temp) and checked the temp too (87). I thought that was pretty good and pitched my yeast that I had started in about 10 oz. of wort. We'll see how it looks when I get home tonight.

So I don't know where I am going wrong, and getting such bad efficency numbers. I am milling my grain myself, and if anything I am going too far, but I actually sift out most of the flour created from the milling process. I hit my mash temp perfectly. Kind of strange, but I have three more brews ready to go, so we'll see how things change with them.

 

[jeffmeh]

So I don't know where I am going wrong, and getting such bad efficency numbers. I am milling my grain myself, and if anything I am going too far, but I actually sift out most of the flour created from the milling process. I hit my mash temp perfectly. Kind of strange, but I have three more brews ready to go, so we'll see how things change with them.

Why are you sifting out the flour from the milling process? I believe that the flour contains is a relatively significant amount of the starch to be extracted. That may be your problem.

 

[gunner65]

Why are you sifting out the flour from the milling process? I believe that the flour contains is a relatively significant amount of the starch to be extracted. That may be your problem.

Agree!!! You are losing all the sugary goodness. If you are doing BIAB you dont have to worry about the flour. I do a double grind on my barley crusher set to factory settings 0.039 it comes out pretty much powdered. I have was hitting mid 70s with AHS crushes and as high as 78 with my own mill. I think you will still have a very drinkable brew just add the flour to the next one.

I personally see no need for a protein rest in BIAB but it does not hurt anything. Just heat your water a few degrees higher than mash temp and drop your grains in. I do a 170 mash out but not the protein rest. Oh and sqeeze the bag! LOL

 

[RM-MN]

Please explain in simple terms why you need a protein rest and mash out while doing brew in a bag with well modified grains. If you bought your grain from a decent maltster, you won't have undermodified grains that need protein rest. When your remove the bag of grains from the kettle, you have "mashed out" as the enzymes that you intend to denature by mashing out have been separated from the grain. Grind or crush your grain finely and put it all in the bag. With this fine grind or crushed grain, you will achieve saccrification very quickly with good efficiency. Any of the fine particle of grain that might get through the bag can be ignored as they will end up locked in the yeast cake and won't cause you any trouble with the exception of a possibility of a slight haze the could be noticed in competition.

 

[Bombo80]

I guess I sifted out the flour to keep it from collecting in the bottom of the keggle. I didn't even think about what I might be getting rid of.

As far as a protein rest and mash out, I was just going by what the recipe called for. I'm not sure if it was because of the wheat malt. This is my first hef ever, so I was just following the recipe.

I also thought if I just hung the grain bag over the keggle during the boil, I wouldn't have to squeeze anything. It seemed pretty dry at the end of the 60 minute boil.

So for the next brew I am going to have to do some other calculations for my water volume, so I can hit my 5+ gallons into the fermenter, and not worry about the sediment in the bottom of the keggle. I also must have had a higher boil off rate than initally calculated, so I will increase that number too.

BTW, I sewed my bag from a cotton/polyester blend voile. It turned out great, and is strong as heck.