All New Zealand hop IPA - how's this sound?

[kal]

Hi everyone,

I recently picked up a bunch of New Zealand hops which are all new to me (never used them before):

- NZ Galaxy: Tropical, well rounded, not quite as in-your-face as Citra.
- NZ Kohatu: Intense floral characters of pine needles and tropical fruit.
- NZ Motueka: Lemon, lime, tropical fruit.
- NZ Nelson Sauvin: Sauvignon Blanc grape like flavours.


I'm thinking of trying an AIPA style beer with these, something with a simple malt bill (95% 2-row, 5% Crystal), around 6% ABV, around 60 IBU, low-ester clean yeast.

The big question is the hopping... I'm thinking of something like the following for a 5 gallon batch:


0.75 oz New Zealand Nelson Sauvin (11.5%) - boiled 60.0 m
0.75 oz New Zealand Kohatu (5.7%) - boiled 60.0 m

0.5 oz New Zealand Nelson Sauvin (11.5%) - boiled 10.0 m
0.25 oz New Zealand Galaxy (12.3%) - boiled 10.0 m
0.5 oz New Zealand Kohatu (5.7%) - boiled 10.0 m

0.5 oz New Zealand Nelson Sauvin (11.5%) - boiled 5.0 m
0.25 oz New Zealand Galaxy (12.3%) - boiled 5.0 m
0.5 oz New Zealand Kohatu (5.7%) - boiled 5.0 m

0.5 oz New Zealand Nelson Sauvin (11.5%) - 0 m
0.25 oz New Zealand Galaxy (12.3%) - 0 m
0.5 oz New Zealand Kohatu (5.7%) - 0 m

0.75 oz New Zealand Nelson Sauvin (11.5%) - dry hop
0.5 oz New Zealand Galaxy (12.3%) - dry hop
0.75 oz New Zealand Kohatu (5.7%) - dry hop


I've heard that Galaxy is pretty intense and may overshadow other hops, hence the reason to keeping Galaxy lower than the others for late additions/dry hopping. Galaxy is supposedly a harsh bittering hop so I'm only using it late.

I'm leaving Motueka out as I'm not sure I like lemon/lime. Not really sure why I bought it in the first place.

Normally I like to make a SMASH with new hops but figured I'd "wing it" this time with 3-4 new hops I've never tried.

Thoughts and suggestions welcome!

Kal

 

[nofootbreak]

I find Nelson to be very pungent and can easily overpower other hops. When used too much, it leaves an unpleasant wine like character that I find hard to drink, especially in a pale ale or IPA. I have used galaxy a lot, and while it is intense, I dont think you have to worry about it overpowering the beer like nelson or citra do.

Motueka is an awesome hop, just had a single hop pale ale with it at a brewpub in town and have one in the fermenter. I dont think its particularly pungent, and the lemon lime character is crisp, but not as distinctly lemon-lime as it may sound. I think it would work very well with other hops.

I like the hopping schedule and think the grain bill is fine for a hop focused beer.

I know you wante a NZ hopped beer, but Im a big fan of using a clean bittering hop like magnum or warrior for majority of my beers. I just like to save the expensive flavoring hops for where they shine.

 

[kal]

Thanks for the feedback.

I had been speaking to a local brewer who was mentioning that he found Galaxy could easily overpower other hops. Now I have the same vote for Nelson Sauvin.

Maybe I'll just bump the Galaxy back up to the same amounts as the Nelson Sauvin and be done with. (I find you can't have too much late hops, I'm just looking for the right balance between the hops to use).

Your comments about clean bittering are very valid. Normally I'd do exactly that: Use Magnum or Warrior as the 60 min addition. But in this case I think I really want to go 100% NZ. I'll have to think about it.

Re: Motueka... I'd go with a 4-way for each of the 10/5/0/dry additions but I think with 3 hops it's already likely to be somewhat of a muddled mess (hard to pick out flavours). So I left it out for now as it sounds the least interesting (to me and my tastes). Maybe I should use it the only dry hop... (another option).

Kal

Kal

 

[Osedax]

I have heard that nelson is too harsh to bitter with. I haven't actually used them to bitter but, they are a bit harsh. If you can, get yourself some green bullet. I believe its a NZ early addition hop.

Looks awesome though. Should be tasty. Love new zealand hops.

 

[crusader1612]

Go with the galaxy Sauvin mix. Made a great pale ale with it. Ratio of 2:1 galaxy: Nelson.

Use kohatu with motueka that's another great mix.
I'd also recommend by using the Sauvin for buttering it tends to give a weird buttering quality for me

 

[kal]

I'd also recommend by using the Sauvin for buttering it tends to give a weird buttering quality for me

I'm not sure what this means. Can you explain? Even if I change 'buttering' for 'bittering' I don't follow.

Thanks!

Kal

 

[crusader1612]

I'm not sure what this means. Can you explain? Even if I change 'buttering' for 'bittering' I don't follow.

Thanks!

Kal

Bittering. The 60 min addition i find it gives a weird flavour if u add it at 60. I'd try a neutral hop magnum or warrior etc.

 

[crusader1612]

I'm not sure what this means. Can you explain? Even if I change 'buttering' for 'bittering' I don't follow.

Thanks!

Kal

Stupid autocorrect.

 

[kal]

Thanks - It wasn't the autocorrect that actually confused me (I've seen that before). It was that you said:

"I'd also recommend by using the Sauvin ..."

When you probably meant to say:

"I'd also recommend NOT using the Sauvin ...".

Kal

 

[dtfleming]

For a 3 gal batch.
The nelson Sauvin turned out well.


6 lbs 8.0 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 91.5 %
9.6 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 2 8.5 %
0.30 oz Nelson Sauvin [12.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 3 21.9 IBUs
1.21 oz Wakatu [5.25 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 4 13.9 IBUs
0.60 oz Motueka [7.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 5 9.3 IBUs
0.30 oz Nelson Sauvin [12.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 6 7.9 IBUs
1.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05) [50.28 ml] Yeast 7 -
1.20 oz Wakatu [5.25 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 8 0.0 IBUs
0.60 oz Motueka [7.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days

 

[crusader1612]

Thanks - It wasn't the autocorrect that actually confused me (I've seen that before). It was that you said:

"I'd also recommend by using the Sauvin ..."

When you probably meant to say:

"I'd also recommend NOT using the Sauvin ...".

Kal

Ha! Just noticed that one sorry dude!

Kohatu is quite spicy and earthy. It pairs well with motueka. The tropics of galaxy and Nelson I'm not so sure.???

Nelson motueka are a good combo too.

 

[crusader1612]

Hey just a thought if you want to go 100% NZ get some southern cross or pacific jade or pacific gem. That way you'll have a Nz buttering hop

 

[chiteface]

If I are worries about the harshness and would rather have these flavor forward, try first wort hopping. And forego the 60 minute.

 

[bulldogbrewhaus]

If I are worries about the harshness and would rather have these flavor forward, try first wort hopping. And forego the 60 minute.

+1 on FWH.

 

[kal]

Thanks for the ideas guys... lots to think about.

Was considering going FWH instead of the 60 min addition too - I like that idea.

Kal

 

[crusader1612]

Thanks for the ideas guys... lots to think about.

Was considering going FWH instead of the 60 min addition too - I like that idea.

Kal

FWH Sounds good to me.
Like I said Nelson tends to overpower, funnily enough, I actually used your Electric Pale Ale Recipe as inspiration, on my APA.

 

[tallguybrewer]

I agree with the Pacific Jade recommendation, I think it would work really well in an IPA. I made an all Pacific Jade Amercian Wheat style beer and after a few months it tasted very juicy. I do not get the "black pepper" that is in the decription. Made the same beer with Motueka and did not care for it.

Pacifica would work well in an IPA as well as it can be very citrusy. If you've ever had Uinta's Hop Notch, I believe about 50% of the dry hop in that beer is Galaxy. I think if I were to include Nelson in an IPA, it would be in the background. I base this solely on Widmer's Nelson IPA as I have never actually brewed with it. If you are set on only using what is on hand, I would make Galaxy the star of the show.

Not to get too off topic, but I would just like to compliment you on your amazing home brewery and entertainment space.