No Hop Stout

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Brewmeistermj

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I just brewed a hopless stout over the weekend. Is it still a stout? Can I still call it Ale? With hop prices through the roof and the fact that my brewing budget has taken a hit, I decided to try something new. In my last few brews I have decreased my hops and increased my roasted barley to maintain balance. So far my results have been good. I welcome any comments or criticism.
 
You can't afford $3 worth of hops to bitter a batch of stout? It's still beer. Hops were outlawed in England for many years until they could no longer fight it.
 
Where in WI are you? A hopless stout sounds too malty for my taste buds, but cool, let us know how it turns out. Start growing your own hops. Won't be too much longer and you should be ready to plant them.
 
I don't think It's even a stout. At the very least, a stout without hops is brewed nowhere close to style.
 
I also heard that Wisconsin was a major producer of hop for a brief period late in the nineteenth century before the little hoppies were practically wiped out by downy mildew in the 1920s.
 
I'm not sure where you're buying your supplies, but most online retailers' hop prices have come way down. Just glanced at Midwest for an example and all of their 1oz packages are under $3.00 and they even have glacier as low as $1.50. It seems like most places have a good selection right now as well and have lifted thier restrictions.
 
Actually, you can call it 'ale'!

Of all the styles to experiment with 'hopless' recipes, I think a Stout is a good one. Do let us know how it turns out.
 
It is certainly a stout. If people can constantly invoke the Reinheitsgebot, you can use Medieval ale definitions.
 
Thank's for the help guys:mug: I guess I am still a little frustrated with the price of hops and my declining income. I am just looking at ways to save a few bucks and still make good beer. Two years ago I bought 5lbs of cascade from hops direct for $23. So I still have sticker shock. Scottish ale sounds like a good idea,i will definately look into it. I am dedicated to brewing quality beer and I thought maybe somebody else was doing something similiar. When I started brewing 15 years ago I also started growing my own hops. I spent a lot of time growing and harvesting them for really not that much yield. Hop pellets were cheap and stored well so I gave up on it. This past summer I started a new hop mound. Anyway, when I tap my first hopless stout I will let y'all know how it turned out.
 
MilwaukeeBrewGuy said:
I also heard that Wisconsin was a major producer of hop for a brief period late in the nineteenth century before the little hoppies were practically wiped out by downy mildew in the 1920s.
Click to expand...

Yes, Wisconsin was a hop producer a century ago. Our climate is similiar to Germany so I guess it makes sense. As you mentioned mildew and disease ended the production here. I would also like to add a little more beer history. Most people think that brewing in Wisconsin started with Best,Schlitz,Blatz,Pabst,Miller. But it all really started with the frontier brewers,the farm brewers in the mid 19th century. Before mass production you had your local guys doing what they did best. There was no alternative. This
is often overlooked in most history books. There were many farm breweries in Wisconsin. My father and a few friends have documented a large number of them and will publish a book in the near future.
 
david_42 said:
It is certainly a stout. If people can constantly invoke the Reinheitsgebot, you can use Medieval ale definitions.
Click to expand...

My only point was that hops have been a part of stout recipes since the style developed. I'm not saying that it won't be beer, or an ale, or even tasty.
 
Tech211 said:
My only point was that hops have been a part of stout recipes since the style developed. I'm not saying that it won't be beer, or an ale, or even tasty.
Click to expand...

You are right that stout is a modern (read: hopped) style, but it grew out of older English traditions in which hops was seldom used. The very name "Mugwort" implies that it is an herb (a "wort") used in the "mug" (for ale).

I don't think it is inaccurate to call that Mugwort "stout" a modern version of a medieval English strong ale or old ale. The addition of honey and molasses to increase aging potential, as well as mugwort and licorice are very historically accurate. Many old ales were also made without the use of any herbs whatsoever, hops or otherwise. And because of the more primitive techniques for roasting malt, it was common for some of the malt to be charred due to uneven roasting, giving the beer a stout-like quality.

If we wanted to make it even more historically authentic, we'd use oat malt in addition to barley malt, but to my knowledge oat malt is not commercially made today so we have to settle for flaked oats.
 
Brewmeistermj said:
There were many farm breweries in Wisconsin. My father and a few friends have documented a large number of them and will publish a book in the near future.
Click to expand...


That would be cool, keep us updated. Brewing history fascinates me.
 
brewmonger said:
You are right that stout is a modern (read: hopped) style, but it grew out of older English traditions in which hops was seldom used. The very name "Mugwort" implies that it is an herb (a "wort") used in the "mug" (for ale).

I don't think it is inaccurate to call that Mugwort "stout" a modern version of a medieval English strong ale or old ale. The addition of honey and molasses to increase aging potential, as well as mugwort and licorice are very historically accurate. Many old ales were also made without the use of any herbs whatsoever, hops or otherwise. And because of the more primitive techniques for roasting malt, it was common for some of the malt to be charred due to uneven roasting, giving the beer a stout-like quality.

If we wanted to make it even more historically authentic, we'd use oat malt in addition to barley malt, but to my knowledge oat malt is not commercially made today so we have to settle for flaked oats.
Click to expand...

TF makes an oat malt. North Country and Northern Brewer carry it.
 
joety said:
Where are you in Wisconsin?
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I live in Watertown. My wife was born here and grew up in this town so I moved here after we got married. I see from your post you are from Germantown. I grew up in Richfield so I guess it's a small world after all.:mug:
 
flyangler18 said:
Actually, you can call it 'ale'!

Of all the styles to experiment with 'hopless' recipes, I think a Stout is a good one. Do let us know how it turns out.
Click to expand...

I just tapped it today. I was getting dangerously low on homebrew so I kegged it as soon as I could. It turned out as you would expect. Kind of like a cup of coffee with a sprinkle of sugar. I normally brew my stout's between 25 & 35 ibu's so this flavor is new to me. I do like it though. The acid test was when I asked my wife to try a sample. When I first starting brewing if it didn't taste like Miller Lite she didn't like it. Over time she has become more understanding of different styles and will drink most of the beer I brew. She really liked this one. I am kind of a hophead and miss the hops. It still turned out pretty good and I am glad I tried it.
 
I want to try this with chocolate as the bittering agent in place of hops, obviously not to save money.
 
Brewmeistermj said:
I just brewed a hopless stout over the weekend. Is it still a stout? Can I still call it Ale? With hop prices through the roof and the fact that my brewing budget has taken a hit, I decided to try something new. In my last few brews I have decreased my hops and increased my roasted barley to maintain balance. So far my results have been good. I welcome any comments or criticism.
Click to expand...

Old Post but I thought I would let you know when visiting Australia recently I had a wonderful hop-less stout...

I plan to try to recreate it though I may toss in 1 oz of fuggles for an 11 gallon batch...
 

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