Amy Winehouse dead

[Homercidal]

The oft-spouted idea that suicide is somehow, by definition, cowardly (or always merely "taking the easy way out"), is beyond absurd.

I don't think so. Generally, except in the case where people kill themselves for ulterior motives, people commit suicide to end some kind of pain or a difficulty in life that they can't (or don't think they can) handle.

Therefore, in general, people kill themselves because it's easier than any way they know to deal with their problem. So to them it kind of IS taking the easier way out.

It's sad that so many, choose to do this rather than simply asking someone to help them.

I knew a few people who killed themselves. Here is one story: A friend, the close friend of my sister's husband, and husband of her close friend, shot himself in his truck, in a field of young pine trees. They had 1 young child and 1 on the way. His note basically said that he didn't want to run his father's Christmas Tree business, and he didn't want to disappoint him. I think there may be more than that added in, but to him that was the big thing.

Now I couldn't give a rat's ass about Amy Winehouse. I don't know her. But Brian was a good man with a bright future and a loving family. Nobody saw this coming. It REALLY hurts to know after it's too late that you could have saved his life if he'd only said something to someone about his problem.

THAT is someone that concerns me, not some celebrity I've never met. I'm sure she has friends and family that are hurting, just like I hurt for my friend and his family. His kids are growing up not knowing their father and what a wonderful person he was.

I don't think most people on here think suicide isn't a terrible thing. I think it just depends on who the person is, the circumstances, and whether or not they knew that person.

 

[Pappers_]

I'm outa here on account of that there are some things I want to say that simply won't be taken well . . .

That's a high standard, Gnomey. Very little of what I post is taken well, or even makes sense

 

[Laughing_Gnome_Invisible]

That's a high standard, Gnomey. Very little of what I post is taken well, or even makes sense

Standards! Hey! Stop accusing me of having standards!

 

[emjay]

Therefore, in general, people kill themselves because it's easier than any way they know to deal with their problem. So to them it kind of IS taking the easier way out.

First of all, you're applying rational thinking to irrational people struggling with irrational thoughts. And I don't just mean this in the sense of acute suicidality... depression, anxiety disorders, etc, are inherently irrational. And in such cases, there ARE NO "easy" options.

I mean, my grandfather committed suicide, and apparently according to a lot of people here, that should somehow make me an expert. Nope... it really doesn't help you understand any better than anybody else.

You know what DOES help me understand? Not even the fact that I'm close to completing a degree in neuroscience with a strong background in psychology.

It's the fact that it's something I struggled with seriously myself, for quite a long period of time.

You mention it being sad that many people don't ask some for help. Even when they do, it can sometimes make things worse, not better, especially when they refuse to get professional help - sometimes even because the people they went to disapprove of that kind of thing and TALK THEM OUT OF IT. Uneducated family and friends are all-too-often ignorant of the fact that they can be supportive, but they really can't *understand*. But people tend to think they can, often equating it to their own NORMAL experience of a fleeting period of anxiety, a bad breakup, etc. And then because they think they can understand, applying rational thought processes to an irrational problem as you have, they often place unrealistic expectations on the person, sometimes becoming frustrated or even angry when their well-meaning but naive efforts don't seem to help the person simply "snap out of it."

But you can't really blame anybody for not being able to understand anymore than you can blame a blind person for not being able to comprehend what red is. Or, for the sake of making probably the closest comparison that can be made... trying to understand it is as useless as trying to understand what a psychedelic such as mushrooms or LSD does to the mind without having actually experienced them.

I don't want my post to go on too long, so I'll just point out one last thing. The reasoning you used in the quote above could literally be applied to ANY rationally-made decision a person makes.

 

[mikeysab]

When I hear a story like this my thoughts wind up on the family. As a father, watching my daughters stub their toe or fall down and scrape their knee breaks my heart. I would never want to outlive my children and can't imagine how that must hurt someone. True she was a mess and no one here knew her personally so its easier to say that she's a piece of crap junkie. I doubt anyone here would walk up to her grieving family and let them know that you felt she was just another dead junkie. If you did then you'd be just another unsympathetic, heartless ******. I'm saying that not because its untrue that she IS just another dead junkie but for what her family is going through. Too many people think the world revolves around them and have no consideration for others, junkies and murderers included. The ones who hurt others usually get what's coming to them and its hard to show sympathy when they do.

 

[Homercidal]

Her family claims she had quit drinking and that she likely died from withdrawals. Looking that up online shows mentions that 1-5% of people who get medical treatment to stop alcohol abuse can die from withdrawal, while that number could be as high as 20% for those who don't.

Supposedly her doctor recommended cutting back on drinking while not binge drinking to get her body used to living without the alcohol, but she said she couldn't manage to do that. So she just stopped drinking.

We'll have to wait for the toxicologist to know for sure.

 

[EoinMag]

I heard reports over here of cocaine, ecstasy and ketamine being bought the night before she died. But as said toxicology will tell, but I'm thinking they've found all three and are unsure which was fatally toxic which is why it is unexplained thus far.

 

[Laughing_Gnome_Invisible]

I heard reports over here of cocaine, ecstasy and ketamine being bought the night before she died. But as said toxicology will tell, but I'm thinking they've found all three and are unsure which was fatally toxic which is why it is unexplained thus far.

Toxicology reports generally take around 4 weeks here for the results as well, as far as I know. Even when the inside of the body is not like a well stocked pharmacy.

 

[user 574]

Trying not to perpetuate the suicide is cowardly chatter but every instance of suicide has it's own tale and often times it involves mental illness and you can't generalize it. Lost a friend and have actually saved another person twice. Depression is a horrible thing.

Anyone think Seppuku (or Hara Kiri) was cowardly? I'd be the coward because I got no convictions that strong .

 

[Airborneguy]

Hideki Irabu sure didn't think Hari Kari was cowardly...

 

[Hatchbrew]

Didn't cause me any pause

 

[McBrewskie]

Wonderfully talented woman. Sad but saw it coming from a few years away.