how long can I wait to pitch yeast

So, I chilled my last batch using a plate chiller and a pump... got down only to 76 degrees. I think the problem was that my hose was lying on the hot ground in the sun... inside water is 65 degrees, don't know how hot the outside water was.

My question is this. I finished the process a about 3pm today. Can I safely wait 24 hours before pitching yeast so the temp gets down to about 68? Since I have a conical, this would also allow for significant trub removal befre adding the yeast-- maybe clearer beer?

Also, anyone use Danstar's Nottingham yeast before? I think I remember reading that some people just pitch it dry into the fermentor, but the instructions say to dissolved it first in warm water. What would people recommend?

Klaus

As long as you maintained proper sanitation procedures you can wait a long time to pitch. A number of people even do what's called no-chill brewing and let the liquid cool naturally without any assistance overnight or after a day or so. But the risk is simply if you didn't sanitize that well to begin with, the longer you wait, the better the chances of something bad taking hold before the yeast do.

And Nottingham is very popular. You can pitch it dry or rehydrate. People do it both ways. I usually rehydrate.

People who do no-chill seal the wort up immediately while it's hot IIRC. I think you want to pitch as soon as possible. If you can't get your fermenter in a water bath, maybe some ice packs?

Rehydrating your yeast in water before pitching gives it the best chance at health. I've done it both ways and my beer came out fine, but I always rehydrate now. I figure it's only one extra step and if it raises the odds of better beer, why not do it?

Oh, and next time you might see if you can increase the flow of water through your chiller, and/or lower your flow rate of wort to get better heat transfer.

ChshreCat said:

People who do no-chill seal the wort up immediately while it's hot IIRC.

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True. I think I do recall people talking about sealing it up right away and then rotating the vessel around so that the near boiling liquid touches all surfaces acting as a bit of a sanitizer before anything has a chance to get in there.

OK, thanks for the suggestions. I slapped on 3 cold packs. Have no idea how long it will take t get to 68, but we'll just have to see.

Klaus

nottingham yeast is a beast. pitch it anyway you want and it will do work.

I usually cool my worts as low as I can get in 30 minutes with an ice bath. That usually lands me in the 70's. However, I then put in primary and put in my fridge. Once my brew is 62-64 I pitch. I have waited up to 30 hours before pitching and it has turned out great. I wouldn't worry about it too much. In fact, assuming your process is good and sanatized....I think the effects of pitching too warm would be a bigger detriment to your beer then waiting a few hours to pitch.

Alright, just checked. 69 degrees after strapping 3 cold packs to the fermentor for a few hours. Just pitched at 69 degrees. Should still cool a bit overnight before fermentation begins. By morning it should be 65, I would think.

Klaus

I almost always cool only until about 75 degrees then pitch yeast..the fermenter then is placed in my temp controlled wine fridge and kept at a constant temp of 63-65.
As long as you're not in the upper 70's you can pitch the yeats, just don't let it stay much over 70 for too long.

Actually you don't need to rehydrate yeast. Just sprinkle it over your beer. Rehydration is only necessary for big breweries, because thay pitch like 1 kg of yeast per hl. If you throw that in without rehydrating first you get clumps. For homebrewers, there is enough water in the beer to hydrate your yeast. Actually, if you rehydrate, you increase the chance of infection.

I don't understand why it takes you guys so long to get the wort cooled down. now I'm just a newb here with 1 batch fermenting but mine cooled fast when I put the pot in the sink with ice water in there.

Is there anything about cooling it off too fast? I think my temp came down literally within minutes with the ice and all.

Centexbear said:

I don't understand why it takes you guys so long to get the wort cooled down. now I'm just a newb here with 1 batch fermenting but mine cooled fast when I put the pot in the sink with ice water in there.

Is there anything about cooling it off too fast? I think my temp came down literally within minutes with the ice and all.

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Cooling it fast is good and the faster the better. But how much liquid are you cooling where you can do it in "minutes?" When I did partial boil extract recipes I might have 2-3 gallons to cool and yes, a bunch of ice water in the sink could get it down to pitching temps in 15 minutes.

But once you start trying to cool 5+ gallons in just a water bath it just doesn't happen that fast unless you feel like burning through about $50 worth of ice. That's where immersion and counterflow chillers come in as they can make quick work of cooling down larger volumes. Even then, if you don't have cold enough source water it can still make cooling take quite a while.

Thanks Marubozo. I was about to get a little worried. Beer has been in primary now for 6 days. Going to transfer to 2ndary after 2 weeks, then go 1 week in 2ndary before bottling.

You are right, I had just like 2-3 gallons which cooled down rapidly. I bought 2-3 bags of ice and used 1-2 bags in an icy sink water. It worked great but I can see how with 5 gallons it would be more of a challenge.

When it comes to pitching ale yeast anything 75 and below is fine. I'm not sure why you absolutely wanted to wait until 68. You can't be making a lager, so this whole pitching temperature thing isn't as relevant. It just needs to be cool enough to not kill the yeast.

I cool my wort down to 80 with my immersion chiller. By the time it is all in the fermenter, it's about 75. I pitch the yeast, throw it in the chest freezer, and everything comes out fine.

mojotele said:

When it comes to pitching ale yeast anything 75 and below is fine. I'm not sure why you absolutely wanted to wait until 68. You can't be making a lager, so this whole pitching temperature thing isn't as relevant. It just needs to be cool enough to not kill the yeast.

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Well, the reason that i wanted to cool it to 68 is that I have read so many forum posts about fusel alcohols being produced at higher temps, and off flavors at higher temps. Given that this is a very light beer (3.9 SRM), i wanted the flavor to be as clean as possible. The last batch I had took off fermenting within about 3 hours, and I didn't want the bulk of fermentation to occur above 70 degrees.

I should also mention that I screwed the recipe up a bit (I had DME in my head as being 1.037 Sg per pound per gallon, but in fact it is 1.044), and ended up with an SG of 1.051 instead of 1.040. I also put 7.1 gallons into my 7.3 gallon conical. It has taken off like crazy, bubbling about 1.5 times per second, but due to the addition of fermcap-s, I have not had any blowout at all yet!

I started this brew in kind of a hurry because we were supposed to get 4-5 days of weather in the mid 60s in a row, so I wouldn't have to worry about controlling fermentation temps (since I can't). Basement is 64 degrees, beer is now holding steady at 66. Perhaps I shouldn't have rished and should have thought it through a bit. Was supposed to be a clone of Biermuncher's Centennial Blonde, but instead of an even 4% alcohol, it is going to be about 5%. I hope the fermcap DOES increase bitterness by 10% like it says it might... otherwise this will be balanced much more towards the malty side rather than slightly to the hoppy side.

Klaus

The disclaimer that fermcap can increase bitterness is because instead of having blowoff carry away some of the krausen and up to 10% of the bitterness, it is all (or mostly) retained in the fermentor. I believe this is more relevant when used in commercial breweries.

You want to get it as low as you can before pitching is because if the yeast takes off quick, it can build up heat faster than you can cool it down. You don't always get a long lag time, especially if you aerate properly. Pitch in the high 70's, have the yeast take off quick and your beer can be fermenting in the 80's before you know it.

ChshreCat said:

You want to get it as low as you can before pitching is because if the yeast takes off quick, it can build up heat faster than you can cool it down. You don't always get a long lag time, especially if you aerate properly. Pitch in the high 70's, have the yeast take off quick and your beer can be fermenting in the 80's before you know it.

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I guess I've just never had that problem, but I have been using a chest freezer to control my fermentation temperatures for quite some time now. It can get the beer down to the sixties rather quickly.

So you do have a good point. I guess I take my chest freezer for granted

[reviving an old thread to post my tale of woe that I hope will be helpful to others]

Hey - sometimes, as we all know, life gets in the way, and other times, bad habits tend to perpetuate. And sometimes both happen....

I've gotten in the bad habit of not preparing a starter in the several days before a brew session. So the starters aren't ready until several days afterwards what with spinning and chilling and decanting...

Weekend before last I brewed but didn't have the yeast ready. I thought I would harvest fresh slurry from another batch that was fermenting, but it hadn't precipitated yet. Bad planning: no plan B.

So off I went to the LHBS to get a fresh packet of yeast the day after brewday, leaving the fresh wort in the fermenter at 67. Came home, made a starter and spun it over the next 24 hours, then put it in the kegerator to cold crash. Looked at it the next morning but it a lot of yeast was still suspended. I woulda pitched the whole damn thing but it was 4.5L.

I had to leave immediately for the airport for a business trip to the West Coast. Returning four days later, I decanted and warmed the starter and opened up the SS fermenter. It was fermenting already :x

It looked like a very weak yeast fermentation, not bacterial (sorry I was too pissed to take photos) and the SG was down about 10 points. The hydrometer sample tasted sharply sour up front and vaguely sweet on the back.

I figure the batch is screwed, but there's almost nothing lost to pitch and hope for the best so that's what I did. Maybe the Denny's Fav50 will overpower whatever else is in there.

Anyway - moral of story: don't do that. Pitch as soon as your wort is at proper temperature. I know I will from now on.