Help me design a rig. (Automation included)

I've been planning my electric rig for over a year now. I'm about to start designing Rev 3 and have yet to build anything. I was pretty much decided on the folllowing.
-Keg HLT with manual ball valve, sight glass, and 3500W element with PID control and 110V stir motor as per Pol's cooler system build (now owned by Yoop)
-Cooler Mash tun with manual ball valve
-Keg BK with manual ball valve, sight glass, and 5500W element with PID control
1 pump.

I have:
2 kegs with ball valve, sight glass, and element ports already welded in.
Stir motor with coupler and stir paddle
1x Auber PID with Type K Thermocouple and SSR w/ heatsink
1x 1500W element currently in HLT
1 March 809
BK currently being used with propane still.

Reason for change:
A buddy of mine came over last night to let me know he just ripped out a few production lines at work and has an assortment of PLC's (I/O cards and processors), Touch screen panels of various sizes, manual push buttons and switches galore.

I'm thinking of just keeping the two kegs, plugging on element port from the inside (already have a plug) and using it as a MT and doing a RIMS. Does a RIMS require 2 pumps?
If I did this, I'd still need to the elements, and build a rims tube, plus I'd want a jaybird False bottom.
Then I'd use the touchscreen to control the pump and elements and should be able to run temp control through PLC logic. (Already have RS Logix for the AB PLCs on my work computer and know how to use it). This would be the area we'd (Me and my buddy that' be helping me) need to research. Should be a fairly simple process.

So if you guys had access to this stuff for free/cheap price, what would you build?

What I want from a system:
Compact (2 vessel would be great)
All Electric via 240V 50A ckt
Recirculating through my CFC for chilling.
Data logging for records.

Fire away the suggestions and comments.

Something else I'm trying to figure out. Brewing with only 2 vessels. Open to HERMS or RIMS. Can someone explain the process? I thought I knew, until I started typing out a process.

Do a search on Brutus 20. JKarp has a great thread on how it works for his system. The system in my signature is also a 2 vessel system using the BK as a pseudo-RIMS circuit. For a HERMS, you would simply recirculate through a coil in the BK if you only had 2 vessels. The Pol has a thread with a system like that.

If you read through those three it should become a little more clear.

Thanks for the tips jfkriege - I'm now leaning this direction with 2 kegs 2 pumps and a single 5500W element. I would just need to purchase a false bottom a different element and another pump. Won't have need for the touch screen panel per say, but a simple compact design with precise control and no heavy lifting is my ultimate goal, not bells and whistles.

If your interested I have a 2 vessel automated system with Opto 22 PLC hardware and touch screen running a Java app for control. You build recipe on the touch screen, place malt in the hopper, hang the hop bags on the hooks,connect fermenter, press autorun icon on the screen and walk away.

kladue said:

If your interested I have a 2 vessel automated system with Opto 22 PLC hardware and touch screen running a Java app for control. You build recipe on the touch screen, place malt in the hopper, hang the hop bags on the hooks,connect fermenter, press autorun icon on the screen and walk away.

Click to expand...

I would be interested in seeing this, but couldn't afford it I'm sure. Plus I like some input on brew day.

kladue said:

If your interested I have a 2 vessel automated system with Opto 22 PLC hardware and touch screen running a Java app for control. You build recipe on the touch screen, place malt in the hopper, hang the hop bags on the hooks,connect fermenter, press autorun icon on the screen and walk away.

Click to expand...

IrregularPulse said:

I would be interested in seeing this, but couldn't afford it I'm sure. Plus I like some input on brew day.

Click to expand...

Yeah, where is the fun in that? Spilling wort, cussing, forgetting to turn off valves, more cussing, forgetting a hop addition and adding it in at flame out. Such are the things the truly hand-crafted beers are made of. I'm with IP, there has to be some hands-on or it ain't truly a craft.

Reelale said:

Yeah, where is the fun in that? Spilling wort, cussing, forgetting to turn off valves, more cussing, forgetting a hop addition and adding it in at flame out. Such are the things the truly hand-crafted beers are made of. I'm with IP, there has to be some hands-on or it ain't truly a craft.

Click to expand...

Besides, he'd have to re-design his bar to fit it in. I mean, how else could he Auto-Opto-meter pint pulls, monitor keezer temps, AND call up all his Kanye West videos all from one screen.

GilaMinumBeer said:

Besides, he'd have to re-design his bar to fit it in. I mean, how else could he Auto-Opto-meter pint pulls, monitor keezer temps, AND call up all his Kanye West videos all from one screen.

Click to expand...

There's an app. for that!

Reelale said:

There's an app. for that!

Click to expand...

Yes. And it's called PLC.

Well if you want to rough it there is still the portable steam RIMS collecting dust in the garage, it breaks down into about 6 parts for storage or transport. It is hard to beat a rig where you can heat strike & sparge water on a continuous basis with a 45-60 second lag to hit temp from cold start, and reach 35 degree temperature rise in the circulating wort by injecting steam into circulating wort quietly. The new system design and parts purchasing was a boredom relieving exercise I started on while on the road working in Arizona back in 2004-5. Now the frustrating part is I only get about 8 hours a month for live testing when I am home, the rest of the time I spend working on the system design refinements and control application code during evenings and weekends. The current design has mash and boil kettles with flash boiler for water and steam, all combustion is vented for indoor use, and boil kettle has vapor hood and exhauster for water vapor control. This was built to give me more time to deal with all the other brewing activities like racking fermenters, bottling, kegging, and cleaning without having to spend time watching the process, after brewing for 15 years the thrill of waiting on mash conversion and boiling has lost it's appeal.

kladue said:

Well if you want to rough it there is still the portable steam RIMS collecting dust in the garage, it breaks down into about 6 parts for storage or transport. It is hard to beat a rig where you can heat strike & sparge water on a continuous basis with a 45-60 second lag to hit temp from cold start, and reach 35 degree temperature rise in the circulating wort by injecting steam into circulating wort quietly. The new system design and parts purchasing was a boredom relieving exercise I started on while on the road working in Arizona back in 2004-5. Now the frustrating part is I only get about 8 hours a month for live testing when I am home, the rest of the time I spend working on the system design refinements and control application code during evenings and weekends. The current design has mash and boil kettles with flash boiler for water and steam, all combustion is vented for indoor use, and boil kettle has vapor hood and exhauster for water vapor control. This was built to give me more time to deal with all the other brewing activities like racking fermenters, bottling, kegging, and cleaning without having to spend time watching the process, after brewing for 15 years the thrill of waiting on mash conversion and boiling has lost it's appeal.

Click to expand...

Different strokes for different folks. Brew on brother.

I guess to get back to the original post requirements for an automated system design we should start with the types of AB I/O hardware you have so sensor types and control methods can be identified. Next up is what are the capabilities and limitations of the AB software, does this need to be a custom application or will the AB software handle the job.

I think you should just get a BCS-460 and scrap the PLC stuff. It'll be hard/expensive to design something comparable, let alone internet capable, in such a small package....unless you are an arduino whiz. It automates the process quite a bit, while still keeping things somewhat hands on. I think for the price, it's a good deal if you're talking about automating several parts of your process.