Weissbier Bee Cave Brewery Bavarian Hefeweizen

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TxBigHops said:
My Hallertau hops and Wyeast 3068 arrived yesterday! I will buy my grains this weekend and brew up this beauty one day next week. I've been getting excellent efficiency lately, and want to keep this down in the low 5% ranges, so will back off to 10 pounds of grain.

Q1: Does it make any discernable difference if I do a 60/40 or a 65/35 wheat to pilsner ratio?

Q2: What's the purpose for the 90 min mash? I've never intentionally done more than 60 minutes.

Q3: I assume with pilsner malt that I also need to boil for 90 minutes. Last 90 minute boil I did, I ended up with lower than desired volume due to my kettle being just 9 gallons. Safe starting level is about 7.75 gallons, so I was thinking of pulling off that amount, then putting another gallon into my mash tun while I begin the boil, and topping the kettle back up just before the first hop addition. Good or bad idea? Or should I just top up with straight water? Either way I would run my calcs with a beginning boil volume of 8.5-8.75 gallons.
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Gonna try one more time. Buying my grain tomorrow to brew on Saturday. Would love to get some thoughts on my questions.
 
Hey TX - thought I'd take a shot at your questions, not sure how much help I'll be as I've only been brewing for 2 years...
Q1 - Wheat to Pilsner ratio? -- This one I have no idea about. I'm fairly sure that a 5% difference in both as base grains won't make too perceptible of an impact. As long as you're in the range with wheat and pilsner, I'm sure it will be fine. The yeast will bring out the expected flavors. I'm curious though, why are you thinking of changing the recipe?
Q2 - 90 min. mash... I've actually seen this in alot of EdWort's recipes. While a 90 min mash isn't really essential, he's commented that it gives him time to get other things done. I've done 60 min and 90 min mashes with other recipes in the past (Bee-Cave Rye IPA for one), and I think the 90 min mash did get higher efficiency... is it worth a half hour of your day? Your call, as long as the conversion has taken place.
Q3 - I haven't had too much experience with this as I usually let whatever OG stand, even if I'm off. The one time I way overshot, I just added bottled water to my fermenter, using a calculator online to determine how much. http://www.brewersfriend.com/dilution-and-boiloff-gravity-calculator/
Hope that helps!
 
slohiker said:
Hey TX - thought I'd take a shot at your questions, not sure how much help I'll be as I've only been brewing for 2 years...
Q1 - Wheat to Pilsner ratio? -- This one I have no idea about. I'm fairly sure that a 5% difference in both as base grains won't make too perceptible of an impact. As long as you're in the range with wheat and pilsner, I'm sure it will be fine. The yeast will bring out the expected flavors. I'm curious though, why are you thinking of changing the recipe?
Q2 - 90 min. mash... I've actually seen this in alot of EdWort's recipes. While a 90 min mash isn't really essential, he's commented that it gives him time to get other things done. I've done 60 min and 90 min mashes with other recipes in the past (Bee-Cave Rye IPA for one), and I think the 90 min mash did get higher efficiency... is it worth a half hour of your day? Your call, as long as the conversion has taken place.
Q3 - I haven't had too much experience with this as I usually let whatever OG stand, even if I'm off. The one time I way overshot, I just added bottled water to my fermenter, using a calculator online to determine how much. http://www.brewersfriend.com/dilution-and-boiloff-gravity-calculator/
Hope that helps!
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Hey, thanks for taking a shot. The reason I'm dropping the original recipe from 11 lbs of grain to 10 lbs is because I've been getting 75-80% efficiency and I want the beer to be under 5.5% ABV.
 
TxBigHops said:
I don't really have a plan yet... Looking for some guidance / answers. :confused:
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Yeah, sorry...was trolling a bit. :p


Q1: The % difference won't matter.

Q2: The longer boil is to combat DMS that Pilsner Malt produces. With that low of an amount, I wouldn't bother if it's going to cause more problems.

Q3: You SHOULD be able to pull off about 70 minutes of boil without dramatically affecting anything. I still think this is unnecessary, however, you should let your gravity decide. Add just water to your boil if you are above your target OG and do nothing or boil longer if you are below.
 
I am pretty sure I overpitched...the smack pack deceived me and I poured what I thought was about half but ended up being nearly all, into a 2 gallon batch! Oh, well...I guess it will just turn out to be beer! :tank:
 
Had a very successful brew day yesterday. Had mad efficiency of over 85%. After 30 minutes of the boil I added and additional 1/2 gallon of 1.004 runnings and finished with over 6 gallons into the Big Mouth Bubbler. Took the following pic just 20 hours after pitching. Krausen filling up the head space. Awesome fermentation at about 61-62 degrees. Probably going to need a blow off tube by tomorrow.

20151115_160901.jpg
 
Biscuits said:
I am pretty sure I overpitched...the smack pack deceived me and I poured what I thought was about half but ended up being nearly all, into a 2 gallon batch! Oh, well...I guess it will just turn out to be beer! :tank:
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Biscuits, how is your ferment doing? This was my first experience with Wyeast, and I love it so far. Only took three attempts to break the nutrient package, and my envelope was about to explode at ptching time, around 4-5 hours after I smacked it. Hooked up a blowoff just before bed last night, and good thing! head space was completely full and a bit of krausen entering the tube this morning. Even without a starter, I don't think there is any way I underpitched, based on what I'm seeing right now. Date on the package was 10/5/15 - so nice, fresh yeast. Thanks Northern Brewer!
 
Bottled mine today and it tastes delicious already! Very excited to try one in a few weeks :mug:
 
TxBigHops said:
Biscuits, how is your ferment doing? This was my first experience with Wyeast, and I love it so far. Only took three attempts to break the nutrient package, and my envelope was about to explode at ptching time, around 4-5 hours after I smacked it. Hooked up a blowoff just before bed last night, and good thing! head space was completely full and a bit of krausen entering the tube this morning. Even without a starter, I don't think there is any way I underpitched, based on what I'm seeing right now. Date on the package was 10/5/15 - so nice, fresh yeast. Thanks Northern Brewer!
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I had a very similar experience... I am in love with smack packs now!

hefsplosion.jpg
 
bembel said:
Your friend is going to be PSYCHED!!!! This recipe is dead on if you ferment at 62 and pitch properly. I would pitch at 62 as well, I pitched low at 55 last batch thinking to follow the 'rule of 30', wanting to ramp it up to 62 and had a hard time getting going, even with a nice starter, until I warmed things up into the mid 60's, and by then the temp swing had freaked out the bugs and I got a banana explosion followed by a stuck fermentation at 1.025 when I tried to cool it back down. Mosher's book to the rescue, made a half liter starter and let if go just PAST high krausen, then added it to the stuck and had nice little bubbles a day later at 62F, now its dried out down at about 1010.

Ironically

I have made 11 attempts brews in the past 4 months using this recipe, all chasing Weihenstephaner with slight variations to dial it in, but can't quite get the clove forward enough nor mimic the lingering malt sweetness. However this bottle of Ayinger is much more subtle in both clove and banana and finished crisper without the maltiness. If this is your friends favorite beer, you found your clone!

Incidentally, I also drank a Weihenstephaner Dunkel last night, which was very bananna forward vs. their Hefewizen

Included a shot of the bottle cap, which is pretty cool, you can make a label from it if you like

Cheers!
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@bembel, I now have temp control, and I've been fermenting at or below 62 per your recommendation. I'm now four days in, and the ferment is starting to slow. I was thinking I should start to ramp it up a bit, and increased my temp controller to 63 this morning. Should I keep going, maybe 1 degree every day or two? Day 9 I will be going out of town for 5 days, and I may not be able to keep it as well monitored while I'm gone, so thinking it would be best to have it up in the higher 60s by then. I will return and bottle on day 15.
 
I just want to say that I took a hydro sample today and after taking the gravity, I poured it into a glass and took a sip. Now, normally, even some of my better tasting brews, I would only drink maybe a few sips and then dump the remaineder because uncarbonated beer just doesn't do it for me...but I seriously could not stop drinking today's sample. I am kicking myself in the ass now for not committing to a 5 gallon batch of this! It is so good, I cannot wait to get this stuff carbonated!
 
TxBigHops said:
@bembel, I now have temp control, and I've been fermenting at or below 62 per your recommendation. I'm now four days in, and the ferment is starting to slow. I was thinking I should start to ramp it up a bit, and increased my temp controller to 63 this morning. Should I keep going, maybe 1 degree every day or two? Day 9 I will be going out of town for 5 days, and I may not be able to keep it as well monitored while I'm gone, so thinking it would be best to have it up in the higher 60s by then. I will return and bottle on day 15.
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Bubbles have stopped coming out of my blow off tube. I'm going to take a gravity sample today. Temp controller is on 64. Still trying to decide if I want to ramp up a bit, or keep it cool. I guess I will know more after reading and tasting the sample. According to previous advice, to get as close as I can to Ayinger Brau Weisse I want to keep the esters to a minimum.
 
Ok here is what i said in an earlier post , this batch was amazing !!! Finally! 5 attempts and it's perfect! The first was an extract version, my wife's favorite. Next 2 partial mash attempts. Lastly 2 all grain versions, with this last one bordering on phenomenal! I followed eds recipe exactly except I added 2 oz of acid malt. My well h2o is extremely alkaline, so I figured the acid malt would help with mash. All my numbers were an exact match with eds. I kept the fermentation temps between 62F-65F ,then let it go to 75F after 7 days. Pictures to come. Prost!
 
Livendadream said:
Ok here is what i said in an earlier post , this batch was amazing !!! Finally! 5 attempts and it's perfect! The first was an extract version, my wife's favorite. Next 2 partial mash attempts. Lastly 2 all grain versions, with this last one bordering on phenomenal! I followed eds recipe exactly except I added 2 oz of acid malt. My well h2o is extremely alkaline, so I figured the acid malt would help with mash. All my numbers were an exact match with eds. I kept the fermentation temps between 62F-65F ,then let it go to 75F after 7 days. Pictures to come. Prost!
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So wondering what flavors you consider perfect? Did you get much banana at those low ferment temps? That's what I'm trying to avoid, and if my 7 day sample that I just took is any indication, I'm there. I have a mild spiciness and some lemon. Bit of breadiness in the aroma.
 
Of course everyone's taste perception is different. What I was going for is more balance between all flavors. So my beer had the banana, clove and hints of bubblegum flavors. But they were very mellow, enough so that the wheat spiciness punched through. I also used the acid malt so I'm not sure if that helped with the spicy /tartness or if it was the wheat malt. Anyway it had a huge creamy mouthfeel and a nice crisp malty character with mellow clove, banana and spice flavors. It was not quite as sweet as ayinger( which I love) but it was close. I think they do a decoction mash. I've never tried this but want to on the next batch. I also used white labs yeast because LHBS was out of wyeast. We have a local beer here called La Cumbre a Slice of Hefen it is what I was shooting for. In the 5 batches I made, I learned low fermentation temps and yeast pitch rate are the key factors to make this beer great. I think you will be amazed how good your beer will turn out.
 
Cooling down the wort on this as I type this. My garage smells pretty amazing right now.

I stumbled upon this thread while looking for a ginger beer recipe. In one of the threads about ginger beer, someone suggested to start with an amber ale or a hefeweizen and add ginger. So, that's what I just did with this recipe.
 
Just bottled 6.5 liters of this one today. My numbers were a little off - 1.064 / 1.012 (oops), but the sample I pulled at bottling tasted just about right! Sort of a fresh bread smell coming from the fermentor. A little of the expected "green apple" flavor at bottling, but this one is my best heff so far - thanks to the OP. Should be ready for everyone at Christmas!
 
Made a Canadian version of this using canadian pils and wheat malts. OG was 1.050 and FG was 1.005 only after 7 days.... Any ideas to why I got such a low FG? Don't think it was infected seeing as it looks, smells, and tastes totally fine.
 
Well - if it looks fine, smells fine, and tastes fine, it probably is fine....did you make a starter (was the yeast raging) - I could see where it could crank down in 7 days (though let mine go for 12 :)).
 
Nope didn't even use a starter, that's why it's so perplexing... Oh well, still an awesome recipe! Gotta love the simplicity.
 
dima3719 said:
Made a Canadian version of this using canadian pils and wheat malts. OG was 1.050 and FG was 1.005 only after 7 days.... Any ideas to why I got such a low FG? Don't think it was infected seeing as it looks, smells, and tastes totally fine.
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Did you mash at a lower temp? I mashed at 153. OG of 1.053 went down to 1.013 in 7 days, FG of 1.011 in 15 days. Something in your mash procedure got you more fermentable sugars, and less unfermentable ones. Also, what was your fermentation temp?
 
To those of you who are bottling this - how much corn sugar do you use? Brewer's Friend calculator recommends carbing German Wheat's to 3.3 - 4.5 volumes. That would have been over 8 oz of corn sugar in my 5.5 gal batch!!! That kinda scared me (bottle bombs and such) but I want this beer to be carbed to style, so I went ahead and used 7.5 oz. Approx 3.0 volumes. I had never carbed a beer above 2.5 volumes before this one.
 
TxBigHops said:
To those of you who are bottling this - how much corn sugar do you use? Brewer's Friend calculator recommends carbing German Wheat's to 3.3 - 4.5 volumes. That would have been over 8 oz of corn sugar in my 5.5 gal batch!!! That kinda scared me (bottle bombs and such) but I want this beer to be carbed to style, so I went ahead and used 7.5 oz. Approx 3.0 volumes. I had never carbed a beer above 2.5 volumes before this one.
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That sounds like it's going to be....lively. I used 2.2 oz of dextrose for 2.5 gallons - and THAT seemed like a lot to me. Beersmith was showing me 2.4 vols - I'll know right about Christmas...
 
Over two weeks in the bottle and I tried one tonight. I fermented on the low side around 64-ish and mine came out very spicy, almost warming, of cloves and other similar spices. I am very very shocked (in a good way), I've never tried something like this. I had to look to see if a clove grew in the bottle :D
 
TxBigHops said:
To those of you who are bottling this - how much corn sugar do you use? Brewer's Friend calculator recommends carbing German Wheat's to 3.3 - 4.5 volumes. That would have been over 8 oz of corn sugar in my 5.5 gal batch!!! That kinda scared me (bottle bombs and such) but I want this beer to be carbed to style, so I went ahead and used 7.5 oz. Approx 3.0 volumes. I had never carbed a beer above 2.5 volumes before this one.
Click to expand...

I ran into the same problem with the online calculators...

I used 4.5oz for this beer and it came out great to my liking. I was worried about too much carbonation it (which annoys my girlfriend) so I feel 4.5oz is a happy medium
 
I used 3 Oz. corn sugar for 2 gallons...carbonation is near perfect for the style...haven't had any bottle bombs yet...been conditioning for 10 days now.
 
TxBigHops said:
To those of you who are bottling this - how much corn sugar do you use? Brewer's Friend calculator recommends carbing German Wheat's to 3.3 - 4.5 volumes. That would have been over 8 oz of corn sugar in my 5.5 gal batch!!! That kinda scared me (bottle bombs and such) but I want this beer to be carbed to style, so I went ahead and used 7.5 oz. Approx 3.0 volumes. I had never carbed a beer above 2.5 volumes before this one.
Click to expand...

This link - http://homebrewanswers.com/?s=PRIMING+BY+STYLE&post_type=document - shows 2.9 volumes to be "Very High". I think with standard beer bottles it would be best to stay at or below this value to be safe.
 
ncbrewer said:
This link - http://homebrewanswers.com/?s=PRIMING+BY+STYLE&post_type=document - shows 2.9 volumes to be "Very High". I think with standard beer bottles it would be best to stay at or below this value to be safe.
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So I skimmed that article pretty thoroughly. It's a pretty basic level bottling how-to, and I didn't see anything that said it would not be safe to go over 2.9 volumes. In fact, it referred the reader to the Brewer's Friend calculator that I used. I also found another online calculator that recomended 9.2 oz of corn sugar (4.04 volumes) for my batch size when bottling a German Hefe.

I gotta believe that carbing to these levels is not dangerous with this style of beer. Not sure exactly why a different style might make a difference, but I'm not going to worry too much. I'll report back here once I start opening these in about a week. (or less) :mug:
 
ncbrewer said:
You got me more interested, so I did a search and found this Pro Brewer thread: http://discussions.probrewer.com/showthread.php?35855-Maximum-carbonation-in-bottled-beer
Worthwhile reading.
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Interesting, sure, but still just two guys going back and forth with differing OPINIONS. While on the other hand, no warnings on any of the bottle priming calculator web sites, and plenty of recommendations to bottle Hefeweizens at well over 3.0 volumes.

Certainly I'm not going to position my eyes directly above the bottles when I open them, or shake them around more than necessary when handling. But until I have reason to believe otherwise, I feel it's safe to prime this beer as high as 4 volumes without undue concern.
 
ncbrewer said:
You got me more interested, so I did a search and found this Pro Brewer thread: http://discussions.probrewer.com/showthread.php?35855-Maximum-carbonation-in-bottled-beer
Worthwhile reading.
Click to expand...

More reading material:

http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/glass-bottle-c02-threshold.174524/

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=156902

About half my batch is in bombers and Grohlsch bottles. The rest in standard 12 oz longnecks. If I decide to go higher with a future batch, I'll make sure I have more higher quality bottles.
 

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