Barleywine Recipe - 200 IBUs too much?

[Shenanigans]

Hi all,

I was considering brewing an American Barleywine and found the below recipe on another forum. (couldn't contact the poster because its from a few years ago and I'm also not registered).
I thought it would be perfect to use up the Summit and Columbus hops I have getting old in my freezer. I might also swap out the Simcoe for Northern Brewer.

Anyway the person who posted the recipe said it turned out lovely a after about 3 months aging. I started filling it in Beersmith and realised it has 200 plus IBUs
He didn't calculate any IBUs for the 0 min additions so you can add an extra 20 to 25 IBUs for that.
Would be one kick-ass beer but I'd just be a bit worried that it would be too bitter.
What do you think?

Thanks

22 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 80.0 %
2 lbs Munich Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 2 7.3 %
1 lbs 4.0 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 3 4.5 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 4 3.6 %
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 5 0.9 %

1 lbs Sugar, Table (Sucrose) (1.0 SRM) Sugar 17 3.6 %

1.104 OG 1.028 FG 10.2% ABV

[Hop Bill]
2.00 oz Summit [17.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 84.2 IBUs
1.00 oz Summit [17.00 %] - Boil 45.0 min Hop 7 38.7 IBUs
1.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 8 40.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 9 12.4 IBUs
1.50 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 10 10.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 11 6.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 15 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 13 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 14 0.0 IBUs
2.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 0.0 min Hop 12 0.0 IBUs

[Yeast]
US 05, California Ale, or Wyeast 1056

 

[IslandLizard]

I've had Barleywines that were extremely bitter, they were also the most memorable aroma/flavor wise.

Does look like a lot of boil hops. You'd easily lose a gallon to trub, which can be reclaimed.

Was there any feedback on that recipe from people who brewed it?

 

[GHawk]

The new 2015 BJCP guidelines set styles with English Barleywine at 70 IBU and American Barleywine at 100 IBU.

We as homebrewers have the ability to do what ever we want. However, my reading and understanding the human ability is that we can't perceive much over 100 IBU's. More on the late and dry hopping would contribute perception of bitterness more than flavor to the pallet and add much more aroma. Hate to waste hops.

 

[Shenanigans]

I've had Barleywines that were extremely bitter, they were also the most memorable aroma/flavor wise.

Does look like a lot of boil hops. You'd easily lose a gallon to trub, which can be reclaimed.

Was there any feedback on that recipe from people who brewed it?

It was one of those "what's the best beer you have brewed" kind of threads. So no feedback really, only that he thought it was amazing

I just brewed a Yeti Imperial Stout and got 5 gallons of a 1.092 Beer and 3.5 gallons of a 1.056 brown ale from the second runnings after capping with some pale chocolate malt and a pound of oats. Then adding 300g of maple syrup.

So I would like to do the same again with a Barley Wine and pale ale combination.
Maybe I should just brew the Water Into Barleywine recipe from here.

 

[Shenanigans]

The new 2015 BJCP guidelines set styles with English Barleywine at 70 IBU and American Barleywine at 100 IBU.

We as homebrewers have the ability to do what ever we want. However, my reading and understanding the human ability is that we can't perceive much over 100 IBU's. More on the late and dry hopping would contribute perception of bitterness more than flavor to the pallet and add much more aroma. Hate to waste hops.

I must admit I went a bit overboard with buying hops over the last few years. Buying everything in pounds and half pound because it's much cheaper per ounce but not having the time to use them. So I was looking for a good recipe to use them up.

I'm not sure which is the biggest waste (apart from buying way too much), letting them get old in the freezer or just throwing a load of them into a big hoppy beer.

I think I might go for it but replace the Simcoe with northern brewer. :rockin:

 

[GHawk]

I'm not sure which is the biggest waste (apart from buying way too much), letting them get old in the freezer or just throwing a load of them into a big hoppy beer.

Well,
Since you put it that way.... the freezer can't enjoy your hops.
If it were me, I'd brew ever day off and stock pile some good aging beers. Do a vertical tasting every 6 months and special dates.
I never can get backup to do something like that.

 

[Schlenkerla]

My brew club made a big-brew barleywine (15 gallons) with some ridiculously high IBU. Like what you have there well over 100 IBU. I argued against this and lost. Their rationale was the hops would hit a saturation limit with the AAU and OG of the wort. Therefore the rest of the hops would be aroma and flavor.

It was NOT too bitter. It had a very good complex hop nose and it had a strong malt backbone. It reminded me of plum and raisins. Each of us got a 6 pack and I drank one bottle every Christmas Eve until they were gone.

Have at it....

 

[Shenanigans]

Thanks for the support guys

I think brewing a few big beers over the next few months is the way to go for me.
I'll give this a go sometime next month but need to invest in some hardware first and read up a bit more on brewing these types of beers.
I don't keg and never use a secondary but I guess such a beer would benefit from bulk ageing before bottling. So I'd like to invest in some kind of CO2 purging system to help reduce the risk of oxidation.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Thanks for the support guys

I think brewing a few big beers over the next few months is the way to go for me.
I'll give this a go sometime next month but need to invest in some hardware first and read up a bit more on brewing these types of beers.
I don't keg and never use a secondary but I guess such a beer would benefit from bulk ageing before bottling. So I'd like to invest in some kind of CO2 purging system to help reduce the risk of oxidation.

If you siphon within two-three weeks after pitching and little to no air space in the 2ndary you'll be ok. CO2 will come out of suspension to fill that small space.

Plan for additional volume in your brew kettle, and fermenting vessel such that you have a full 5 gal to move to a 5 gal carboy.

If you bottle you'll have to re-pitch with your priming solution. Use double dose of rehydrated s33 when you prime. It's a very ABV tolerant EDME strain. It works fast too.

I also like to use the s-style, bubble, air lock vs the tube and thimble air lock on carboys. It's better for slow fermentation. The fluid levels in the air lock are easier to watch. You can top off with water rather easy too. If you let it sit for a while it will evaporate out of the lock.

 

[JKaranka]

After a year of aging 200 IBU is just fine

 

[Shenanigans]

Thanks for the tips so far. I'm away on holidays at the moment but when I get back on the weekend I'm going to start planning this brew. Have already decided I will do a barleywine/ IPA parti gyle. I found an IPA recipe with a similar malt bill. So will cap it with some special B and cara red for the second beer. Last time I got 3.5 gallons at about 1.050 so I'll bump it up with a can of malt extract from a kit I got as a gift last year.

 

[Shenanigans]

I finally brewed this last week hit got an OG of 1.104 so pretty happy with that.
In the end I will probably be a few quarts short to fully fill a 5 gallon big bubbler. So I was wondering if it would be just better to bottle it rather than going with bulk aging in a secondary.

Anyway I have a few weeks to decide.

Oh, I also did an American Stout with the second runnings.
The Barleywine was no sparge and for the stout I capped it with flaked barley, chocolate malt, Carafa II (normal not special) and Crystal Wheat. Batch sparged with 4.5 gallons leaving it for about 30 mins before draining the mash tun.
Then added 1lb of medium DME to the boil.

60 min 1.5oz Cluster
5 min 0.75oz Cascade
20min whirlpool with 2oz Willamette
Mangrove Jacks M42 Yeast

Ended up with over 4 gallons with an OG of 1.060 and about 60 IBUs

So looking forward to how that one turns out too.

 

[ProblemChild]

For perspective - NEIPA recipes may have as much as 7 oz of SImcoe at 60 min for 5 gallons (Favorite brew a friend of mine does has that). That blows by 200 IBU.

By the time the beer is ready, you have no clue it is that high.

The taste is juicy and dank - so I am not even remotely afraid of that hoop schedule. I might cut the 45 min addition and drop a little of the hops to get the same effect, but otherwise no issue with the recipe.

 

[chickypad]

For perspective - NEIPA recipes may have as much as 7 oz of SImcoe at 60 min for 5 gallons (Favorite brew a friend of mine does has that). That blows by 200 IBU.

This sounds like the exact opposite of the the technique for making an NEIPA. Typically there are little to no long boil additions and you throw in huge amounts of hops after flameout.

https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/how-to-brew/tips-brewing-new-england-ipa/
https://byo.com/article/neipa-style-profile/

 

[ProblemChild]

This sounds like the exact opposite of the the technique for making an NEIPA. Typically there are little to no long boil additions and you throw in huge amounts of hops after flameout.

https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/how-to-brew/tips-brewing-new-england-ipa/
https://byo.com/article/neipa-style-profile/

Agreed - I was appalled when I heard the recipe - then I tasted it.

 

[Shenanigans]

Agreed - I was appalled when I heard the recipe - then I tasted it.

Happen to have the recipe?
I have about 1.5lbs of Simcoe I would like to put to good use.

 

[Shenanigans]

I've decided I will bottle about 1.5 gallons of this of this straight after it has finished fermenting and for the other 3 gallons I will secondary it for about 3 months before bottling. I have a 3 gallon wide mouth glass fermenter so I can fill it to the top.
I can then answer my own question if apart from less sediment in the bottle if it is really worth bulk ageing.

 

[ProblemChild]

Happen to have the recipe?
I have about 1.5lbs of Simcoe I would like to put to good use.

Will get it. Crazy level of trub, but a tasty batch

 

[Shenanigans]

I checked this on day 9 and it was already down to 1.036 from 1.104 and still had a huge krausen.
On day 14 now and still bubbling a least once a minute.
I didn't look inside the bucket since 5 days ago but it looks like there might still be a thick krausen so hopefully it will fully attenuate before the yeast craps out. I've read if treated properly US-05 should handle an 11.5% beer.
I suppose the expected FG should be 1.020 +/- 2 points.