Noob looking for advice

Hi all, I got a home brew starters kit (Coopers Home Starter Kit to be exact which is an Australian company) and I got my first batch under way yesterday. A couple of questions that I hope people can give me advice on. (1.) While I was getting the temp right for the the fermentation vessel (which had the Coopers Enhancer pack in and the lager Beer Kit with the water up to 23lt's) I left a gap of about 5mins to 7mins before I added the yeast. Did I leave that way to long as I am paranoid that I may have. Reading the instructions says to get the yeast in asap. (2.) Secondly, I don't have a heat pad or belt so I have wrapped the fermentation vessel in some blankets in am attempt to contain the heat. The temp maintained at around 24 degrees yesterday but today it has dropped to 20/22 degrees. Is this temp change going to affect the brew? My neighbour reckons that as low as 18 degrees is fine. (3.) Lastly, there is a lot of sediment on the bottom of the fermentation vessel, is this normal and what are the clear signs that it has all gone wrong. Apologies for the long winded post, thanks for reading and hopefully answering.

1: i have a brew i did hours ago i still haven't added yeast to. it's all about good sanitation. i live in texas, and the ground water wouldn't cool it off enough, so i do a mixture of immersion cooler/no-chill in the summer. i sometimes let mine sit overnight without adding yeast. my sanitation is good, so i never had a problem. 2: 20 is perfect. it's where it should be now. 3: sediment happens

1. Pitching the yeast well after the wort has cooled won't be any problems provided the wort was in a safe clean area or covered so that nothing could get added to it (like animal hair, bugs child toys...). It will be just fine.

2. During the first few days of primary fermentation stage the temp inside the fermentor can be 5 F or 3 C higher than the surrounding air temps. Were the of 20/22 you mentioned in Celsius?

3. There should be a lot of sediment on the bitton of the fermentor. This is a good sign. If you are fermenting in a glass container make sure it is covered with a towel or a dark shirt to protect the beer from UV rays.

Thanks to both of you for the reply, i am a little more at ease. @ msa8967 to answer your question, yes that temp reading is in celsius. I suppose it is just a case a practice makes perfect in regards to the adding of the yeast. I am in New Zealand so I would imagine the tap water to be different at this side of the world. Will have to see how it turns out

From what you have written I think your beer will come out just fine. I usually get my beer slightly below recommended fermentation temps because the activty will raise the temp by 2-3 C above the surrounding temps. Let us know how this turns out for you.

Thanks very much mate, will do.

Sounds like you made beer. My first batch, I was paranoid as all hell and it still turned out. I didn't care for it much, but it was an Irish red, and I've figured out that's a style I don't care for. The reviews from people who tried it were good, though.

boydo, I'm sure your beer will be fine. Just for grins, why not go to your profile, and enter your location. I for one like seeing where people are. You too squeekybobo!

Let's hope CBXBob. I'm typing all the way from New Zealand, can't find the setting in my profile. Another question that has come to mind. What are peoples experiences with heat pads and heat belts. I wanna try regulate the temp of my brew better even though I think it is fine now. During the winter when the temperature gets closer to zero and below I wanna still be able to brew. So what is better heat pad or belt? Overall is the pad better for the 1st and 2nd fermentation, just thinking that the pad would be better for the bottles when fermenting.

Boydo said:

Let's hope CBXBob. I'm typing all the way from New Zealand, can't find the setting in my profile. Another question that has come to mind. What are peoples experiences with heat pads and heat belts. I wanna try regulate the temp of my brew better even though I think it is fine now. During the winter when the temperature gets closer to zero and below I wanna still be able to brew. So what is better heat pad or belt? Overall is the pad better for the 1st and 2nd fermentation, just thinking that the pad would be better for the bottles when fermenting.

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18 - 19 Celsius is great for brewing beers. When things get warmer like 24 or so during fermentation (especially the first 4-5 days) the chances to develop off flavors increases.

22 C is good for carbonating and bottle conditioning beers.

"During the winter when the temperature gets closer to zero and below I wanna still be able to brew." What's the temp indoors ?

Our winters in New York do get as cold as 20 to 30 below zero F at times, but I do my fermenting, carbonating and conditioning/storing in different parts of my house according to the temperature needed. The average temp in my house during the Winter is around 20C with it slightly warmer in the kitchen. I do my boiling outdoors with a propane burner.


Leave the beer alone for 2 weeks no matter what the Cooper's kit says. Don't open the fermenter, just look in it if you must. If you get foam, bubbling crud, little cheesy looking chunks moving around it's OK. If you see a skin forming or hair growing snap us a picture.

bosco

Cheers Bosco. Yeah as well as a heat pad or belt I am also gonna invest in a thermometer so I can get better temp readings instead of kinda guessing. We are heading into Summer so it is not a big concern now. Above comments make me think it should turn out ok for this first batch. The winter months get as low as -0/-5c during the frosty snaps and hovers between zero & 14
degrees Celsius ( which I suppose is tropical compared to your New York Winters).

So you reckon not to take the lid of the fermentation vessel for two weeks. The instructions say to remove the Krausen Kollar after 3 days, replace the lid and leave to ferment for a further 3/4 days. It recommends to take a FG reading on day 6/7 and if stable then it's ready to bottle. Do you use a Krausen Kollar? If so when do you remove it from the fermentation vessel?

I take the collar out in a week. Most of the gunk (crusty Krausen) is stuck to it by then. 1 Quick motion...Lift the lid and slide the collar out onto a towel (it's kinda drippy) than put lid back on.

I've done it their way as far as timing goes and it turned out OK. I found that doing what I've done before the Cooper's kit gave me a better beer with the same ingredients. I now use the fermenter for all grain beers and usually bottle after about a month.

With simple all extract kits the time can be reduced because I think there is a lot less for the yeast to do and a lot less to happen before the beer clears up and is ready for the bottle.

I know it's hard to wait but you will get a better beer no matter what you started with if you give it at least 2 weeks in the fermenter, a week or two (minimum) at 70 degrees (22C) to carbonate and a few weeks to condition.

Remember, after using the spigot to get a specific gravity sample you have to keep it clean.. I have a spray bottle of no-rinse sanitizer and after I've drawn off my sample I spray the spigot from all angles to clean it out and sanitize it.

bosco

I've found that if I take the Cooper's yeast that comes with the Cooper's kits and add it directly to my compost pile I can substantially improve the taste of the beer. If you can find some yeast by Danstar, Fermentis or even better, some liquid yeast I believe you will be pleased with the difference.

boscobeans said:

I take the collar out in a week. Most of the gunk (crusty Krausen) is stuck to it by then. 1 Quick motion...Lift the lid and slide the collar out onto a towel (it's kinda drippy) than put lid back on.

I've done it their way as far as timing goes and it turned out OK. I found that doing what I've done before the Cooper's kit gave me a better beer with the same ingredients. I now use the fermenter for all grain beers and usually bottle after about a month.

With simple all extract kits the time can be reduced because I think there is a lot less for the yeast to do and a lot less to happen before the beer clears up and is ready for the bottle.

I know it's hard to wait but you will get a better beer no matter what you started with if you give it at least 2 weeks in the fermenter, a week or two (minimum) at 70 degrees (22C) to carbonate and a few weeks to condition.

Remember, after using the spigot to get a specific gravity sample you have to keep it clean.. I have a spray bottle of no-rinse sanitizer and after I've drawn off my sample I spray the spigot from all angles to clean it out and sanitize it.

bosco

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Ok Bosco, will give that length of time a try for the next batch. Checked the temp this morning and it has dropped to 14/16/18 celsius overnight. The thermometer is not exact as it is one of those strips that stick on the outside of the fermentation vessel. Is that temp to low? Also, excuse the ignorance but what is a spigot? Lastly, what do use for your no rinse sanitizer? Would I be right in assuming it's a spray bottle with non scented bleach and water mixed. Cheers

RobertRGeorge said:

I've found that if I take the Cooper's yeast that comes with the Cooper's kits and add it directly to my compost pile I can substantially improve the taste of the beer. If you can find some yeast by Danstar, Fermentis or even better, some liquid yeast I believe you will be pleased with the difference.

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Thanks Robert, out of interest what do mean by "compost pile"?

If you are using the Cooper's fermenter (I assume so since you mention the krausen collar) the spigot is the valve or outlet on the side of the fermenter. Rather than opening the top of the fermenter to get a sample it is easier to just drain a little out of the spigot.. This is also where you attach the bottling wand when it comes time to bottle.

14 degrees C is getting down to where the yeast will start to slow down and stop working. Are you brewing this outdoors ???

I use StarSan no-rinse sanitizer. Chlorine bleach is not a good choice and must be thouroughly rinsed as it will easily ruin your beer. I would rather use very hot clean water as a rinse on the spigot than anything with bleach.

Adding it to a "compost pile" is the same as saying tossing it out in the rubbish or dust bin. Meaning you will have better results in the future using a better yeast than the one supplied with the kit.

bosco

No, we have just had a pretty bad spell of weather. Rain, High winds and hail so the sun has not really been around. Because of this weather the garage has cooled down. Think I may just need to bite the bullet and get that heat pad or belt.

Boydo said:

Thanks Robert, out of interest what do mean by "compost pile"?

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It is a bin full of kitchen scraps, yard waste, dried leaves and dirt that I keep in my garden. I find that the yeast goes in there and adds a bit to the quality of the resulting compost.

Which is to say, throw away the Cooper's yeast. It is apparantly some kind of industrial product designed to ferment very fast and not much else. I find that it gives the beer an indescribably bland and uninteresting flavor. The brands of yeast I named provide more character to the beer, enhancing hoppiness, maltiness or fruityness depending on what brand you choose. I don't know if the US brands of liquid yeast are available in NZ but if they are they provide a world of selection depending on what you like in a beer.

RobertRGeorge said:

It is a bin full of kitchen scraps, yard waste, dried leaves and dirt that I keep in my garden. I find that the yeast goes in there and adds a bit to the quality of the resulting compost.

Which is to say, throw away the Cooper's yeast. It is apparantly some kind of industrial product designed to ferment very fast and not much else. I find that it gives the beer an indescribably bland and uninteresting flavor. The brands of yeast I named provide more character to the beer, enhancing hoppiness, maltiness or fruityness depending on what brand you choose. I don't know if the US brands of liquid yeast are available in NZ but if they are they provide a world of selection depending on what you like in a beer.

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Hahaha, apologies Robert. I thought that compost pile was a special term or name given to something used in the making of the beer( like "wort"). Yeah I have read that the yeast in the beer kits is not to good so may shop around and try find a better brand of yeast. Is liquid yeast used differently to normal yeast or does just get added to the wort like the normal yeast?

There's two kinds here in NA. Wyeast comes in a foil pack that you smack to mix the ingredients. After several hours to a half a day or so it will swell up. The package says you can cut open the pack and pour it in. White Labs and some other smaller brands come in test-tube-like containers. The package says you can pour it right in from the tube.

Many brewers like to make a starter from these to boost up the number of yeast cells and get them actively fermenting. I often don't and have had no trouble that way. If you are making a beer with a lot of sugars (malt or corn or what have you) it helps to make a starter. Directions for doing that are undoubtedly somewhere on this site!

By the way, I read that NZ is growing some incredible varieties of hops now days. You could kick your brew up a notch with some of those. Maybe add 15 20 grams to simmer for five minutes.

RobertRGeorge said:

There's two kinds here in NA. Wyeast comes in a foil pack that you smack to mix the ingredients. After several hours to a half a day or so it will swell up. The package says you can cut open the pack and pour it in. White Labs and some other smaller brands come in test-tube-like containers. The package says you can pour it right in from the tube.

Many brewers like to make a starter from these to boost up the number of yeast cells and get them actively fermenting. I often don't and have had no trouble that way. If you are making a beer with a lot of sugars (malt or corn or what have you) it helps to make a starter. Directions for doing that are undoubtedly somewhere on this site!

By the way, I read that NZ is growing some incredible varieties of hops now days. You could kick your brew up a notch with some of those. Maybe add 15 20 grams to simmer for five minutes.

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Thanks Robert. Yeah definitely will look into some yeast variety's. For now I just want get a few basic batches under my belt. My first one is still at primary fermentation stage but the temp on the thermometer is hanging around the 16 to 18 degrees so worried it is to low. Bit it's day 3 today so gonna remove the Krausen Kollar and leave for a couple more days. Question, what do you use to clean your equipment. We have a product over here called Janola which is a non scented bleach and this can be diluted to use as a disinfectant. However I am worried that it will affect the taste of my next batch. The smaller bits I can use boiling water but the Fermentation Vessel and Krausen Kollar are a lot bigger. So what do you use?

In Canada there is Sani Brew, essentially chlorinanted TSP. Plain TSP works too. In the US there is Powder Line Cleaner. Don't let it sit or soak the equipment too long or it will leave a hard to remove crust. 1 tablespoon of bleach in 5 gallons of water is good for soaking. Rinse thoroughly. Don't let it soak on stainless steel too long. I use iodophor for sanitizing after washing.

When you're done with the Krausen collar just rinse it with hot water and a wash cloth. Same thing with the fermenter. Pull the spigot / tap / valve (whatever you call it) and pop the pieces apart and rinse well with hot water.

The day before your next brew day wash the spigot again and re-install it in the fermenter. Use a product like Oxy-clean (check out oxygen cleaning products like Vanish NapiSan Oxi Action Powder or others like it) mix it until dissolved and throw everything you are going to use that day into it includind the spigot (opening and closing it a few times to get it well cleaned. Wipe everything with a soft washcloth then before you begin to brew rinse everything well (remember the spigot).

The CD that comes with the Cooper's kit shows all this and if you don't have the CD check this video out...



bosco

ps. This is a Cooper's product and it is what you want to use. It is however just a more expensive brand of many cheaper oxy products..

Coopers Sanitizer contains Sodium Percarbonate, an environmentally friendly cleaner/sanitizer for home beermaking equipment. As effective as chlorine bleach, without the problematic residue of bleach. Sodium Percarbonate devolves into water, oxygen and natural soda ash.

Cheers Bosco, sounds pretty straight forward. Guess the trick is not to leave it soaking for two long and make sure to give it a good rinse. While on the the subject I made a big mistake last night, I gave the Kollar a clean after I had removed it. I know that your suppose to use a soft cloth but I forgot and accidentally started cleaning it with a scouring cloth. There are now light visible scratches around the collar. Is this gonna cause problems? Should I throw it out and try find a new one? So annoyed cause I knew not to do this.

Boydo said:

Cheers Bosco, sounds pretty straight forward. Guess the trick is not to leave it soaking for two long and make sure to give it a good rinse. While on the the subject I made a big mistake last night, I gave the Kollar a clean after I had removed it. I know that your suppose to use a soft cloth but I forgot and accidentally started cleaning it with a scouring cloth. There are now light visible scratches around the collar. Is this gonna cause problems? Should I throw it out and try find a new one? So annoyed cause I knew not to do this.

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I don't use it anymore. The krausen ring doesn't bother me or my beer in the least. It cleans out easily as long as you do it right after emptying the fermenter on bottling or racking day. SOFT CLOTH

It's also one less reason to open the fermenter. Once I pitch the yeast and close the system the only time I open it again is to clean it out.

bosco

boscobeans said:

I don't use it anymore. The krausen ring doesn't bother me or my beer in the least. It cleans out easily as long as you do it right after emptying the fermenter on bottling or racking day. SOFT CLOTH

It's also one less reason to open the fermenter. Once I pitch the yeast and close the system the only time I open it again is to clean it out.

bosco

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Thanks Bosco. Yeah I feel like such an
Idiot. I knew not to use that cloth but it just slipped my mind. Lesson learned I suppose. Thanks for all the help

RobertRGeorge said:

In Canada there is Sani Brew, essentially chlorinanted TSP. Plain TSP works too. In the US there is Powder Line Cleaner. Don't let it sit or soak the equipment too long or it will leave a hard to remove crust. 1 tablespoon of bleach in 5 gallons of water is good for soaking. Rinse thoroughly. Don't let it soak on stainless steel too long. I use iodophor for sanitizing after washing.

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Thanks for the tip Robert

Happy to help. Good brewing to you.