Beer Smith - strike temps way low?

[Gadjobrinus]

Well, I finally joined the 21st century dragging and screaming, and am in the process of migrating all my recipes over to Beer Smith. Just starting to learn its capabilities but very cool so far.

The one thing that I can't figure out is that the strike temps given by Beer Smith are routinely low. I use a 10 gallon Igloo for a mash tun. I found out via actual testing that the MLT indeed has a thermal mass of 0.30.

Single infusion, 152F. Using that same .30 for thermal mass, Promash gives me 180 in strike temp, whereas Beersmith gives me strike temp of 173. Obviously very different and though I've not brewed yet with any of the Beersmith recipes, given the Promash setting nails my mash-in infusion temp, I suspect following the Beersmith recommendation will mean I'm coming in really low on mash-in.

Anyone else experience this? Suggestions?

 

[Sammy86]

When i was a BeerSmith user i too found the strike temps a bit off. Through a little trial and error i found my correct temps for my igloo cooler was 13° degrees above mash temps.

I also found putting a gallon of boiling water into the tun to heat it up and then dumping it before adding the strike water and grain gave me some consistency.

I find that strike temp of 180° very high but it has been a LONG time since i pulled out the old tun and used it.

 

[day_trippr]

Try playing with the Infusion Tool to readily see the effects of the mash tun Specific Heat value. Once you find what works you can change the setting in your Equipment Profile to match. A value around 0.60 might be more appropriate for your mlt....

Cheers!

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

Also, check what the grain temp is at, I store my grain in the basement so I have my grain temp set at 55f instead of room temp of 70f or whatever it may be pre set at. My strike water is usually 11f higher then target mash temp. The last time I used my 10gal igloo I heated my strike water about 15f over target mash temp. I agree with @Sammy86 that 180f seems pretty high.

 

[BongoYodeler]

I routinely hit my strike water temperature dead-on, every single time with BS3. And I'm usually very close, if not exactly at, predicted OG and FG most often. The one number where I'm usually off is the post mash / pre-boil number, but I chalk that up to volume expansion at mash temperatures, or maybe evaporation of my sample. Since it generally finishes as planned I've never explored it further.

 

[day_trippr]

I assumed the OP was actually measuring MLT and grain temperatures...

 

[Gadjobrinus]

Guys, thank you all. I was obviously doing something wrong because I just went and played with a bunch of my recipes and mash regimes under promash, and entered the values into the infusion tool on BS (thank you @day_trippr !), and the indicated strike temps are almost identical - like, a few tenths +/- of each other. This was with the indicated .3 thermal mass. So I think we're good.

Robust program! Promash is an old warhorse which has gotten me so many great brews. Misting up that I will have to take it out to the back 40 and put it down with my trusty old .44.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

I assumed the OP was actually measuring MLT and grain temperatures...

Yep.

 

[kevin58]

Beersmith is highly customizable. If at any time you find something that doesn't look right there is an adjustment somewhere under the hood that will bring it into line.

 

[whoaru99]

I routinely hit my strike water temperature dead-on, every single time with BS3. And I'm usually very close, if not exactly at, predicted OG and FG most often. The one number where I'm usually off is the post mash / pre-boil number, but I chalk that up to volume expansion at mash temperatures, or maybe evaporation of my sample. Since it generally finishes as planned I've never explored it further.

I have found BS3 to be very close for me too.

That said, I normally put my strike water in the cooler a bit above what BS recommends to warm up the cooler.

Then, when the strike water has come down to a degree or two above, I mix in the grains and it goes pretty much spot on the mash temp.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

Thanks both of you. Like I said, not sure what I was doing because it's actually pretty close to Promash, which was dependable for me. I'd thought of the heating up to cool down thing, too, but presumed that was what the thermal mass value is for. Either way seems great. Thanks again guys.

 

[OleBrewing]

using their default keggle setup was spot on for me. Love the software; but only utilize it for recipe building. brew day is still on paper logged in a binder.

if i had a printer maybe would just use the software and print results for logging. I am old fashioned and i know my paper notes will not be gone and i don't use cloud services, that's just silly.

 

[day_trippr]

I readily admit I always print out the brew sheet and use it to assemble all the ingredients, then file it for "just in case" needs.
But I use my tablet with Beersmith3 Mobile during the brew to make sure the bittering hops make it in the kettle

Cheers!

 

[Gadjobrinus]

I find I always print out the material (Promash), but it's always scratched up heavily with notes, too, which are filed away and what I rely on. So, yep, pretty much for recipe building only here, too. I have to say, BS is pretty excellent IMO. Like @kevin58 said, the customizable nature is pretty amazing....just a learning curve. Promash will always have a soft spot in my heart....but maybe the 21st century thing isn't so bad after all.

 

[day_trippr]

The biggest single problem with Beersmith that intimidates new users is the gui itself, that out of the box has menu bars across the top duplicated with a menu array draped along the left edge. Turn the latter off and the bewilderment is cut by 2/3rds, and you're off to a better start...

Cheers!

 

[BongoYodeler]

I find I always print out the material (Promash), but it's always scratched up heavily with notes, too, which are filed away and what I rely on. So, yep, pretty much for recipe building only here, too. I have to say, BS is pretty excellent IMO. Like @kevin58 said, the customizable nature is pretty amazing....just a learning curve. Promash will always have a soft spot in my heart....but maybe the 21st century thing isn't so bad after all.

I just make notes in the Notes section of BS3. and eventually save the brew file to my Google Drive. If I used hand written notes there's a very good chance I'd lose it within 5 minutes of cleaning up.
IOW, I'm very thorough when I clean up.

 

[beren]

I noticed my mashes are about 5° low with BS. And I'm with ya, Bongo, I'm terrible with paper anything. It vanishes within seconds.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

Well, alright then. Oatmeal mash in, nailed it. Strike temp 173, shooting for mash-in 152 - and nailed it at 152.1. First time on the program, and awesome.

I will always print off and scribble down notes, but giving a shot to running the program clean through, including the timers.

 

[day_trippr]

Love the Brewday Timers! Gotta have 'em!

 

[BongoYodeler]

Love the Brewday Timers! Gotta have 'em!

I should try using the BS timers. I've just been using my phone.

 

[day_trippr]

Fair warning: Android 14 screwed up the ability for BS3 to issue alerts when the phone is "sleeping". Either requires using a pre-Android 14 device (I have an older phone I can use) or keeping your Android 14 device awake. Brad Smith is purportedly working on a fix - which should be possible because I have other apps running on Android 14 devices that can alert when the devices are snoozing...

Cheers!

 

[Brooothru]

Guys, thank you all. I was obviously doing something wrong because I just went and played with a bunch of my recipes and mash regimes under promash, and entered the values into the infusion tool on BS (thank you @day_trippr !), and the indicated strike temps are almost identical - like, a few tenths +/- of each other. This was with the indicated .3 thermal mass. So I think we're good.

Robust program! Promash is an old warhorse which has gotten me so many great brews. Misting up that I will have to take it out to the back 40 and put it down with my trusty old .44.

I was wondering when you started talking about ProMash. That's what I used for a few years, but then they stopped supporting it. At about the same time Brad Smith was just introducing BeerSmith ver. 1.0. It also coincided with my switchover (wife's insistence) from 20+ years of DOS-based OS to MaC. We only had the one desktop, and ProMash was Windows only. So....

I actually like BeerSmith a lot and use it exclusively (except for water chemistry calcs.). ProMash was a solid program, but BeerSmith has many more bells/whistles and is very well supported. Sometimes a little quirky for me, but that's probably because I lack a programmer's thought sequencing skills.

 

[Gadjobrinus]

I was wondering when you started talking about ProMash. That's what I used for a few years, but then they stopped supporting it. At about the same time Brad Smith was just introducing BeerSmith ver. 1.0. It also coincided with my switchover (wife's insistence) from 20+ years of DOS-based OS to MaC. We only had the one desktop, and ProMash was Windows only. So....

I actually like BeerSmith a lot and use it exclusively (except for water chemistry calcs.). ProMash was a solid program, but BeerSmith has many more bells/whistles and is very well supported. Sometimes a little quirky for me, but that's probably because I lack a programmer's thought sequencing skills.

Thanks for the data points. I am totally digging BS. I'm writing over all my Promash recipes to it. Still like to bounce over to PM for a couple things but I think that's only because I haven't figured Beersmith out yet. Brewed an oatmeal stout after Samuel Smith yesterday and nailed the targets, really pleased.

 

[Brooothru]

Recalling back a decade or so ago, the transition from ProMash to BeerSmith was not seamless nor smooth. But by taking one or two tried and true favorite recipes I was able to dial in volumes and equipment profiles.

BeerSmith is a more powerful program with a lot of built-in tools and ingredient databases. You don’t need to use them all, but they’re there if you want or need them, most of which you can update or modify.

 

[day_trippr]

I confess I likely added a full year to my coming-up-to-speed on BS 1.04 because the gui was so frickin' busy the intimidation was real

 

[Brooothru]

I confess I likely added a full year to my coming-up-to-speed on BS 1.04 because the gui was so frickin' busy the intimidation was real

BS3 is a mere reflection of BS1 (thankfully) but Brad has continually improved the original. As a PhD microbiologist and talented home brewer, he also shows an ability to write code, even if at times it’s a bit bloated and cludegy.

At least he keeps at improving its utility and usability. Hard to believe the program has been out for more than 20 years. Man, I’m getting old.

 

[beren]

BS3 is a mere reflection of BS1 (thankfully) but Brad has continually improved the original. As a PhD microbiologist and talented home brewer, he also shows an ability to write code, even if at times it’s a bit bloated and cludegy.

At least he keeps at improving its utility and usability. Hard to believe the program has been out for more than 20 years. Man, I’m getting old.

I only wish keyboard shortcuts worked

 

[Brooothru]

I only wish keyboard shortcuts worked

When I switched (kicking and screaming) from DOS based OS/Windows I became much more mouse centric. Today I use very few keyboard shortcuts in any programs, and find the Mac version of BeerSmith to be reliably easy to use and navigate.