Do collars cause the freezer to be less efficient?

I've seen a lot of people putting wood collars around the tops of their freezers. I can see that there are a lot of advantages to this, more space, no need to drill holes in the freezer etc. but don't they become much less efficient and spike your energy bills?

brewjack said:

I've seen a lot of people putting wood collars around the tops of their freezers. I can see that there are a lot of advantages to this, more space, no need to drill holes in the freezer etc. but don't they become much less efficient and spike your energy bills?

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Yes, it does make the fridge less efficient. Is a wooden collar enough to make it horribly inefficient and spike your energy bills, no.

The largest source of inefficiency is a poor seal between the collar and the fridge. Some people also use foam insulation glued to the back of the collar to significantly increase the R value.

I have a fairly large collar. I used pretty thin wood so I put a small block of wood beading along the top to aid the contact of the seals and along the bottom to aid the contact of adhesive to the freezer. Then I filled in the middle section that created with polystyrene that you can get from your local fish or fruit and vegie store. About a few inches thick and its packed in tight with no gaps. Then the fans I have in keep it all an even temp so I think the collar doens't contribute a whole lot to the extra power. My keezer turns on about twice a day during daylight hours I've noticed.

I was also informed by my LHBS that you need to add the collar as the coolant lines run throughout the sides as well as the lid, so drilling would be next to impossible unless you want an expensive dorr stop...

Recusit8m said:

I was also informed by my LHBS that you need to add the collar as the coolant lines run throughout the sides as well as the lid, so drilling would be next to impossible unless you want an expensive dorr stop...

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I don't think there are too many chest coolers with coolant lines in the lid. If all you see connecting the lid to the body are hinges, there are no cooling lines.

Lids are just insulation for nearly all freezers. Thats how people put towers on the top of them. Collars just give you somewhere to put the taps and gain height if needed for kegs.

Why not purchase a feezer that has enough head room as well space to handle 4 to 6 corney's with your taps out of the the front panel without adding a collar to the chest freezer? I could never understand going thru all the trouble making a chest freezer what it was never intended to be used as.
By this making a smaller CU/FT freezer handle a larger volume than the manufactures designed their units in the first place. They already are on the smallest compressor size for the "Green World" why make it work harder or to their maximun limits? The compressor hump problem, just get a bigger chest freezer and move on. JMO's not to start a war just my thinking about adding collars to chest freezers. Unless you must show stained wood I do not have a clue. Function vs looks here. Granted there are many great collared freezers posted but not for me.

And how do you buy a freezer knowing where the coolant lines are before purchase? I doubt the few times a day my freezer runs and the 15 mins its on for that period is really pushing the compressors limits. And thats with one of the larger collars I've seen.

How would you be increasing the load on the compressor by turning it into a fridge? Sure you'd be decreasing the R value but you'd be increasing the temperature inside significantly, right, so the compressor would be just taking a stroll through the part, so to speak, instead of breakin rocks all day.

Not all of us have unlimited funds so we can go out and buy the biggest and newest chest freezer. Some of us are using hand-me-down freezers and we took what we could get.
Adding a collar and turning up the temp that the freezer maintains does not make the compressor work any harder, probably even less work for it.

BrewBeemer said:

Why not purchase a feezer that has enough head room as well space to handle 4 to 6 corney's with your taps out of the the front panel without adding a collar to the chest freezer? I could never understand going thru all the trouble making a chest freezer what it was never intended to be used as.
By this making a smaller CU/FT freezer handle a larger volume than the manufactures designed their units in the first place. They already are on the smallest compressor size for the "Green Word" why make it work harder or to their maximun limits? The compressor hump problem, just get a bigger chest freezer and move on. JMO's not to start a war just my thinking about adding collars to chest freezers. Unless you must show stained wood I do not have a clue. Function vs looks here. Granted there are many great collared freezers posted but not for me.

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You can't drill through the walls of the freezer because you'd be drilling into the lines. Running a freezer designed for 10F deep freeze at 40F is hardly making it work harder even if you're chilling another 6 cubic feet or so. Now, I'm not much for these huge collars made from 2x10's by any means. My collar is 3/4" x 3" poplar and blends into the cabinet seamlessly.

I used 2 x 6 lumber for the collar as I wanted the extra thickness to improve the R-value at least some over 1 x material. I agree that it must be a lot easier for the compressor to maintain a warmer temperature. There's a huge difference between +40 F (or thereabouts) and -12 F. The only regret I have about using the 2 x 6 lumber is that it makes it difficult to reach the bottom of the freezer for cleaning etc. Not a huge issue, but I would go with 2 x 4 lumber if I were to do it over. I thought the added height inside would be beneficial, but in hind sight it's not needed. I used common framing lumber to keep the costs down so I could put the bucks into the faucets instead. I suppose a real man would make the collar from polished granite. Hmmm...

My collar is insulated, so it probably doesn't impact my electrical bill much. Circulating cold air into the conditioning cabinet hurts it a bit. The kegger does run more than the chest freezer next to it, even though they are the same brand and the kegger is newer. But, my last electrical bill was $27, which is less than my local phone charges.

The white stuff is latex foam insulation. You can see how well it conforms to the lid's seal.

I am happy with opening my freezer and grabbing a cobra tap to dispense a beer. I can fit 4 kegs, and the hump is the perfect size for my tank/reg and about a dozen chilled pint glasses! I doubt I will ever do a collar, If I have more than 4 full kegs, one sits in the brewcloset and ages, and I focus on killing one of the cold kegs.

I am willing to bet that most of the collar builders have incorporated more R-value in insulating their collars than the freezer has to begin with. Most of us don;t just dive into this we actually think the design through and look for potential seal issues. At the very least we correct them as we find them.

I have not yet insulated my collar and, I have not yet found a need. My freezer is set to 40*F and runs once a day for about 15 minutes. I like the "bling factor" of having the faucets, the fancy fascia, and not having to open the lid everytime I want to draw a pint. Cobra's work just fine tho' and I won't hesitate to dig mine out if I need an extra keg tapped.

david_42 said:

my last electrical bill was $27, which is less than my local phone charges.

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My summer electric bill is over $200

GilaMinumBeer said:

I am willing to bet that most of the collar builders have incorporated more R-value in insulating their collars than the freezer has to begin with.

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I'd like in on this wager.

The R value of 1.5" soft lumber is 2. The R value of a chest freezer wall is typically 14 - 20. 90% of the collars I've seen on here are designed for uninsulated soft lumber.

Right now I am using a converted upright freezer but when I can get to it I have a chest freezer that will be converted and I will be doing the collar with PVC . like this

springer said:

Right now I am using a converted upright freezer but when I can get to it I have a chest freezer that will be converted and I will be doing the collar with PVC . like this

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I like the hollow plastic fence rail idea since you can insulate it. Too bad he didn't consider using latex expanding foam (water cleanup) instead of cutting small strips of styrofoam. What a mess that was...

y'know, we have a debate forum...

If you don't want to build a collar, don't.

If you love your collar, pour.

Hang Glider said:

y'know, we have a debate forum...

If you don't want to build a collar, don't.

If you love your collar, pour.

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The title of this thread is "Do collars cause the freezer to be less efficient?". Has nothing to do with loving or hating collars, it's called a discussion.

lamarguy said:

I like the hollow plastic fence rail idea since you can insulate it. Too bad he didn't consider using latex expanding foam (water cleanup) instead of cutting small strips of styrofoam. What a mess that was...

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makes a nice clean install of the wires too.I'll have to look into the latex foam .

lamarguy said:

I like the hollow plastic fence rail idea since you can insulate it. Too bad he didn't consider using latex expanding foam (water cleanup) instead of cutting small strips of styrofoam. What a mess that was...

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He did consider it... but it didn't work too well because it is hard to shoot the stuff two feet into the cavity (some of us are dribblers, while others can launch it a long distance, I guess).

I used the extruded insulation on mine and it worked perfectly. I cut the strips the same size as the opening, and was able to push them in without too much hassle. For one strip, I cut the insulation a little too big, so I inserted it into a plastic shopping bag, which helped it slide a little better into the fence. Worked like a charm.

jpc said:

He did consider it... but it didn't work too well because it is hard to shoot the stuff two feet into the cavity (some of us are dribblers, while others can launch it a long distance, I guess).

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Ha...Thanks for the analogy.

I used expanding latex foam to fill an 18 x 18 x 1 void when I built a thermoelectric yeast starter chamber a while back. I just built the enclosure, drilled a small hole in the top, and sprayed the foam downward. Gravity did the work.

no collar yet = 2 cobra taps

I like the idea of a collar, but I can just see my dog walking up and licking the faucets, or worse, pulling one of the taps.

I might have to go with a tower.

lamarguy said:

I'd like in on this wager.

The R value of 1.5" soft lumber is 2. The R value of a chest freezer wall is typically 14 - 20. 90% of the collars I've seen on here are designed for uninsulated soft lumber.

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I once built a box out of plywood with a refrigeration unit dismembered and added to it in a small bar, it was cycling all the time. A second layer of plywood was added with 2" pink sheets of foam between it made a noticeable difference. This is why i'm against collars. Looking at reply #13 with the collar photo of member david 42's latex foam filled collar is one super great looking unit, I bet a high "R" factor collar also. Granted the freezer is working less maintaining plus 40 degree temp vs +10 or - below zero must be a easy load on the compressor and can handle the added collar. After going thru building a complete custom box with a high failure cooling result with only a noticeable difference I am a little gun shy of any plain board collar. That foam collar by david 42still comes to mind and is the best one I have ever seen on this forum, thanks for the photo davis 42.
Converting a freezer to operating at 40 degrees with a plank vs foam filled two layers of wood would add to my electric bill, it's high enough now at $180to $200 a month. Christmas time with the lights my electric bill will pass $435 during the holidays. This is why i'm wanting to build a unit with the highest "R" rating without a collar, a deep chest for corny's. With a average of $180 to $200 a month all year I have a reason why. See my point here, I have no intentions of starting a pissing war. This without adding my natural gas heating bill I have enough money going out. If I spend a couple 5 hour days with the Tig I really get socked with a electric bill. The 251 Miller Mig
after building a 2 axle boat trailer (24' boat) I had one big electric bill.

My 3 year old side by side Maytag frig must run 60% of the time, was told smaller compressor for the energy savings. WTF? The 1947 radius top Philco from grandma is half in the sun under a open overhang outside, hits high 80's in the summer and it cycles once every two hours for app 22 seconds. Ice trays a frozen block of ice, I leave it to maintain cold down below longer between cycles. Energy pig old 1947 Philco my ass it is off 99% of the time.
I hope all this explains my first reply and what I replied?

Bobby_M said:

You can't drill through the walls of the freezer because you'd be drilling into the lines. Running a freezer designed for 10F deep freeze at 40F is hardly making it work harder even if you're chilling another 6 cubic feet or so. Now, I'm not much for these huge collars made from 2x10's by any means. My collar is 3/4" x 3" poplar and blends into the cabinet seamlessly.

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I have drilled thru three of two different brands of freezers without drilling into lines. Lines in the way at times yes, opened up the hole then cut the fins
to free up the coil in the way then carefully bending the coil gas line out of the way. No problems. To go into it with a hole saw blind like a madman drilling straight thru yes you will let the gas out.

[QUOTE
If you don't want to build a collar, don't.
If you love your collar, pour. [/QUOTE]

I love my collar, and I'm pouring.
I bought a new fridge, and a new chest freezer. I turned my old fridge into a fermentation chamber, and built my keggerator with a basic 1"x 7" collar. Both the new fridge and the chest were decent Estar systems. My electricity usage dropped around 10% even though I went from one Fridge to 3.
Cold air tends to drop, and hot air rises. The key with any fridge is to keep it sealed so air does not leak out. That is were you get massive loss of cold air and forces the compressor to work harder.
Good insulation is always great, and when I re-do my collar to better fit its current location I will.

Rick500 said:

...I might have to go with a tower.

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I would rethink putting a tower on top of a chest freezer.

I used 2x6 pine for the collar.

Don't forget that the insulating needs of the collar are diminished by the fact that the coldest air chilling those kegs is resting at the bottom of the chest freezer. I've had my chest freezer open for long periods of time whilst cleaning, testing new batches cross and generally dicking around. All the while, the cooler hardly ever kicks on since the cool bed of air is not being flushed out (like happens on a front door cooler when you open the door.)

A collar is easy to build.
A collar is cheap to build
Gives you no worries about where to run gas and liquid lines in and out.

BrewBeemer said:

I once built a box out of plywood with a refrigeration unit dismembered and added to it in a small bar, it was cycling all the time. A second layer of plywood was added with 2" pink sheets of foam between it made a noticeable difference. This is why i'm against collars.

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You also have to remember that a heat rises, in this wood box you had made has a weak R vale of 0.47 (for 3/8 ply) throughout the entire box. In the chest freezer you are looking at an R value of 15-20 throughout the area with the coldest temperatures and the collar (weak point in the insulation factor) is very minimal and at a higher level almost always above the temp probe placement thus causing little ill effects. This is why adding the insulation helped you so much and the effects were so noticeable, you had no insulation. Collars do work, and they work well, the reason you expressed you disliked them was because you built your own uninsulated fridge which didn't get the job done.

I have personally been thinking about taking the dorm fridge that I have and building a fermentation chamber with it I have no doubt that with the proper insulation I will be able to create a larger space then the original fridge but also maintain lower temps.

BrewBeemer said:

Why not purchase a feezer that has enough head room as well space to handle 4 to 6 corney's with your taps out of the the front panel without adding a collar to the chest freezer? I could never understand going thru all the trouble making a chest freezer what it was never intended to be used as.
By this making a smaller CU/FT freezer handle a larger volume than the manufactures designed their units in the first place. They already are on the smallest compressor size for the "Green World" why make it work harder or to their maximun limits? The compressor hump problem, just get a bigger chest freezer and move on. JMO's not to start a war just my thinking about adding collars to chest freezers. Unless you must show stained wood I do not have a clue. Function vs looks here. Granted there are many great collared freezers posted but not for me.

Click to expand...

The idea is to not permantly alter the condition of the freezer. If, for some reason you change your mind in the future and want a different setup, you can just take the collar and the temp controller off of the thing and have a freezer again. It's called thinking ahead.

jaja said:

And how do you buy a freezer knowing where the coolant lines are before purchase? I doubt the few times a day my freezer runs and the 15 mins its on for that period is really pushing the compressors limits. And thats with one of the larger collars I've seen.

Click to expand...

evanmars said:

Not all of us have unlimited funds so we can go out and buy the biggest and newest chest freezer. Some of us are using hand-me-down freezers and we took what we could get.
Adding a collar and turning up the temp that the freezer maintains does not make the compressor work any harder, probably even less work for it.

Click to expand...

I din't have any income for over 7 years nence why a cheap plywood cooler then foam board with another layer of 3/8" plywood. A total waste of time and money as later we added a larger freezer that will handle corny's without a collar. We looked at each other and got drunk laughing how stupid we were on building that turd of a cooler. Young and not to smart I guess? The btand new freezer holds 6 corny's with the gas bottles and regulators mounted outside, we really went over the top this time and paid $100 for it My friend rebuilds welding regulators he would not touch my last Victor regulator just threw it against the concrete wall and told me to never put a regulator in a cooler with all that moisture again. This time he handed us two free brand new Victor 100 series brass regulators of high quality, they are mounted outside. It cost me a couple gallons of brew as he stopped by a few times checking up on our installation. If wrong and inside the cooler again he would of taken those Victor regulators away from us.
It was too hard to stick a 150 CU/FT Nitrogen/Co2 bottle in the new freezer it would stick up beyond the top of the bar top by 15 inches unless a regulator is modern art and a bar top conversation piece.