Dalarast
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Or pre-plan large gatherings by making extra batches of beer for your gatherings. Make it a tasting for people who might not be experienced with craft or home brewed beer. You might make some new trading buddies!
Beer Wars: The Movie
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Or pre-plan large gatherings by making extra batches of beer for your gatherings. Make it a tasting for people who might not be experienced with craft or home brewed beer. You might make some new trading buddies!
BlueSunshine
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Alot of those breweries still do their own thing (like Red Hook for example). However, AB InBev gives them distribution deals and takes their profits without changing the company too much.
On the other hand, there's garbage like Shock Top that isn't a micro brew it all but it's marketed as such.
Weezknight
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Just finished up watching the movie. I thought it was pretty good. Agreed, though, that I got tired of Rhonda and her caffeine beer.
I was also surprised at how many brands are now under the A-B/InBev name. I guess no more Boddy's for me. I'm not a big fan of people manipulating the system (illegal incentives in Massachusetts as the movie pointed out), which is why I don't give my money to the big brewers.
I was glad to see good ole' Dick Yuengling, though! Him and Koch have to have the most stressful jobs, walking the thin line between being seen as a craft brewer and a mass marketer!
I was also surprised at how many brands are now under the A-B/InBev name. I guess no more Boddy's for me. I'm not a big fan of people manipulating the system (illegal incentives in Massachusetts as the movie pointed out), which is why I don't give my money to the big brewers.
I was glad to see good ole' Dick Yuengling, though! Him and Koch have to have the most stressful jobs, walking the thin line between being seen as a craft brewer and a mass marketer!
rmolledo
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I thought it was cool to see last night on THE OFFICE michael and his former boss were drinking yuengling black and tans
Weezknight
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I noticed that, too. As a Pennsylvanian, I love to see how good the Office's research team is. They always have "Pennsylvania" type things sitting around.
Synovia
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Right, AB Inbev just distributes Goose Island.
I'm glad they are not ruining Honker's Ale. I have fond memories of working in Chicago for a couple of months and drinking Honker's.
DavidSteel
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Does that mean I can still buy it? I'm pretty anti-busch lol. I remember trying their harvest ale a year ago when I first started drinking and I liked it a lot. I wouldn't mind giving it a try again.
Watched this today on Netflix streaming - not the greatest documentary I've seen, but was happy to see Downtown Wine & Spirits. Before moving to VT, I used to live a block away from this beer mecca!
Brewkowski
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I was just trying to look up Stag and Hamm's, and according to some links they label Pabst as kind of a marketing company because they don't actually sell beer. Is Heilman's (Stag, Stroh's, Hamms) basically part of the big guys?
I just watched Beer Wars, and it has thoroughly wet my appetite for anything that is not brewed by the major corporations. Definitely agree about too much Moonshot coverage. Personally it seems like a really lame idea and impossible to launch a single brand brew that's not really that great except that it has caffeine in it.
AnthonyD
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Watched this on Netflix over the weekend. Definitely worth the time if you haven't seen it yet. Not the best made documentary ever, but the material is enlightening.
TheFlatline
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Watched the documentary about a week ago. I thought that it was good right up until the last maybe 10-15 minutes.
I understand the reason why they spent so much time with that Moonshot beer. It was starting to get a toehold in certain markets, but Bud tried to stomp it out of existence.
I enjoyed seeing the other regional breweries though. I didn't think the guy who started Dogfish Head was that big of a dork, but it was fun watching him do his thing. You can't question his passion though, and for that he gets a pint raised in his honor.
The big revelation for me was the 3-tier system of beer distribution. I guess brewpubs are the way to go, since trying to actually market your beer even regionally is so tough. I'm surprised with the surge in the craft beer market though that more distributors focusing on craft beer aren't springing up.
Oh, and the big 3 can go f*ck themselves for spending that much money lobbying for the 3-tier system.
I understand the reason why they spent so much time with that Moonshot beer. It was starting to get a toehold in certain markets, but Bud tried to stomp it out of existence.
I enjoyed seeing the other regional breweries though. I didn't think the guy who started Dogfish Head was that big of a dork, but it was fun watching him do his thing. You can't question his passion though, and for that he gets a pint raised in his honor.
The big revelation for me was the 3-tier system of beer distribution. I guess brewpubs are the way to go, since trying to actually market your beer even regionally is so tough. I'm surprised with the surge in the craft beer market though that more distributors focusing on craft beer aren't springing up.
Oh, and the big 3 can go f*ck themselves for spending that much money lobbying for the 3-tier system.
AnthonyD
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The 3-tier thing was an eye-opener for me too. I knew it existed, but had no idea the scale of the impact it had.
menschmaschine
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I think it was because Anat Baron really identified with the woman from Moonshot. She was in a similar situation when she was running Mike's Hard Lemonade. For this I was disappointed... I was hoping there would be equal focus on the making of the beer, not just the economics of a few small brewers.
And then Baron spent a lesser, yet still significant amount of time on Sam C. I think she found him quite photogenic.
remilard
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I recently watched this. Its very much an advocacy type documentary and it gets a lot of things wrong, mostly by omission of information that doesn't support the narrative.
There are many states in which reasonably small breweries can self distribute, for example. The documentary certainly implied that 3-tier was in effect for every beer sold retail.
The documentary also perpetuated the myth that the use of adjuncts in American lagers was either about saving money or diluting the flavor.
Also, there was no focus on quality of beer. I doubt that moonshot stuff is great. It was clearly contract brewed somewhere. I found it a little annoying that "beer" included Mikes Hard Lemonade.
It wasn't a pro-beer documentary, it was an anti-AB documentary.
There are many states in which reasonably small breweries can self distribute, for example. The documentary certainly implied that 3-tier was in effect for every beer sold retail.
The documentary also perpetuated the myth that the use of adjuncts in American lagers was either about saving money or diluting the flavor.
Also, there was no focus on quality of beer. I doubt that moonshot stuff is great. It was clearly contract brewed somewhere. I found it a little annoying that "beer" included Mikes Hard Lemonade.
It wasn't a pro-beer documentary, it was an anti-AB documentary.
remilard
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I'm not sure I can get too worked up about Coors making a knock off of an InBev beer, since InBev is a far bigger company.
The Moonshot thing is a fad. Even in the documentary, they covered the decision to up the caffeine from 45mg to 69mg
I'll buy Sam C and Greg from Stone pontificating about craft beer and excellence based on process and ingredients but Moonshot? It's literally just light lager with caffeine.
Next
I'll buy Sam C and Greg from Stone pontificating about craft beer and excellence based on process and ingredients but Moonshot? It's literally just light lager with caffeine.
Next
remilard
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DilvishTheDamned
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Just watched this recently on NetFlix. I thought it was interesting, and I learned a couple of things.
First, the shelve space wars are unreal.
Second, the three tier system is pure evil
I must admit that the Moonshot lady was annoying, I get the point about her not being able to get money to advance the company. But I must admit I wonder why she needed it. We've got a nice local brewery in Cincy. They do a few different basic styles, and the beer is decent if not exceptional. They're also family owned, and were not looking to knock down every VC door in town looking for money. Instead they started out brewing in a shed in their backyard, and selling growlers at a couple of places. Now they're at Krogers, in the cold beer coolers. Pretty impressive for a company that started in 2005.
First, the shelve space wars are unreal.
Second, the three tier system is pure evil
I must admit that the Moonshot lady was annoying, I get the point about her not being able to get money to advance the company. But I must admit I wonder why she needed it. We've got a nice local brewery in Cincy. They do a few different basic styles, and the beer is decent if not exceptional. They're also family owned, and were not looking to knock down every VC door in town looking for money. Instead they started out brewing in a shed in their backyard, and selling growlers at a couple of places. Now they're at Krogers, in the cold beer coolers. Pretty impressive for a company that started in 2005.
remilard
Well-Known Member
She doesn't own a brewery, she owns a beer brand that some brewery is producing for her under contract. She said she had a few dozen accounts. The nickel a bottle or whatever she is making isn't going to make her a good living unless she is selling a lot of bottles.
Brewkowski
Well-Known Member
Anyone know if there are any rules about not-for-profits being involved in the booze industry? IL has some give with the 3 tier system regarding wine, but you don't have to produce that much before you have to use a distributor. Would it be possible for a distributor to sell only "lil guy" beer, wine, and spirits. Otherwise I don't see how a small operation could get on a truck with BMC products and get moved significantly. Clearly distributors know which side their bread is buttered on and they're in it to make money. If you have mom and pop establishments that can't afford to pay the 30% mark up of liquor stores and distribution chain, they're going to need to sell massive amounts of product.
That was totally shady about the Organic brewery that wasn't really there (unlisted AB subsidiary). What a bunch of corporate dicks.
That was totally shady about the Organic brewery that wasn't really there (unlisted AB subsidiary). What a bunch of corporate dicks.
remilard
Well-Known Member
Forget the information about 3-tier in Beer Wars as it was incomplete and heavily misleading.
Many breweries in all three West Coast states and some other states are allowed to self distribute. There is a limit on size but a reasonably large brewery like Russian River can self distribute.
In my state, Missouri, which has some of the least craft beer friendly laws (thanks to AB having been domiciled here) there are beer distributors (eg Missouri Beverage) that only carry craft beer, although some craft brands are distributed by the distributors that carry the international brands.
Either way, any brewery wishing to distribute in Missouri has the choice of at least one craft only distributor. Any other state will have or could have such a distributor if it made economic sense (if the demand for craft beer were high enough).
While I would like to see 3-tier go, I don't appreciate misleading propaganda against it because it makes us look like nuts. Also we, as consumers, can and are changing the way beer is distributed and retailed by voting with our wallets.
Brewkowski
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Good points, and when it all boils down to it, it's up to us to drink as much craft beer as possible to steer the demand and convert those silly BMC drinkers.
menschmaschine
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I doubt it. InBev is like Obi-Wan... if we strike them down, they'll become more powerful than we can possibly imagine.
The key is to act like BMC is good beer... then they'll keep on making it and let the craft beer to the craft breweries.
Reading Ambitious Brew by Maureen Ogle and then watching Beer Wars really ties how AB is run now with how it was run in the past during the original Beer Wars. It's not enough that they succeed in the market. All others must fail.
Willie3
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BMC has its place. I see the issues more in the way of where they dominate shelf space. For most craft drinkers I don't see this as an issue but for the non enduldged drinker (I am talking mainly college students and the like), BMC is right there in front of their face and the inexpensiveness will drive them to BMC all the time. Who wants to pay $19.99 for one bottle of Stone's Imperial whatever, when they can get a 30 pack for nearly the same price?
I am not a BMC drinker, because I like to taste what I drink, however I think it is an uphill battle to convert BMC drinkers to craft. The three tier just adds to the complexity of insurgence of craft, making it difficult (not impossible) for craft brewers to get a piece of the market. IMO, I think that was their point, in addition to other issues.
I am not a BMC drinker, because I like to taste what I drink, however I think it is an uphill battle to convert BMC drinkers to craft. The three tier just adds to the complexity of insurgence of craft, making it difficult (not impossible) for craft brewers to get a piece of the market. IMO, I think that was their point, in addition to other issues.
Willie3
Well-Known Member
Did it seem like Augustus is so far removed he has no clue, sitting in behind his desk like a Czar and sipping on their best beer fresh from the brewer all day? What a joke.
"Don't worry sir, have one of these and relax, everything is taken care of.... that' it... fantastic right?"
"Don't worry sir, have one of these and relax, everything is taken care of.... that' it... fantastic right?"
aliu630
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After watching this movie, I decided to do my own blind taste test during happy hour. They only had Miller Lite and Bud light, no Coors Light. I used to say I'd pick Bud Light over the other 2 because it tasted better, but I'mma shut up about it now cause I couldn't tell the difference when I tried em. I had to GUESS to pick the Bud Light. Interesting movie overall. I never thought that hogging self space was a marketing technique, but makes a lot of sense.
TheFlatline
Well-Known Member
Let's be honest, the college students who suck back an entire case of PBR to get wasted on a Thursday night aren't going to enjoy a beer with very much flavor to it. They're drinking to get drunk, not to drink beer. They aren't the demographic craft beer is aiming at. They don't have enough money and they're less likely to guzzle hopped beers.
Brewkowski
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So you don't think they'd be likely to pay $12 for some Imperial Stout and beer bong it? God I can't even imagine, but maybe I'll try it when I get home.
This is the thing i really don't get. When I am out and am trying to just get wasted, why would i drink 3.5% beer? I'll just get the cheapest booze offered and take care of business in 1/8th the time for 1/2 the price. Drinking Coors Light to get drunk just confuses the hell out of me
TheFlatline
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I think the brewer who crafted a 9% imperial stout that was ink black would want to show up and beat to death the college student who tried to beer bong that.
BrianTheBrewer
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Well I agree. I dont drink any hard alcohol ever. I also dont drink coors light though. That is why I usually go for a Sam Adams because it is everywhere you look these days...which I believe is a good thing.
DilvishTheDamned
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jiggs_casey
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Just saw this movie and didn't feel that start yet another thread would be appropriate yet, still wanted to say how interesting I thought it was. I can say I had NO idea just how many beer lines AB owned! I also didn't realize that Miller and Coors had 'joined forces' in an attempt to take on AB before they were bought out by InBev.
I kinda feel like a shlameel now for just walking into one of the local liquor stores and buying something out of the craft brew section because it 'looks good'... Time to start doing my homework to make sure that what I buy isn't some beer oligarch 'one-off'...
I kinda feel like a shlameel now for just walking into one of the local liquor stores and buying something out of the craft brew section because it 'looks good'...
Time to start doing my homework to make sure that what I buy isn't some beer oligarch 'one-off'...
ReverendTap
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Dude, if I was brewing and selling a legit imperial stout that was popular enough that college kids were beer bonging it, I'd spend my time making more imperial stout. And maybe beer bongs.
I dig brewing because I like making beer people enjoy; I'm not about to tell them they can't enjoy it how they want. Isn't "doing it your own way" what this is all about? 
DavidSteel
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Dude, if I was brewing and selling a legit imperial stout that was popular enough that college kids were beer bonging it, I'd spend my time making more imperial stout. And maybe beer bongs.
Totally, man.
mikebiewer
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There are a lot of good points brought up in this thread about this movie. I seem to agree and disagree with some of them, but I'm not really here to debate.
What I'd like to know from you guys is what do you think the "point" or "moral" of the story is? I did a review of this movie on my blog after watching it twice and there were things that I thought were good and things I thought were bad, but the moral seemed to lack.
Review of Beer Wars
I mean, I understand that this movie was created to bring to light the struggles craft brewers face against the giants to get their product out, but I don't think the main idea surfaced until the very end during the mediation. I found the moral to be, just like someone said earlier in this thread, to cast your vote with your dollar instead of your mouth. I mean, A/B got as big as it did and is doing what it is doing because people still buy this crap. However, with our choices as consumers we can change American culture.
I just don't think that idea was expressed enough. I don't think they talked to enough beer drinkers or talked asked enough people why they don't drink something else. I think that would have added a lot to the movie.
Those are just my two cents.
What I'd like to know from you guys is what do you think the "point" or "moral" of the story is? I did a review of this movie on my blog after watching it twice and there were things that I thought were good and things I thought were bad, but the moral seemed to lack.
Review of Beer Wars
I mean, I understand that this movie was created to bring to light the struggles craft brewers face against the giants to get their product out, but I don't think the main idea surfaced until the very end during the mediation. I found the moral to be, just like someone said earlier in this thread, to cast your vote with your dollar instead of your mouth. I mean, A/B got as big as it did and is doing what it is doing because people still buy this crap. However, with our choices as consumers we can change American culture.
I just don't think that idea was expressed enough. I don't think they talked to enough beer drinkers or talked asked enough people why they don't drink something else. I think that would have added a lot to the movie.
Those are just my two cents.
kidsmakeyoucrazy
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Leffe has been owned by Inbev for a long time...Belgians don't F' around with beer. I brought back some "Del Haize" aka "Food Lion" (Del Haize = Food Lion, betcha didn't know the belgians owned that did you?)....the Del Haize beer is better than 90 % of the crap we stock on the shelves here. Guess who makes the Del Haize Beer? The bottle I have says Inbev...as do the Leffe bottles I have.
I'm all for the little guy, but from a beer lovers standpoint in the USA, Inbev buying AB was the best thing that could have happened. Inbev now has the distribution network to sell us really good commercial beer.
I also don't buy her "I"m a little peon in this vast sea of beer" thing. This woman has launched major brands before but she can't get any traction on this one....that means it's a dud and no one wants it.
mikebiewer
Well-Known Member
That's a good point kidsmakeyoucrazy.
She's done this before and if she doesn't seem to have the contacts to do it again...the product she is backing can't be good. I never thought of it that way.
She's done this before and if she doesn't seem to have the contacts to do it again...the product she is backing can't be good. I never thought of it that way.
