There is an 8 gallon food-grade plastic bucket at my LHBS that they sell as a primary fermenter. If I'm doing 5 gallon batches will that much head room have any negative effects? I plan on using this as my only fermenter for the first batch or two until I get enough money to expand and get a 5 gallon glass carboy as a secondary. Thanks!
Size of Primary Fermenter
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Clonefarmer
Well-Known Member
There should be no negative effects. The extra head space will allow for the krausen to expand.
Also, remember you may have more than 5 gallons to allow for losses do to transfers and such, so if you have 5.5 gallons and ferment in a ale pale 7.9 gallons you should have no worries about it blowing up.
Justibone
Well-Known Member
Room in a primary is a good thing, because you want the yeast to have enough oxygen. Oxygen = reproduction, and you want a big colony of yeast to be able to convert a large quantity of sugars relatively quickly.
Again: primary --> oxygen = good
In your secondary, however, oxygen is bad. It contributes to cardboardy flavor, I guess, which is why you want to minimize splashing and whatnot when either racking to that gorgeous 6 gal. carboy/BB, or even if you are going straight to bottles.
Again: secondary --> oxygen = bad
If you have too much headspace in your secondary (or in your bottle, esp. true for wine) it can cause off-flavors potentially, and it can hurt the aging of the beverage. If you want to rack a batch into a too-big container, find some way to displace the extra room air (which contains 20% oxygen) either with more volume (a previous batch of homebrew), solid objects that won't affect the volume or carry in microbes (boiled marbles have been suggested), or another gas which is heavier than oxygen (nitrogen is too light) and won't leave a flavor (sulfur dioxide? I dunno, but I am not planning on trying it).
My wine brewing buddy and me have been discussing a system to allow dry ice to sublimate (transform from solid to gas, without a liquid in between) in order to displace the room air in a secondary. We haven't ironed out all the kinks yet, but I'm thinking I might give it a try next half-batch I put in my carboy for a secondary.
Obligatory DON'T DO IT OR DIE warning: *enclosing* dry ice inside a container can cause explosions, damage, maiming and/or death, so it is not recommended for people I give a damn about, i.e., other homebrewers. :cross:
Dry ice releases carbon dioxide, a poisonous gas, so it should only be done in a well-ventilated area, unless you are someone I despise, in which case go ahead and play with it all you like, you sorry sap.
Again: primary --> oxygen = good
In your secondary, however, oxygen is bad. It contributes to cardboardy flavor, I guess, which is why you want to minimize splashing and whatnot when either racking to that gorgeous 6 gal. carboy/BB, or even if you are going straight to bottles.
Again: secondary --> oxygen = bad
If you have too much headspace in your secondary (or in your bottle, esp. true for wine) it can cause off-flavors potentially, and it can hurt the aging of the beverage. If you want to rack a batch into a too-big container, find some way to displace the extra room air (which contains 20% oxygen) either with more volume (a previous batch of homebrew), solid objects that won't affect the volume or carry in microbes (boiled marbles have been suggested), or another gas which is heavier than oxygen (nitrogen is too light) and won't leave a flavor (sulfur dioxide? I dunno, but I am not planning on trying it).
My wine brewing buddy and me have been discussing a system to allow dry ice to sublimate (transform from solid to gas, without a liquid in between) in order to displace the room air in a secondary. We haven't ironed out all the kinks yet, but I'm thinking I might give it a try next half-batch I put in my carboy for a secondary.
Obligatory DON'T DO IT OR DIE warning: *enclosing* dry ice inside a container can cause explosions, damage, maiming and/or death, so it is not recommended for people I give a damn about, i.e., other homebrewers. :cross:
Dry ice releases carbon dioxide, a poisonous gas, so it should only be done in a well-ventilated area, unless you are someone I despise, in which case go ahead and play with it all you like, you sorry sap.
KevinW
Well-Known Member
Bigger may not be better but in the long run you could have more beer to drink, and that is better!
Headspace should not be a problem when primary fermenting due to the CO2 keeping a protective layer above the beer!
Keep on brewing!
Headspace should not be a problem when primary fermenting due to the CO2 keeping a protective layer above the beer!
Keep on brewing!
Thanks for the info! Good luck on your new setup.
Bigger may not be better but in the long run you could have more beer to drink, and that is better!
Headspace should not be a problem when primary fermenting due to the CO2 keeping a protective layer above the beer!
Keep on brewing!
Yes, that is definitely better than no beer at all! If I get the plastic bucket, can I still use the stick-on Fermometers on it or do those only work on glass carboys?
Arkador
Well-Known Member
+1 go for the 7+gal bucket for primary. I use em and love em. Never had the krauzen reach my blowoff tube in one.
for secondary, get a fermenter as close to the volume needed, I have 3 secondary vessels, so i can pick the most apropriate one
for secondary, get a fermenter as close to the volume needed, I have 3 secondary vessels, so i can pick the most apropriate one
Arkador
Well-Known Member
Yes, people use primary for 4weeks and just go streight to bottling all the time.
there will be a layer of CO2 protecting your beer, so you don't need to worry about conditioning in that large fermenter.
KevinW
Well-Known Member
I say use 'em!
"Fermometers" really only give an estimate of the internal temp ! (I have one on my plastic primary) The stick on thermometers do not give an accurate measurement of the liquid inside as the thermal mass can take days to adjust to the ambient air temp so they are a good "guess" for the temp, maybe only a couple of degrees off!
Remember, fermentation can increase the temperature fairly quickly so during active fermentation the reading on the fermometer will not be very accurate at all. I have read where the difference can vary by as much as 10 degrees so during active fermentation it is a good idea to keep the beer in a place that is 10-15 degrees below the fermentation temp you need.
"Fermometers" really only give an estimate of the internal temp ! (I have one on my plastic primary) The stick on thermometers do not give an accurate measurement of the liquid inside as the thermal mass can take days to adjust to the ambient air temp so they are a good "guess" for the temp, maybe only a couple of degrees off!
Remember, fermentation can increase the temperature fairly quickly so during active fermentation the reading on the fermometer will not be very accurate at all. I have read where the difference can vary by as much as 10 degrees so during active fermentation it is a good idea to keep the beer in a place that is 10-15 degrees below the fermentation temp you need.
Hm, I'll try KevinW, but I'm in an apartment that's usually 65-70 degrees F, so I'm not sure how plausible it is for me to find a space that's cooler. I have a deck but that's way too variable to trust my precious beer to.
Justibone
Well-Known Member
Some people worry about autolysis from leaving the brew on the yeast for too long... but only 4 weeks is definitely not too long (think more like 6 mo's). Yes, it's a good thing to leave beer to be beer for a while, in almost any container. The CO2 created from the primary fermentation is an excellent oxygen buffer (because it's heavier than oxygen, so it makes a nice "gas blanket") and your beer should ferment and age fantastically in your primary for quite a while.
In fact, when in doubt, I'd say leave your beer in your primary for a little longer. It's the safest way.
In fact, when in doubt, I'd say leave your beer in your primary for a little longer. It's the safest way.
Justibone
Well-Known Member
KevinW
Well-Known Member
Warm temps? Brew ales!
Ales are a good option. I have about the same temps(65-70) in my "fermentarium" and my beers have been finishing about 66°.
I would like to lager but do not have the space or money for a dedicated fridge yet.
Instead of lagering I have been using Kolsch yeast. I just put my first "true to style" kolsch in secondary Sunday and mmmm did it taste good! Sort of a pseudo-lager!
