Chill

Hello,

I tried to search on this topic but it seems I wasn't able to find anything. I am a total newb at brewing and intend to use the Coopers micro kit. Anyway, I'm wondering about the best way to chill the wort? If I use an ice bath, typically how long and how much ice should I use? For example, just put a 7 pound bag of ice in the sink and stick the wort-pot into that...wait 2 hours??

Poincare said:

Hello,

I tried to search on this topic but it seems I wasn't able to find anything. I am a total newb at brewing and intend to use the Coopers micro kit. Anyway, I'm wondering about the best way to chill the wort? If I use an ice bath, typically how long and how much ice should I use? For example, just put a 7 pound bag of ice in the sink and stick the wort-pot into that...wait 2 hours??

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No too hours is WAAAY to long...you need to get it down as fast as possible...tha's why some people use immersion chillers

With Ice water, I fill the sink with about a bag of ice, salt, and water, and set the pot in, then leave the water running a trickle so it overflows into the sink next door...keeping the water moving that way helps. I sometimes leave my brewspoon in the kettle towards the end of the boil, and that way it is still sanitized if it's sitting in the pot, so I can stir it a bit every now and then....

I also sometimes gently swirl the pot in the sink to move the water a bit, to get the hot water away from the cold water.

When the ice has melted and the water feels warm to the touch, and the beer has dropped into the 100's, I usually carefully lift the pot out of the sink, drain out the wark water, and replace it will more ice/cold water, and set the pot back in..

Doing this I can usually get a 3-4 gallons of wort down to pitching temp in less than an hour....not ideal but it works.

Ice bath is the easiest and most practical option for newbies.

Fill your sink with cold water and add 3.5 # of ice. Add your wort and let it sit for 15 mins. If you see that you need to add more ice you do it. Measure the temperature of the wort and when you are approaching your pitching temp you take it out and do it.

I only used ice from my fridge and it only makes 1-2 lbs. with 7 lbs you should be done much faster. i also add some plastic ice packs and i change the water 3 times when it gets warm.

Also, since you are doing the Coopers kit then you probably will be chilling only 2-3 gallons of wort. This happens pretty quickly in a water/ice bath. You will probably be at pitching temp in less than 30 mins.

You can also chill the top-off water in the fridge the night before you do the brewing. That way your wort only needs to get 110 degrees or so before you put it into the fermenter (where you should have the top off water sitting at a nice 40 degrees.) The two averaged should come out to pitching temp. The target is between 70-75.

Hi, thanks for the replies. So .... everything I have been reading about says you have to keep the lid on the wort-pot in order to prevent/minimize bacteria infection. Is it safe to take off the lid for a few minutes while I check the wort temperature to see if it is close to pitching temperature? Is there some other way that people use to check the temperature of the wort while minimizing bacteria?

Poincare said:

Hi, thanks for the replies. So .... everything I have been reading about says you have to keep the lid on the wort-pot in order to prevent/minimize bacteria infection. Is it safe to take off the lid for a few minutes while I check the wort temperature to see if it is close to pitching temperature? Is there some other way that people use to check the temperature of the wort while minimizing bacteria?

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NO,NO,NO!!!

You don't cover your wort while cooling...unless you use something like a sanitized mesh splatter cover...closing it up does not allow DMS to be released in the steam, and if it ends up in your wort, my produce a noticeable off taste of cooked corn in you beer...let it breath while it cools...

The only thing that would truly harm your beer at this stage was if your pet monkey hacked a loogey, or your pet bird shat in it....

The steam rising off the cooling wort will keep any micro particles from landing in it...

I always wanted a Pet Monkey.

Instead of using the sink, which I'm not sure would support the weight of a kettle full of wort, I got a big plastic tub from Walmart for around $8. I put a box of rock salt in the bottom, dump a bag of ice on top of it, and then fill it around 3/4 of the way with water from the hose. Then I carefully put the kettle down into the ridiculously cold water and stir the water a bit to get it moving around the outside of the kettle. I usually sanitize two new gallon-size freezer bags, fill with ice, and place into the wort. It usually takes another bag of ice or so into the water, and a few changes of the plasti bags, but the wort gets down to 70* in about 20 minutes or so. When I remember to use Whirlfloc it already looks like beer, too. Nice and clear, with most of the break material on the bottom!

Col224 said:

I always wanted a Pet Monkey.

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Just keep him in his room during brewing sessions...I hear they're good at flinging all manner of stuff, that you wouldn't want getting into your beer.

Col224 said:

I always wanted a Pet Monkey.

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So you could spank it?

Pivzavod said:

So you could spank it?

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CRAP! You beat me to the punch line!

Ooookay, back on topic. I have had great success with a technique which will get your wort down to pitching temperature in 15 minutes or less. First, chill a gallon or more of water (from the same source you used for your wort, as this is going in the beer). If you can't do this, it's not essential.

The key is ice water and two spoons. Fill your sink with ice water--14-16lbs of ice is ideal. Put your wort pot in there...if it floats too much, add some chilled water. Or go ahead and add the chilled water now...just make sure you leave enough space to stir vigorously.

Now, take your (clean and sanitized) wort stirrer in your right hand, and stir the wort in the pot in a clockwise direction. Then, with a spoon in your left hand, stir the water in the sink and keep it circulating around the pot. This keeps cold water in contact with the pot at all times and circulates the heat away, while the wort gets aerated and more of it comes into contact with the cold metal of the pot.

The needle on your thermometer will drop like a rock.


CB

climateboy said:

Ooookay, back on topic. I have had great success with a technique which will get your wort down to pitching temperature in 15 minutes or less. First, chill a gallon or more of water (from the same source you used for your wort, as this is going in the beer). If you can't do this, it's not essential.

The key is ice water and two spoons. Fill your sink with ice water--14-16lbs of ice is ideal. Put your wort pot in there...if it floats too much, add some chilled water. Or go ahead and add the chilled water now...just make sure you leave enough space to stir vigorously.

Now, take your (clean and sanitized) wort stirrer in your right hand, and stir the wort in the pot in a clockwise direction. Then, with a spoon in your left hand, stir the water in the sink and keep it circulating around the pot. This keeps cold water in contact with the pot at all times and circulates the heat away, while the wort gets aerated and more of it comes into contact with the cold metal of the pot.

The needle on your thermometer will drop like a rock.


CB

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Pretty good....but I wanna see a picture of your two spooned cooling method.

Revvy said:

Pretty good....but I wanna see a picture of your two spooned cooling method.

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LOL I thought we were back to the monkeys.

Aw, man. Now I have to buy a membership so I can post pictures, to prove that nothing I do--at least, nothing I do that is related to beer--involves monkeys.

Except, of course, the monkey I have trained to play the spoons to earn money for hops.

OK. So, while I am chilling the wort I keep the lid off.... Got it. Then, just use a cleaned (sanitized?) thermometer to keep checking the temperature?

easiest method for partial boil folks:
1. Prep your top off as normal and place into santized containers
2. Place containers in to the freezer before brewing so they are just about to freeze when done
3. Pour near frozen top off water into your fermenter, rack hot wort right into it

...instant pitching temps 65-70 degrees. I've actually had to warm up the fermenter a couple times when I did this and got it too cold.

brewt00l said:

easiest method for partial boil folks:
1. Prep your top off as normal and place into santized containers
2. Place containers in to the freezer before brewing so they are just about to freeze when done
3. Pour near frozen top off water into your fermenter, rack hot wort right into it

...instant pitching temps 65-70 degrees. I've actually had to warm up the fermenter a couple times when I did this and got it too cold.

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I agree that would work great if you have room for 3 gallons or more in your freezer...which I don't.

Also, you know, I never prep top-off water except to chill it down, and sometimes not even that. I either use bottled spring water or filtered tap water, and my beer turns out great. Personal preference, I suppose.

climateboy said:

I agree that would work great if you have room for 3 gallons or more in your freezer...which I don't.

Also, you know, I never prep top-off water except to chill it down, and sometimes not even that. I either use bottled spring water or filtered tap water, and my beer turns out great. Personal preference, I suppose.

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Lots of ifs, conditions & preferences in this endeavor...many of them don't have a significant impact on the end result.

Revvy said:

NO,NO,NO!!!

You don't cover your wort while cooling...unless you use something like a sanitized mesh splatter cover...closing it up does not allow DMS to be released in the steam, and if it ends up in your wort, my produce a noticeable off taste of cooked corn in you beer...let it breath while it cools...

The only thing that would truly harm your beer at this stage was if your pet monkey hacked a loogey, or your pet bird shat in it....

The steam rising off the cooling wort will keep any micro particles from landing in it...

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I would cover it during cooling. How to Brew - By John Palmer - Cooling the Wort

Plus, if it is extract, the DMS is already gone during the initial concentration of the extract itself.

PseudoChef said:

I would cover it during cooling. How to Brew - By John Palmer - Cooling the Wort

Plus, if it is extract, the DMS is already gone during the initial concentration of the extract itself.

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Yeah, that's what I was referring to in my very first post... that what I am reading says to KEEP THE TOP ON THE WORT-POT while you are chilling it. John Palmer's book says to do this in the introduction. However, several people previously posted to keep the top off...?!?!? So .... I keep the top off? And, how can I check the temperature of the wort? Just take the lid off for 1-2 minutes while I am checking the temperature and then put the lid back on? Sorry, like I said -- I'm a total n00b.

The lid on or off debate is a bit pointless...sure, Palmer says toss the lid on then goes on to say:

"As mentioned in the previous chapter, it is best to keep the pot lid on, but if you are careful you can speed up the cooling by stirring. Gently stir the wort in a circular manner so the maximum amount of wort is moving against the sides of the pot."

The whole point of the lid is to keep things out of the kettle while you're doing the ice bath..if you're concerned that you're going to splash ice-bath water into the kettle or let something else fall into it, keep it on.

brewt00l said:

if you're concerned that you're going to splash ice-bath water into the kettle or let something else fall into it, keep it on.

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QFT. I managed to get a cup or so of tap water right into my cooling kettle while I drained and refilled the sink last time. Should have left the lid on! Beer turned out great, though, anyway.

Well Palmer also says this in the common off flavors section...

DMS is continuously produced in the wort while it is hot and is usually removed by vaporization during the boil. If the wort is cooled slowly these compounds will not be removed from the wort and will dissolve back in. Thus it is important to not completely cover the brewpot during the boil or allow condensate to drip back into the pot from the lid. The wort should also be cooled quickly after the boil, either by immersing in an ice bath or using a wort chiller.

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Personally, as long as steam is rising off the beer I sure as heck wouldn't trap anything rising off it, and allow it to condense back into my wort. It's being volatilized for a reason, so I'm going to let it go bye bye....

There's really no definitive answer as to how long a boil you need to drive off the precursors anyway. I usually boil for 90 minutes...BUT I just heard an old podcast with either John Palmer or Chris Colby of BYO, saying that in lab testing they found it still existed even after a TWO HOUR BOIL... So is that stuff still rising off my wort carried by the steam and heat rising off it or not??? I think it is...


I suggested to someone yesterday, that if they were THAT paranoid about something falling in their beer to get a large enough grease splatter screen




They even make domed ones...



but there's no promise that the mesh wouldn't still trap condensate...

Me, I like my thermometer in the kettle and I leave a spoon in it for the last 15 minutes of the boil if I am on the stove top and ice bathing, so I can stir during the cooling phase....

Besides anything rising off the beer is also creating an updraft so micro particles are pretty much going to held aloft....And since I don't have any pet monkeys or birds around to potentially sh*t in my beer, I'm not going to worry...

K. Thanks all for the replies. I like the idea of keeping the stir-spoon and thermometer in the pot -- which is something I hadn't thought about.