Electric HLT questions

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nostalgia

nostalgia

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For those of you who use a separate HLT in your systems, got some questions. I'll try to keep it from getting tl so you don't ;dr it ;)

Currently, I have one kettle, one burner. So I heat my strike water in the kettle and pump it to my MLT. I then heat my sparge water, pump it to a cooler, and drain into the kettle. Then I pump from the cooler to the MLT to sparge.

Well, new house is coming and there will be a more permanent brewing structure going in. I'm planning electric so I can do it indoors without worrying about asphyxiating myself.

What I thought would be nice is to have a dedicated HLT with a heating element so I'll always have water at the ready. Especially after doing a protein rest/infusion mash with my current setup. De-ba-cle.

So the questions. I'm guessing for accurate temp control I'll need to circulate the water. What would you use? A little recirculating pump? A paddle and motor to stir?

Since this will be an insulated vessel used for mash and sparge water, will a 2000watt element be big enough?

I wonder if an electric hot water heater would fit the bill with some modifications?

Anyone done this already and can share some experience?

Also, I'm batch sparging, but may change over to fly sparging in the future. If it makes any difference.

Thanks!

-Joe
 
nostalgia said:
For those of you who use a separate HLT in your systems, got some questions. I'll try to keep it from getting tl so you don't ;dr it ;)

Currently, I have one kettle, one burner. So I heat my strike water in the kettle and pump it to my MLT. I then heat my sparge water, pump it to a cooler, and drain into the kettle. Then I pump from the cooler to the MLT to sparge.

Well, new house is coming and there will be a more permanent brewing structure going in. I'm planning electric so I can do it indoors without worrying about asphyxiating myself.

What I thought would be nice is to have a dedicated HLT with a heating element so I'll always have water at the ready. Especially after doing a protein rest/infusion mash with my current setup. De-ba-cle.

So the questions. I'm guessing for accurate temp control I'll need to circulate the water. What would you use? A little recirculating pump? A paddle and motor to stir?

Since this will be an insulated vessel used for mash and sparge water, will a 2000watt element be big enough?

I wonder if an electric hot water heater would fit the bill with some modifications?

Anyone done this already and can share some experience?

Also, I'm batch sparging, but may change over to fly sparging in the future. If it makes any difference.

Thanks!

-Joe
Click to expand...

I have already built and sold one...

SO, 2000W is enough

I used an AC gear motor and stir paddle to mix it, though I prefer the March Pump idea, because it can be used for more things...

Modified water heater element will be excellent.
 
I'm slowly building my all electric system. It will have an HLT with a pump to circulate water to even up the temp. I am going this way because I think the using a stirrer motor is too much complexity. For stirring, I will add a second coupling part way up the keggle and install an elbow and short curved copper pipe to whirlpool up the water.

I will then gravity feed the hot water to a cooler MLT, and pump the wort from the MLT to the kettle, since this will all be set on the counter top in my laundry room brewery. If I ever get this done, I'll post some pics, but it has taken way longer than I expected or wanted due to competing house and honey dew projects.

So in the end, my advice is theoretical at present.
 
You will probably need an SSR and Temp control combo to maintain temps at 17A
 
I used a 1500 watt but havent tried it yet due to needing a few washers to get the bulkhead tighter. 1 nipple was too short and this one is just a tad long! With the 1500w you dont need a relay. and can run on standard outlet although you should be using a GFI.
 
The 10 gallon HLT I'm working on will have two 2000 watt 120V elements built into the lid, attached to curved plumbing fixtures.

I did the math, and 2000 watts will simply take too long to heat my water.

No patience...

ETA: I'm also considering using the HLT as a "water heater" for my garden hose fed double sink. Be nice to have hot water outside for washing up.
 
I am building Pol's 1500Watt HLT currently and using the stir motor. I don't see it being difficult at all. I got my stirrer parts yesterday. I now just need a thermowell to my ranco probe and a plastic washer for reinforcing the cooler bottom for the element. I do the occasional 10G batch and wonder how long it would take , if at all, to heat that much water. I'd probably just heat full volume on my burner for 10G's and then maintain in the cooler. Or build a heat stick in the future for the occasional 10G batches.
 
I had 1500W in my last one, it worked well and I dont regret it.

That being said I went with 9000W for water heating and for boiling this time around.
 
Bobby_M said:
If you have the service amperage to support it, I see no reason not to go 5000 watts in the HLT.
Click to expand...

I have 5000W in my HLT and it is awesome (high density element).

I can heat 9 Gal of 65F water to 160F in 20 mins. Just enough time to mill my grain. Plus, when I do 10gal batches, it allows me to get my sparging water up to temp quickly so my HERMS recirculation temp will be on target (10 gal batch mash basically empties my HLT so I have to heat another 8 gallons or so)
 
brrman said:
still running that out of your garage???
Click to expand...

Yes sir...

2000W is plenty for a simple HLT

9000W is overkill

I will actually have (2) 9000W heaters, but I have to halve them to run them concurrently ;)
 
Finally tested out my HLT with the 1500w element to see if there were any leaks and to see how fast she worked. I have a tiny little driplet from were the thermo meets the compression on the thermothingy. I filled it up (38 quart) and turned her on. 1 hour to get from 55* -165*. That works for me just fine as Ill never need no where near that much. Thanks again Pol and others who helped me on this!
 
Even with 100% heat retention, that temp. rise will have to take at least 1:42 minutes to complete, it is a mathematical certainty. 55f to 120F would take 60 minutes alone
Glad the build is working properly... those thermothingys never seem to seal quite right.
 
IrregularPulse said:
55-165 is an hour and 45 minutes with a 1500W Element!? What about 55-180?
With a 2kW Element?
Click to expand...

Yes, you are looking at 1:45 to go from 55-165 in 9.5 gallons with 1500W, it is a mathematical certainty.

If you are doing 55-180 in 9.5 gallons with 2000W you are certainly going to use all of 1:32 to get there.

With 9000W this will take 20 minutes

This is simply based on converting watts, to BTUs and then working the math since 1 BTU is used to raise 1g of water 1F in one hour. Or you can use a spreadsheet like I do!

This is why I would fill my HLT and start it when I went to bed... then when I awoke, it was ready to go whenever I was.
 
The Pol said:
Yes, you are looking at 1:45 to go from 55-165 in 9.5 gallons with 1500W, it is a mathematical certainty.

If you are doing 55-180 in 9.5 gallons with 2000W you are certainly going to use all of 1:32 to get there.

With 9000W this will take 20 minutes

This is simply based on converting watts, to BTUs and then working the math since 1 BTU is used to raise 1g of water 1F in one hour. Or you can use a spreadsheet like I do!

This is why I would fill my HLT and start it when I went to bed... then when I awoke, it was ready to go whenever I was.
Click to expand...
Thanks. It's not a big deal to me that it will take this long. I'll be using a 1500W Element. I could heat my strike water then heat my sparge water afterwards, but I'd rather heat the whole volume at once. I planned on putting my hlt on a timer for brew day to start heating when I planned on waking up, Now I'll just do it to start heating an hour before so it'll still be ready. I can't wait to wake up and go straight to mashing. It's going to cut down so much time for the actual brew day:) Maybe I should put my rig bedside so I can roll out of bed, mash in, go back to sleep for an hour, then wake up and carry my wort out to the garage for the boil :D

Oh man, If I was only a bachelor! I would certainly do this!.
 
The Pol said:
This is simply based on converting watts, to BTUs and then working the math since 1 BTU is used to raise 1g of water 1F in one hour. Or you can use a spreadsheet like I do!
Click to expand...
Being an engineer, I had to also make a spreadsheet ;) From my reading, 1 BTU is what it takes to raise 1 pound of water 1F, not 1 gallon. Although I'm guessing your spreadsheet has the units correct and this was just a typo, since your values are very close to mine.

For 55-165F, 9.5 gallons, I come up with:

1500w: 116 minutes
2000w: 87 minutes
9000w: 19 minutes

Google docs linkydoo

Feel free to play around in it, but please don't mess with the formulas. Just enter stuff in the boxed, bold cells. I haven't figured out how to lock individual cells from editing.

-Joe
 
nostalgia said:
Being an engineer, I had to also make a spreadsheet ;) From my reading, 1 BTU is what it takes to raise 1 pound of water 1F, not 1 gallon. Although I'm guessing your spreadsheet has the units correct and this was just a typo, since your values are very close to mine.

For 55-165F, 9.5 gallons, I come up with:

1500w: 116 minutes
2000w: 87 minutes
9000w: 19 minutes

Google docs linkydoo

Feel free to play around in it, but please don't mess with the formulas. Just enter stuff in the boxed, bold cells. I haven't figured out how to lock individual cells from editing.

-Joe
Click to expand...

I mean gram... not gallon, but couldnt remember the measurement.
 
It is a Igloo Wheelie an it says 38 quart/36 liter, maybe tat is dry instead of liquid and it isnt accurate. It wasnt filled accurately using a gallon jug or anything, just filled pretty close to the top and the Ranco and the thermo both said 165 when i stirred it and it was more like 1 hour and 5 minutes but thats my story from there. Maybe the laws of physics cease to exist on my kitchen counter?
 
Well, in 68 minutes you can get from 55 to 165 with 6 gallons, or 24 quarts... that is physically possible.
 
Must be it then. I just (ass)umed that what was written on there was close. Thats pretty damn far off from what it says though!
 
IrregularPulse said:
Thanks. It's not a big deal to me that it will take this long. I'll be using a 1500W Element.

Oh man, If I was only a bachelor! I would certainly do this!.
Click to expand...


I'm in the midst of building a heat stick, and it looks like I'm 'limited' to a 1500W element (seems as though 15 amps is the max for straight blade plugs?).

Which brand of element did you buy? And are you happy with it?
 
I just bought the 1 at Home Depot and was pretty happy with the quickness for heating up the amount of water that was in my cooler.
 
ChadLeBald said:
I'm in the midst of building a heat stick, and it looks like I'm 'limited' to a 1500W element (seems as though 15 amps is the max for straight blade plugs?).

Which brand of element did you buy? And are you happy with it?
Click to expand...
I just bought whatever brand Lowes sells. I haven't gotten to use it yet.
 
Drilling my Blichmans today...

If you can find the elements that seem to me "chrome" plated, I have heard that they do not corrode like the others do and they are very easy to clean.

I use CAMCO products exclusively, I have liked them.
 
brrman said:
I have 5000W in my HLT and it is awesome (high density element).

I can heat 9 Gal of 65F water to 160F in 20 mins. Just enough time to mill my grain. Plus, when I do 10gal batches, it allows me to get my sparging water up to temp quickly so my HERMS recirculation temp will be on target (10 gal batch mash basically empties my HLT so I have to heat another 8 gallons or so)
Click to expand...

Do you use an electric element for your brew kettle?

I want to use 5000w element for my HLT and for a brew keggle. I am trying to determine if I need to set up two control panels (like The Pols) or is there a way to use one panel to cover both jobs. Due to my electrical limitations, I will have to run the HLT or the brew keggle, and trying to determine the most effective / efficient method.
 
I am using one panel to do both for the hlt it with have temp control and the BK will be ran on man so you can use one contoler and just plug in one at a time. I will have two RTDs just so I have temp for cooling. Hope to test mine this weekend
 

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