Mixing Rye and Wheat
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burninator
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ajwillys
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Roggenbier is 50% barley and roughly equal parts rye/wheat for the rest. If you go with all rye and wheat, make sure you have plenty of rice hulls!
BrotherBock
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I'm wanting to do this with an IPA.
shamfein
Well-Known Member
Whats the craic with the rice hulls, is this to aid the mash? i have used rye before and the grain is quite small so i think it can be hard to mash, hence why most brewers dont use it 100%,
Cheers AJWILLYS, Roganbier is kind of what i was going for with a twist, most roganbiers have quite a high percentage of barley malt. my thinking in the beer i want to brew is have a completely barley free beer.. i really like the spicyness of the rye and the creaminess of the wheat, i can imagine the marriage of the two grains would be tasty
Cheers AJWILLYS, Roganbier is kind of what i was going for with a twist, most roganbiers have quite a high percentage of barley malt. my thinking in the beer i want to brew is have a completely barley free beer.. i really like the spicyness of the rye and the creaminess of the wheat, i can imagine the marriage of the two grains would be tasty
I'm interested!
I, too, love rye! It's what got me into partial mashing. I think I used just under 20% rye and wasn't where I wanted. I'll be making another this coming month and I've upped it to ~30% (3 lbs in 5.5 gal) to see if it's what I'm after.
I, too, love rye! It's what got me into partial mashing. I think I used just under 20% rye and wasn't where I wanted. I'll be making another this coming month and I've upped it to ~30% (3 lbs in 5.5 gal) to see if it's what I'm after.
One of my wife's favorite beers came from this Brew Your Own article. His first recipe is a straight wheat beer. His second recipe uses a blend of wheat and rye.
http://byo.com/stories/issue/item/2007-american-wheat-style-profile
The recipe as written has about 45% 2-row as a base with a blend of 30% wheat malt and 25% Rye malt. I've played with malt percentages and yeast strains on this over the years. I like the taste rye imparts and usually swap the percentages and go a little heavier on the rye than the wheat. I especially like the higher % of rye malt if I am using a cleaner yeast (i.e., an American wheat vs. a German Hefe). With the more neutral yeast, the extra rye gives it a little more character.
One really tasty interpretation I made was hopped all the way through with Sorachi Ace. The lemony character of that hop played really well with the wheat and rye.
I can't say enough how important it is to use rice hulls if you're an AG brewer. With over 50% huskless malt in this beer, you're just asking for a stuck sparge.
With spring on the way, I am looking at dusting this recipe off again. I recently listened to an old Jamil podcast in which he talks about using Kolsch yeast as a key to making really crisp wheat beers. I am considering going back to this recipe as written and using a Kolsch yeast at 60-62% for a nice easy-drinking beer to serve when company drops in.
http://byo.com/stories/issue/item/2007-american-wheat-style-profile
The recipe as written has about 45% 2-row as a base with a blend of 30% wheat malt and 25% Rye malt. I've played with malt percentages and yeast strains on this over the years. I like the taste rye imparts and usually swap the percentages and go a little heavier on the rye than the wheat. I especially like the higher % of rye malt if I am using a cleaner yeast (i.e., an American wheat vs. a German Hefe). With the more neutral yeast, the extra rye gives it a little more character.
One really tasty interpretation I made was hopped all the way through with Sorachi Ace. The lemony character of that hop played really well with the wheat and rye.
I can't say enough how important it is to use rice hulls if you're an AG brewer. With over 50% huskless malt in this beer, you're just asking for a stuck sparge.
With spring on the way, I am looking at dusting this recipe off again. I recently listened to an old Jamil podcast in which he talks about using Kolsch yeast as a key to making really crisp wheat beers. I am considering going back to this recipe as written and using a Kolsch yeast at 60-62% for a nice easy-drinking beer to serve when company drops in.
shamfein
Well-Known Member
Hey all,
I have now my ingredients for the Roganbier, i am going with 3kg of Wheat malt and 3kg of Rye malt, will be making 25 litres in total after boiling.
I will be using Hallertau Mittelfruh hops, 25 grams for one hour and 25g for last 10 mins.
Im unsure about the yeast, i have 4 different yeasts i can use, US-04, US-05, WB-06 and a Brewferm Blanche. Im thinking the WB-06 will suit best but i thought id see what ye guys think.
Cheers
Ian
I have now my ingredients for the Roganbier, i am going with 3kg of Wheat malt and 3kg of Rye malt, will be making 25 litres in total after boiling.
I will be using Hallertau Mittelfruh hops, 25 grams for one hour and 25g for last 10 mins.
Im unsure about the yeast, i have 4 different yeasts i can use, US-04, US-05, WB-06 and a Brewferm Blanche. Im thinking the WB-06 will suit best but i thought id see what ye guys think.
Cheers
Ian
I have a recipe that uses 20% rye, add some rice hulls, no issues. Then I tried a bigger beer with 50%+ rye and it was slow runoff central, even with a proper amt of rice hulls (think 45min vs 2.5hrs).
I don't know exactly where it happens % wise on my system, but somewhere between 20-50% I need to be able to do lower temp rests to thin the proteins and beta glucans out for a better mash.
A lot of people were advocating for BIAB for something like this, but I need more toys than this well thought out simplicity involves. I'm building a RIMS tube pretty much so I can play with a ton of adjuncts (and stainless is shiny and lights are pretty).
I don't know exactly where it happens % wise on my system, but somewhere between 20-50% I need to be able to do lower temp rests to thin the proteins and beta glucans out for a better mash.
A lot of people were advocating for BIAB for something like this, but I need more toys than this well thought out simplicity involves. I'm building a RIMS tube pretty much so I can play with a ton of adjuncts (and stainless is shiny and lights are pretty).
BrotherBock
Well-Known Member
Assuming the blanche and wb 06 (haven't used them) are german wheat stlye yeasts then either of those will work. I did a Roggenbier with 60% rye and WLP 380. That yeast worked well.
I can't imagine a Roggen would be a roggen without the spicy phenols and esters associated with a german hefe yeast. US 04 and 05 would not be a good choice (stylistically speaking).
I can't imagine a Roggen would be a roggen without the spicy phenols and esters associated with a german hefe yeast. US 04 and 05 would not be a good choice (stylistically speaking).
If you were to use WB-06 would you opt for the clove or the banana flavor?
I tried that yeast strain with a honey wheat and fermented cooler than the range stated and the clove didn't play so nicely with the honey. I was hoping for more neutral and hoping if I got clove it wouldn't be too much. It was a strange beer.
I tried that yeast strain with a honey wheat and fermented cooler than the range stated and the clove didn't play so nicely with the honey. I was hoping for more neutral and hoping if I got clove it wouldn't be too much. It was a strange beer.
So there is a brewery up here in Limerick Maine called Gneiss Brewing and they do all German wheat beers obviously with an american twist on things. They have a roggenbier that is completely barley free and is acctually 70% rye and 30% wheat. I have had it and it is THICK to say the least, very viscus beer and not my favorite but here is a link to their page. The rest of their beer is gooooooood stuff though!
http://www.gneissbeer.com/the-beers/stryeation/
http://www.gneissbeer.com/the-beers/stryeation/
shamfein
Well-Known Member
Just an update on this beer, i ended up going for a small batch, 10 litres in total,
i did 500g pale wheat and 500g pale rye,
i did a BIAB so prevent any stuck sparge.
the beer is purposely very light 2.1% however the rye really makes up for the lack of body.
i used 10g magnum for 60 mins and 50g cascade for whirlpool.
i really enjoy this one, real thirst quencher
i did 500g pale wheat and 500g pale rye,
i did a BIAB so prevent any stuck sparge.
the beer is purposely very light 2.1% however the rye really makes up for the lack of body.
i used 10g magnum for 60 mins and 50g cascade for whirlpool.
i really enjoy this one, real thirst quencher
I haven't gone that far, but I brew a wheat/rye ale with the following grain bill and cascade hops at 10 & 0. It has a lot of rye character, body and balance. I think any more isn't really needed.
50% 2 Row
25% Wheat
25% Rye
Actually it's a beta glucan rest between 98 and 113°F that helps with the gumminess of rye, not a protein rest.
shamfein
Well-Known Member
The high viscosity issue is why i believe that 50% rye really suits itself to very low ABV beers, if i brought the ABV of my beer from 2% to 4% and kept my proportions the same. I think it would be too thick.. so at the 2% area it is still very drinkable without having any syrupy issues..
shamfein
Well-Known Member
Hey All,
I said I would put up the latest version of this idea I did,
2kg wheat malt
1kg Rye malt,
200g oat husks,
27 Litre batch in fermenter, came out at 2.6%
4g Simcoe @60
12g Sorachi Ace @ Flameout
12g Citra @ Flameout
12g El Dorado @ Flameout
Dry hopped with 20g Simcoe and the zest of 3 oranges.
Opened first bottle last night, pic attached, very orangey very light body, dry on the end with a decent amount of rye spiciness aftertaste.
I do like it, I think next ill do 1.5kg of both Wheat and Rye to make it 50% each. Or maybe add some rolled oats to bring the body up a little,
I said I would put up the latest version of this idea I did,
2kg wheat malt
1kg Rye malt,
200g oat husks,
27 Litre batch in fermenter, came out at 2.6%
4g Simcoe @60
12g Sorachi Ace @ Flameout
12g Citra @ Flameout
12g El Dorado @ Flameout
Dry hopped with 20g Simcoe and the zest of 3 oranges.
Opened first bottle last night, pic attached, very orangey very light body, dry on the end with a decent amount of rye spiciness aftertaste.
I do like it, I think next ill do 1.5kg of both Wheat and Rye to make it 50% each. Or maybe add some rolled oats to bring the body up a little,
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