How many ppm of sufate for a hoppy ipa

Hello,

I am a hop head and love very hoppy and juicy ipa's. To produce an ipa of this magnitude, how many ppm of sulfate should I shoot for. I usually adjust my water to get about 250ppm of gypsum but feel like my ipa's are still lacking that desired flavor, aroma, and longevity. I know a lot of factors go into this equation, really I just want to know how many ppm of sulfate everyone else shoots for when brewing a very hop forward beer. Do you guys also add gypsum or calcium chloride to the mash, if so what are the added benefits? I always add my brewing salts to the mash.

For my IPA's I'll usually do 120 - 150 ppm sulfate and around 60 - 70 ppm calcium chloride. I've done as much as 300 ppm sulfate but it was way to much. I can pick up sulfate pretty easy and anything over 150 ppm tastes drying to me. I get plenty of hop character with this ratio, as I usually do lots of flameout additions.

Sulfate content and bittering level do have some interplay. As I've mentioned in the past, sulfate content helps dry the beer finish and allows bittering perception to come out more prominently. If you have a recipe that was formulated for low sulfate and then goose it with a high sulfate water, it may fall out of balance and away from your preferences. In a way, using elevated sulfate content in bittered beers can allow you to reduce your bittering level and save you a bit of money. That is a pittance for a homebrewer, but might be significant for a pro.

Don't be surprised if some recipe adjustment is needed when boosting SO4.

I tried 300ppm of sulfate the last time and I thought it was too much. Some say up to 300, some (I believe it was the mad fermenationist and Palmer in his water book) say 175ppm. Some say its not just the sulfate level but the ratio of sulfate to chloride (while others, of course, say this is bogus).

When I did 300pm, I had about 45ppm chloride for a ratio of about 6 to 1. With 175 it'll be closer to 3.5 to 1.

I think the only way to really get it right is to brew the same recipe 2-3 times trying different levels.

how you transfer your beer also plays a massive roll in your IPA's lasting as well. Mine also lost it until I started to do closed transfers and eliminating oxygen.

A sulfate level of 180ppm seems to be the sweetspot for me, any higher than that tends to make the beer a bit too harsh tasting. Although you haven't provided the details of your IPA brewing water, the alkalinity of the IPA brewing water is something to consider. Because higher levels of alkalinity in the brewing water will also have a dulling affect on the flavor, color and taste of the finished beer.

YOpassDAmike said:

Hello,

I am a hop head and love very hoppy and juicy ipa's. To produce an ipa of this magnitude, how many ppm of sulfate should I shoot for. I usually adjust my water to get about 250ppm of gypsum but feel like my ipa's are still lacking that desired flavor, aroma, and longevity. I know a lot of factors go into this equation, really I just want to know how many ppm of sulfate everyone else shoots for when brewing a very hop forward beer. Do you guys also add gypsum or calcium chloride to the mash, if so what are the added benefits? I always add my brewing salts to the mash.

Click to expand...

I believe the only reason you would add salts to the mash instead of the kettle is to help with mash pH. If using acid additions to achieve your desired mash pH, you can add the salts to the kettle after draining the mash tun to get the water profile you are looking for. While on the topic of mash pH, I think some have stated a higher pH of 5.5-5.6 might mute the hops a little bit. pH of 5.3-5.4 might be more desirable. Something to think about if you are measuring your pH.

Count me in as someone who bumped my sulfate to 300ppm and did not prefer it. However, I did not make the same recipe again with a lower amount of sulfate to determine if it was the salt addition or the recipe itself I did not like. The taste and descriptions I read on this forum led me to believe it was from the salts.

If not getting the desired hop flavor and aroma, maybe you should provide your recipe and get feedback on hop additions? A lot of people have stated whirlpool and/or flameout additions have really enhanced the hops in their beers.

I aim b/w 5.3 & 5.4 with all pale's and IPA's. Sulfate levels are all based on the individuals palette. Some go up to 300ppm. In my south pacific IPA, I brewed it with 105ppm SO4 the first time and loved it. Second time brewed it with 150-160 ppm SO4 and though it did have the added bitterness from it, I thought the batch with 105ppm tasted better and had a better balance so brewed a 3rd time using the original water profile and definitely confirms...for me I think my palette just prefer lower SO4 levels with that recipe. However, the Deschutes inspired Fresh squeezed IPA clone I used the 150-160 ppm SO4 and it works perfectly with that beer. If you want a hoppier/juicier IPA's you might need to look at recipe & technique rather than get too focused on sulfate levels imo.

My latest is at 350ppm SO4 and 24ppm Cl.

Used 300/24 on my last DIPA and still didn't have that punch I was after. In fact, it was far more mild and "juicy" than expected. Had over a pound of hops for 5-gal, was a huge beer. Had a big bittering charge of 3oz Columbus, a few other hops late in the boil and a long hop stand. The 350/24 or so is what Fat Heads uses for one of my favorite IPA's, so it's worth trying!

For another Azacca single hop IPA I did, I think I used 250/50. Didn't have that punch, either. Added gypsum directly in the glass, mixed and drank that. Preferred it over the standard for that drying/bittering quality with high ratios.

grassfeeder said:

how you transfer your beer also plays a massive roll in your IPA's lasting as well. Mine also lost it until I started to do closed transfers and eliminating oxygen.

Click to expand...

What is a closed transfer and how do I perform one? What equipment is needed for a closed transfer, thanks.

grassfeeder said:

how you transfer your beer also plays a massive roll in your IPA's lasting as well. Mine also lost it until I started to do closed transfers and eliminating oxygen.

Click to expand...

Any links to proof in this? I've never done a closed/CO2 environment transfer and love my IPA's, never heard of such a theory as the one you're suggesting?

Invertalon said:

My latest is at 350ppm SO4 and 24ppm Cl.

Used 300/24 on my last DIPA and still didn't have that punch I was after. In fact, it was far more mild and "juicy" than expected. Had over a pound of hops for 5-gal, was a huge beer. Had a big bittering charge of 3oz Columbus, a few other hops late in the boil and a long hop stand. The 350/24 or so is what Fat Heads uses for one of my favorite IPA's, so it's worth trying!

For another Azacca single hop IPA I did, I think I used 250/50. Didn't have that punch, either. Added gypsum directly in the glass, mixed and drank that. Preferred it over the standard for that drying/bittering quality with high ratios.

Click to expand...

Jeez dude.....did you seriously burn your taste buds with boiling water or extra hot coffee in your past? hahaha. Not sure what to tell you there, that's just ridiculous amounts to only get such a mild sense of hop...

Given mash pH is correct and other mineral levels arent out of range, I shoot for 150-250ppm sulfate. I like to experiment as well. Most of my IPA/DIPA are 200-250ppm sulfate and 25-50ppm Cl. My Pale I have on tap now, I just went with 150ppm sulfate and didnt add any Cl (so it was around 10ppm). Still came out pretty hoppy (in a good way). I use 002 and 007 99% of the time so I feel the slight ester profile from the yeast helps with dry hop aroma popping out.

Next time I brew Zombie Dust, I am going to try it with 150ppm instead of 250ppm and note the difference (if any)

Edit: Ive used 300ppm before and it left a lingering bitterness on the tongue and was too much for my palate.