6 oz of hops and no flavor...

[Deadalus]

Published yeast attenuation ranges are fairly useless, IMO. The fermentability of the wort is important, sometimes more important, than the yeast strain.

They can be a useful guide for diagnosis and also for planning recipes. Here, the OP used an expired packet and a fresher one. We know the OP's attenuation was almost in range. Not a lot of evidence to suggest the yeast wasn't working. Maybe a slightly different temperature regime could have pushed it into the range or simply call it good as it was real close. If it had been 65% we might be asking different questions.

 

[TheMadKing]

Definitely give rehydration a try. It's always good to be willing to experiment.

Just don't assume that the number of people writing strongly in favor of something is an indicator of how many people actually do it.

The manufacturer recommends against rehydrating, saying that it's not necessary, FWIW

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

The manufacturer recommends against rehydrating, saying that it's not necessary, FWIW

The last time I looked at the US-05 product information sheet, they seemed to be comfortable with either pitching dry or reyhdrating - as they offer instructions for both techniques. There's a S-04 product information sheet from about 15 years ago in the "internet archives" that says pretty much the same thing (link available upon request).

So, with two data points, I'm willing to suggest that Fermentis, via their product information sheets, has been comfortable with either technique for over 15 years.

Some day, maybe the "consensus" of home brewers in forums will reach a similar comfort level.

 

[Yooper]

1 lb - Crystal 20L
1 lb - Carapils
2 oz - Nugget at 60 mins
2 oz - Falconers at 30 mins

This right here grabbed me as the reason for a sweet drink with little hops flavor.

That's WAY too much crystal malt. And four ounces of bittering hops will give you plenty of bitterness, depending on your boil size, but 0 hops flavor and aroma.

I may have missed it, but was this a full boil? If so, you'd have a ton of bitterness, but little in flavor or aroma other than that 2 ounces of amarillo.

Also, store your hops in the freezer in oxygen free packaging. That makes a world of difference.

Honestly, your recipe sucks. That's the problem. There are so many better recipe kits out there that the guy who put this together for you should be ashamed of himself. It sounds like someone throw things together to get a high OG but didn't balance the recipe with quality ingredients or with a goal in mind.

 

[Yooper]

Ahh gotcha, I thought maybe it was a partial mash with just the crystal malts.

No such thing as a partial mash with just crystal malts- there is no way to mash them without a base malt. But even then, it's too much crystal for a 5 gallon batch anyway.

 

[TheMadKing]

The last time I looked at the US-05 product information sheet, they seemed to be comfortable with either pitching dry or reyhdrating - as they offer instructions for both techniques. There's a S-04 product information sheet from about 15 years ago in the "internet archives" that says pretty much the same thing (link available upon request).

So, with two data points, I'm willing to suggest that Fermentis, via their product information sheets, has been comfortable with either technique for over 15 years.

Some day, maybe the "consensus" of home brewers in forums will reach a similar comfort level.

https://www.masterbrewerspodcast.com/093
Give this a listen, starting at 18:00 minutes in. The guys talking are scientists (or former scientists) for Fermentis

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Give this a listen, starting at 18:00 minutes in. The guys talking are scientists (or former scientists) for Fermentis

I follow MBA podcasts pretty closely, but listened to it again. They mention that pitching dry works well and the process is less complicated than rehydrating. That seems to confirm the S-04 product information sheet from 2004.

If you go back to replies #33, #34 & #36, the discussion was around how to ferment a bigger beer. People will, on occasion, claim they get better results when rehydrating dry yeast. So if someone is getting poor results when pitching dry into a high OG wort, it seems reasonable to give rehydrating a try.

 

[TheMadKing]

I follow MBA podcasts pretty closely, but listened to it again. They mention that pitching dry works well and the process is less complicated than rehydrating. That seems to confirm the S-04 product information sheet from 2004.

If you go back to replies #33, #34 & #36, the discussion was around how to ferment a bigger beer. People will, on occasion, claim they get better results when rehydrating dry yeast. So if someone is getting poor results when pitching dry into a high OG wort, it seems reasonable to give rehydrating a try.

Just like to point out that they also mention testing a variety of rehydrating media, including wort of various concentrations and temperatures and found no difference in yeast performance. I would think your effort and time might be better spent adding oxygen rather than rehydrating.

At worst its useless and a minor waste of time, and at best it helps, so I agree that it's not unreasonable to give it a shot. I would just think that a good yeast nutrient and some pure O2 might be better methods for boosting your fermentation health.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

... so I agree that it's not unreasonable to give it a shot.

Thank you.

 

[VirginiaHops1]

I just did an American IPA 4 gallon batch with 1lb of 40L crystal, the rest 2-row. Turned out great, didn't taste super sweet, certainly not like Pepsi. I've also had batches of my NEIPAs finish pretty high like 1.020-1.022. Those also didn't taste sweet. Residual sugars don't really taste that sweet. Now, maybe your issue is the combination of the 2. I've never done an American IPA with crystal malts and have it finish that high.

In terms of lack of hop flavor and/or off-flavors, make sure your cold side practices are sound to avoid oxidation.

 

[stickyfinger]

Residual sugars don't really taste that sweet.

unless they are simple sugars that should have been taken care of by the yeast. then, they will taste sweet. i agree though in principle. I've made insanely high FG beers with high mash temps that don't taste sweet, or at least you would never guess they were that high of an FG.

you know, one thing I was also thinking is that some people just have a higher tolerance for sweet flavors. duh! i did a club brew a few years ago to make a belgian dark strong. my friend said his version was horribly sweet and he was going to dump it. his FG seemed fine. i got some of his beer and it tasted amazing to me. i think he was more confusing maltiness and caramel flavor with sweet (as he was really more of a light lager kind of guy at heart) and possibly he just has more of an aversion to any sweetness in a beer.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

you know, one thing I was also thinking is that some people just have a higher tolerance for sweet flavors. duh! i did a club brew a few years ago to make a belgian dark strong. my friend said his version was horribly sweet and he was going to dump it. his FG seemed fine. i got some of his beer and it tasted amazing to me. i think he was more confusing maltiness and caramel flavor with sweet (as he was really more of a light lager kind of guy at heart) and possibly he just has more of an aversion to any sweetness in a beer.

^^^ THIS ^^^

Some people like their beers "sweeter", or "less hoppy", or "If I wanted to a drink that tastes like grapefruit juice, I'd order grapefruit juice".

There's a reference to a "brewing science" article in The New IPA that "supports" this (IIRC, it's in the first couple paragraphs of chapter 5).

 

[VirginiaHops1]

unless they are simple sugars that should have been taken care of by the yeast. then, they will taste sweet. i agree though in principle. I've made insanely high FG beers with high mash temps that don't taste sweet, or at least you would never guess they were that high of an FG.

you know, one thing I was also thinking is that some people just have a higher tolerance for sweet flavors. duh! i did a club brew a few years ago to make a belgian dark strong. my friend said his version was horribly sweet and he was going to dump it. his FG seemed fine. i got some of his beer and it tasted amazing to me. i think he was more confusing maltiness and caramel flavor with sweet (as he was really more of a light lager kind of guy at heart) and possibly he just has more of an aversion to any sweetness in a beer.

Sounds like you agree in more than just principle if you've actually seen it happen, in practice. My handful of hazy IPAs that finished at or above 1.020 weren't any sweeter than my beers that finish at 1.012. So maybe there is a way to **** it up and have a beer that tastes like Pepsi from residual sugars but I sure haven't seen it.