I completely underestimated role of oxygen

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True...

I traded in an OLD 40 cubic O2 tank (about 5 years past the stamp) and got two (new) 20 cubic O2 tanks for less than the cost of one. I even got a decent rate on the O2. Basically, for just over $100, I walked away with two full 20 cubic foot O2 tanks, and the extra brass fittings I needed to connect the 3/16" tubing to the regulators. I tried the 'industry' plastic fittings, but I cracked it when I put the worm clamp on it. The brass fittings have Oetiker clamps on them, and they're going no place. I prefer to use the Oetiker clamps since they grab a full 360 degrees around the tubing, unlike worm clamps. Plus, there's no sharp edges to get sliced on. I'm working my way through everything that has worm clamps and replacing them with Oetiker clamps. Even the 1/2" ID silicone tubing...
 
Bones1948 said:
2micron vs .5 micron is irrelevant because the back pressure created by large vs small micron diffusers is irrelevant.
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Are you saying that the size of the holes in the stone is irrelevant? It seems to me that the diameter of the bubbles produced by the stone is very relevant, but I have no idea if we're talking about different things.

If you're saying that a stone that would produce one large bubble of O2 - think a kid's bubble-blowing machine - would do just as well as a .5 micron stone, because the back pressure created by the former would be next to nothing compared to the latter, I don't get it.
 
Or did you mean that a flow meter isn't very reliable because the pressure on the stone will vary, and so a reading of O2 flow at the flow meter doesn't give you a true picture of what's going through the stone?

I'm confused.
 
Golddiggie said:
You won't be able to get them to use a CO2 tank for O2. Different threads on the valves, not to mention regulations.

That regulator isn't the one I have. Mine goes to 8Lpm, which is better for brewing. You want more control at the low end (which the 8Lpm version offers).

This is a good option, if you don't want to get the one from ebay...
Oxygen Regulator, 0-4 LPM, CGA540, DISS OUTLET, with colored gauge protector

Or this one: H/M Oxygen Regulator with Diss Outlet Volume Capacity: 0-8 Liters
Click to expand...

If you are very satisfied with the first regulator you showed me and the seller then that is what I will go with. I have always had good success with equipment advice from members on the forum.

Do you think the 0-8 lpm or the 0-4 lpm would be the best at controlling the O2 flow versus capacity flow?
 
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The 0-8Lpm regulator on Amazon looks identical to the one I have. I did have a good transaction with the seller on ebay, and would purchase from him again if I needed something he sold.

I believe either the 0-8 or 0-4 will do a great job. The 0-8 would give you a higher top end, but the 0-4 might give you more granular control across the range. Although I think once you pass 3Lpm, you won't be looking for .5Lpm increments.

Looks at the one on ebay again, I see it does go to 15Lpm (my bad)... Still, the range up to 2Lpm is where you'll spend most of your time (IMO/IME). I've yet to go above 2Lpm on either of the ones I have. I do like the one like those I'm posting links to more than the one with the float. Especially since the float reading is influenced by more than one element. Such as how you're positioned to read it, and if it's not 100% vertical.

The 0-8Lpm has the same graduations as mine... 0, .5, 1, 1.5, 2, 2.5, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8... IF you want finer control than that, then the 0-4 could be a better match. Well, until you have a really BIG brew and you want to hit it with more than 4Lpm... :D

As for the stone size... I've read enough complaints about the .5 micron stone to know it's probably NOT a good choice. I've seen enough people posting about getting it, only to switch to the 2 micron stone. Since you're measuring the O2 leaving the regulator in flow, not PSI, I don't see you getting any more, or less, from either stone. It just might take longer to get it to diffuse out of the stone in the .5 micron unit.

I've also seen how in unfermented wort, people use the 2 micron to oxygenate. They sometimes use the .5 micron stone to carbonate. For oxygenation, the bubble size difference has little (if any) impact. You're still getting better infusion than via the shake method. :rockin:
 
Golddiggie said:
Looks at the one on ebay again, I see it does go to 15Lpm (my bad)... Still, the range up to 2Lpm is where you'll spend most of your time (IMO/IME). I've yet to go above 2Lpm on either of the ones I have. I do like the one like those I'm posting links to more than the one with the float. Especially since the float reading is influenced by more than one element. Such as how you're positioned to read it, and if it's not 100% vertical.

:
Click to expand...

I am a little confused about which of these had the "float". The first link (via ebay) you sent me does or does not have the float? How about the 0-4 Lpm option (via amazon), will it have a float?

Also, I really appreciate the detail you have in answering my questions. I think you make a very good point about the hole size for adding O2 versus CO2.
 
msa8967 said:
What do you think of this one? It appears to be the same as the one on ebay you purchased but I was wrong before.

Amazon.com: H/M Oxygen Regulator 0-8 Liters: Health & Personal Care
Click to expand...

Looks good to me... I would just check to make sure it has a threaded fitting for the O2 out. With the picture as it is, you cannot tell what the fitting is for the O2 out part. Even though a barb fitting on the regulator would work too, I like using threaded fittings for my lines/tubing whenever possible.

Still, it's hard to go wrong at that price. Just wish it was available with Amazon Prime. :D
 
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So soaked my wand in soapy water all day and I'm still not getting a good flow out of the wand. Would soaking in pbw or oxy-clean be a better idea?
 
I usually just run O2 through it while having it in a bucket of StarSan solution. I do that after every use, to clean, and sanitize, it for the next use. So far, it's done really well for me.

If your wand is really gunked up, then you could give it an overnight soak in some PBW solution. Maybe 1-1.5oz in a gallon of hot water to start. Run some air/O2 through the stone the following evening and see where it's at.
 
My dad passed away awhile back and we stored a lot of his stuff and forgot about it. After reading this thread, I took a look to see, and found two of these:
airtank.jpg


Both are full 20 pound pure O2 tanks with lpm regulators. Of course I don't like how I came to be in possession of them, but I'm excited to try them in my wort. Going to order an aerator stone tonight.
 
You won't be able to get those tanks refilled without a Rx, but use them while they have O2 in them. Once empty, I would try trading them in for a tank you CAN get filled/exchanged.

You should have many batches worth of O2 between those two tanks. I say that's a good score.
 
Soaking in StarSan could help out too, it should be acidic enough to get any beer stone off. I'd do a hot PBW/cold acid combo and see how that does.
 
Rundownhouse said:
Soaking in StarSan could help out too, it should be acidic enough to get any beer stone off. I'd do a hot PBW/cold acid combo and see how that does.
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Cool. I'll try that tomorrow
 
Bought the kit from Willams today and a 2.1 oz O2 bottle from the hardware store. Hope to put this to use in the next two weeks. If this does improve my brewing I will probably go ahead and invest in a 20 cf O2 tank and regulator. I called around about buying a tank and getting it filled. Only one place in the county fills O2 tank with 20 cf. Quoted a used tank and first fill for $100. Anyone think this is a fair price?

Also, one place I called asked if I wanted an O2 for welding versus O2 for a medical tank and mentioned that the contents for each tank would be different. I would assume that O2 for welding would just be O2 but I am not sure about medical oxygen tanks. Anyone know if there is a difference?
 
Golddiggie said:
I've never boiled mine. I just make sure to protect the stone once I've run it in the StarSan solution and put it away. Doesn't get much easier.
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That what I think is so weird. It was only the 2nd time I'd used it and the o2 was always on so I don't know how it could have gotten clogged. I guess I should submerge all of he tubing just to make sure there isn't a leak somewhere else that I've missed
 
coypoo said:
That what I think is so weird. It was only the 2nd time I'd used it and the o2 was always on so I don't know how it could have gotten clogged. I guess I should submerge all of he tubing just to make sure there isn't a leak somewhere else that I've missed
Click to expand...

So you don't have the one from William's on the wand I take it... If you have the .5 micron stone, then there's the reason why most go with the 2 micron stone. I like having mine on the wand, since I can easily control how deep it goes into the fermenter. All of the gas tubing is outside of the fermenter too, making it even better.
 
msa8967 said:
Bought the kit from Willams today and a 2.1 oz O2 bottle from the hardware store. Hope to put this to use in the next two weeks. If this does improve my brewing I will probably go ahead and invest in a 20 cf O2 tank and regulator. I called around about buying a tank and getting it filled. Only one place in the county fills O2 tank with 20 cf. Quoted a used tank and first fill for $100. Anyone think this is a fair price?

Also, one place I called asked if I wanted an O2 for welding versus O2 for a medical tank and mentioned that the contents for each tank would be different. I would assume that O2 for welding would just be O2 but I am not sure about medical oxygen tanks. Anyone know if there is a difference?
Click to expand...
After tax, the welding shop here came to $93 something for a used tank filled, and exchanges are $14.50.

So yeah, sounds about the same price.
 
Golddiggie said:
So you don't have the one from William's on the wand I take it... If you have the .5 micron stone, then there's the reason why most go with the 2 micron stone. I like having mine on the wand, since I can easily control how deep it goes into the fermenter. All of the gas tubing is outside of the fermenter too, making it even better.
Click to expand...

No, it's the one from Williams. I was under the impression that you wanted it on the bottom if he fermenter when oxygenating
 
coypoo said:
No, it's the one from Williams. I was under the impression that you wanted it on the bottom if he fermenter when oxygenating
Click to expand...

What size fermenter are you using that the entire wand gets submerged? I typically position the stone so that it's a few inches off of the bottom of my fermenter. Easy to do with any of the fermenters I have. Even the tall 1/4 barrel kegs. I've also used it the same in my brew-buddy's 6 gallon carboy, or bucket fermenter without issue.

Once you have it unclogged, I would simply run some O2 through it while it's in the StarSan bucket. I've been doing that since I started using the oxygenation wand.
 
It's a 6 gal bucket. I think that next time I won't have it rest on the bottom.

It goes straight into the StarSan right after the fermenter and the o2 is on the whole time which is why I'm so confused as to how it got clogged in the first place
 
I use the US Plastics 7 gal. bucket with the Williams O2 wand. It can rest on the bottom with no trouble and still sticks up out of the wort. I put it in the boil with about 15 minutes left, then transfer it to the fermenter after chilling & oxygenate. Then, with the O2 still on, I stick it in a bucket full of cold water that's the outflow of the chiller, swish it around a second, then pull it out. I've done this now for the 10 batches or so since I got the Williams setup, and I have no problems.....and, yeah, it's hard for me to see how yours could clog up, too.
 
So I think the problem was with my o2 rank the whole time. I soaked the wand in oxyclean for a few hours and just tried it. Nothing happened. So I took he wand off and just stuck the end of the tubing in the liquid and was barely getting any bubbles. I'm going to go get another tank tomorrow and hopefully that will solve the issues.

So, what is the new way to store the wand/tank? Should I take them apart? Leave everything attached? What is everybody else's procedure once they've oxygenated their wort?
 
I turn off the regulator, as well as the valve on the O2 cylinder (a 20 cubic foot) before removing the wand from the tubing. I keep my original wand in the platic bag it came in. The newer wand (just got the wand this time) gets stored with the stone wrapped in aluminum foil. Both get a dunk in StarSan, with O2 pushed through them, before being stored.
 
I leave it attached to the tubing, but other than that I'm the same as GoldDiggie (with the plastic, not the foil).
 
If you wanted to try oxygenation on the cheap, I wonder could you used a sanitized airstone & tubing that you typically find in aquarium use with a small pump (granted it would have to be run a lot longer than using pure O2)?

If so I think you could do a test for under $12, I'm just not sure an aquarium airstone would be safe to use.
 
Jukas said:
If you wanted to try oxygenation on the cheap, I wonder could you used a sanitized airstone & tubing that you typically find in aquarium use with a small pump (granted it would have to be run a lot longer than using pure O2)?

If so I think you could do a test for under $12, I'm just not sure an aquarium airstone would be safe to use.
Click to expand...

That would be aerating not oxygenating bc you're using room air
 
Jukas said:
If you wanted to try oxygenation on the cheap, I wonder could you used a sanitized airstone & tubing that you typically find in aquarium use with a small pump (granted it would have to be run a lot longer than using pure O2)?

If so I think you could do a test for under $12, I'm just not sure an aquarium airstone would be safe to use.
Click to expand...

That would work, using air you can get a max of 8ppm of o2 into wort. You would need a inline filter to make sure your not injecting anything into your wort.
 
Jukas said:
If you wanted to try oxygenation on the cheap, I wonder could you used a sanitized airstone & tubing that you typically find in aquarium use with a small pump (granted it would have to be run a lot longer than using pure O2)?

If so I think you could do a test for under $12, I'm just not sure an aquarium airstone would be safe to use.
Click to expand...

Most decent homebrew shops sell an aeration setup with aquarium pump, airstone, tubing, and filter.

I bought one a while back, but I don't really recommend it, since for just marginally more money ($15-20), you can get a much better *oxygenation* setup that uses the disposable welding tanks.
 
Room air being 21% O2, an aquarium pump would do well. Certainly much more efficient than shaking and sloshing for 10 minutes. Run some sanitizer (booze, StarSan) thru tubing and soak the aquarium stone in same. Filter the air with a wet (sanitizer) cotton ball at the pump inlet or stuff a small amount of wet cotton into the tubing just in front of the stone using a match stick or similar. Fix the tubing/stone to some wire (length of coat hanger) with some tiny boat ties (cable ties) then sanitize the apparatus with sanitizer squirted by mist bottle ($.99 at Walley-World). The wire/Tubing apparatus enables getting the stone to bottom of wort (otherwise the stone just floats on top of wort). I'd bubble the wort for 3-4 minutes. You will probably then have bubbling in the air lock in <8 hours, probably 6, I'd bet on 4 depending on the temperature of the wort.

Please report back to us with success, failure, pitfalls or other pearls of wisdom.

Bones
 
So far in the last week I have done five (2.5 gallon) brew in the bag brews. I am using buckets instead of carboys. I let the O2 have strong bubbles and added O2 for 12-15 seconds per batch. For all 5 brews I made yeast starters and there is no activity in any of the airlocks so I am wondering if I did something wrong with the aeration. (I know that no airlock activity is not an indication of lack of fermentation). I plan to check on the first brews SG later today.

Any idea if I did something wrong? Should I have stirred the wort after adding the O2? Should I have let the O2 run longer because of using buckets instead of carboys?
 
Yeast will not go anaerobic and produce CO2 and ethanol when there is oxygen available. Maybe they are just consuming the O2 you saturated the fermenters withuntil they run out? Are the seals on the buckets working? I think that if there is fermentation going on then the airlock should be active (assuming the airlock is the easiest way out.)
 

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