Beers are too sweet

[ghank15]

So I have been brewing for almost a year and a half. My results have been pretty good, and some batches have been better than others. I hoped that once I made the jump to all grain, my results would improve by a pretty good margin.

However, they haven't. Don't get me wrong, my beers are quite drinkable. But they are much sweeter than what I was hoping.

Over the winter, I brewed 4 lagers and 2 ales. I used a sizable yeast starter for 2 of the lagers and 1 of the ales. For the remaining batches, I used multiple vials of yeast, so I know my cell count was pretty good. My OG for all of them were around 1.050 (except for a maibock, which ended up being a dopplebock because I got ridiculous efficiency, that was 1.080), and they all finished between 1.010 and 1.013 (the maibock/dopplebock finished at 1.020, so I get why that is sweet).

So any tips as to why my beers are tasting sweet? For ales, I ferment 2-3 weeks at proper temp, and allow for at least 3 weeks of bottle conditioning. For lagers, I ferment for 4-6 weeks, transfer to secondary after doing a diacetyl rest, and lager for another 4-6 weeks.

I also use beersmith to make sure my numbers are right, but I have also used the IBU formula that is in Designing Great Beers after I realized I might be going low on the IBU's, but all my numbers are resulting in balanced beers for the styles I have been brewing, which have all been German styles (vienna lager, maibock, altbier) and ESB.

Anyone else have this problem? Any hints? Do you need any more info, like recipes or my mash procedure or anything? Thanks for any help.

 

[ghank15]

By the way, I barely use any crystal malt. At most, I use .5 pounds for a 5 gallon batch, but usually it is much less. In the aforementioned Maibock, I only used Pilsner and Munich. I brewed my last lager as a SMaSH with Vienna and Spalt, and its still a little too sweet.

 

[jbsg02]

You didn't mention your mash temps. It very may well be that your thermometer is reading low and you are mashing a lot higher than you think. Check your thermometer against some others or if you want to spend the dough, a lot of people absolutely love their thermapens.

 

[mredge73]

What is your typical mash temperature?
Maybe try going closer to 148F-150F for a dryer finish.

Water can also play a role in perceived sweetness.
Maybe try a different water source.

Increase the bittering hops; you may be able to pick up sweetness better than the average person so you may need to cover it up with a little more IBUs than suggested.

The beers that you have been brewing are designed specifically to showcase the Malt flavor that can be perceived as sweet; they are probably closer to style than you realize. All use Munich or Vienna which have strong malty tastes. Do your next smash with regular 2-row or Pilsner.

 

[ghank15]

Oooh sorry. I forgot to mention that. I have a thermapen. And I've actually been mashing low. Like between 147 and 152 at most. At boiling, the thermapen reads within a degree of 212, and if I stick it in Ice water its very close to 32.

 

[ghank15]

I think my water is ok too. My water comes from the same place that the local brewery uses (I wonderful german style brewery that makes german style beers called Ramstein). I've checked the waterprofile, and there isn't too much chlorine or anything, there is no chloramine, I'm not sure about the PH or anything though. I have also used bottled water occasionally and haven't noticed a difference.

 

[ghank15]

I think that increasing my hops might be a good idea, but i'm always afraid i'm going to make the beer too bitter. Maybe I should slowly push the envelope with the hops and go a little bit more bitter until I fix the problem.

Any thoughts?

 

[mredge73]

You can try throwing half of your Aroma/Flavoring hops in as First Wort Hops (pre-boil)
You will get IBUs equivalent to a 20 minute boil and retain most of the flavor and aroma.

Or just start increasing your IBUs by X% until you have it dialed in.

I never had Ramstein; but it looks tasty. Anyway, most of your modern breweries have RO systems installed and will create their own water profile designed to enhance their current brew (well this is what the tour guide at St. Arnold's brewery told me Wednesday). Just FYI that there are specific minerals (sulfates) that enhance hop "crispness" that you may be lacking. Then again, it may be just fine.

My hunch is that the "sweetness" you are tasting is from the Munich and Vienna malts you are using. Try biting into the grains and comparing it to a 2-row control to see if this is the taste that you getting.

 

[ghank15]

Thanks, mredge...

Now that lagering season is over for me, I am going to be focusing on ales, mainly ESB's, stouts, and pale ales. This means that munich and vienna won't be used too often, if at all. I'll see if this is what it is. I love beer, and I think I have a good taste for it, but my palette is by no means professional, so perhaps the "sweetness" could be the munich and vienna malt.

We shall see.