another pickup tube question

So, the fitting for my mega pot is pretty high up and if i don't come up with some sort of pickup tube for it i'll have to keep tipping the pot, which basically forces lots of trub into the fermenter. It's either tip the pot or lose almost two gallons of wort.

Anyway, i would like to make a copper tube using a threaded fitting, but i don't have any experience with or own the proper tools to sweat the coppers fittings together.

My question is this. Could i take some jb weld and use that to attach the two (or more) pieces of copper together to create the pickup tube? I know jb weld is food safe once cured, but would it hold up at boiling temps without leaching anything into the wort?

any suggestions or advice would be appreciated.

dont know about JB weld ( although its great stuff) I would suggest using a tool to flair the copper tube and connect them that way

Get a short piece of flexible copper tubing instead of ridgid copper pieces. They have it at Home Depot/Lowes in 1/2"x2' lengths for a few bucks. You can bend it by hand, cut it to length, and attach it to the bulkhead with a compression fitting. Really easy.

Or, you could buy the tools and learn to sweat the fittings. It's not really difficult at all to learn and the tools required aren't very expensive. I don't think you can really go wrong buying tools. You will also probably find other projects to use them on. Surely you have a friend or two that knows how to sweat copper fittings. Hit them up with some home brew and sweat on!

+1 to both of the last two posts.

Compression fittings are no brainer easy. Can be done with a wrench.

Soldering (sweating) copper is a piece of cake. Blowtorch, lead free solder and some flux (make sure it's the one that has silver in it to make your life easier).

With both methods you can but a cheap pipe cutting tool to cut the copper.

i'm not really against learning the process, but the torches i keep seeing run in the $40 range (though i admit i didn't look closely) and since this is the first need i've had for one i don't see a big need in the future. I'd just rather not run through my brew budget on tools i'm not sure i'll need more than once.

Do they make copper compression fittings or are we talking about the brass types that you use on water lines for fridges?

the compression fittings will be brass

As a former plumber who has sweated 10,000 + fittings EASILY and even though I have any plumbing tool I could possible ever need... for pickup tubes I would suggest using a compression fitting and a peice of soft copper.... just because its SO much easier to tweak the copper to get it where you want with some bending.... AND its so much easier to pull it apart for cleaning

Donner said:

i'm not really against learning the process, but the torches i keep seeing run in the $40 range (though i admit i didn't look closely) and since this is the first need i've had for one i don't see a big need in the future. I'd just rather not run through my brew budget on tools i'm not sure i'll need more than once.

Do they make copper compression fittings or are we talking about the brass types that you use on water lines for fridges?

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That's way too much for a propane torch. The low end models shouldn't be much over $10 plus a cylinder. Then again, if it will be a one time use, you are probably right that some other alternative would be a better choice for you. I'm a tool addict though and therefore quite biased on the subject.

michaelm said:

As a former plumber who has sweated 10,000 + fittings EASILY and even though I have any plumbing tool I could possible ever need... for pickup tubes I would suggest using a compression fitting and a peice of soft copper.... just because its SO much easier to tweak the copper to get it where you want with some bending.... AND its so much easier to pull it apart for cleaning

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Good points! OTOH, depending on your setup, a rigid pickup tube can be a better option. The way I have mine arranged, the pickup tube holds my false bottom firmly in position and snug to the bottom of the kettle. I installed a union in the horizontal pipe for easy adjustment and removal. Works like a champ!

Catt22 said:

Good points! OTOH, depending on your setup, a rigid pickup tube can be a better option. The way I have mine arranged, the pickup tube holds my false bottom firmly in position and snug to the bottom of the kettle. I installed a union in the horizontal pipe for easy adjustment and removal. Works like a champ!

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DO you happen to have a pic on this? I am trying to figure out how to make that work with my snazzy new stainless FB's, in the MLT.

Catt22 said:

Good points! OTOH, depending on your setup, a rigid pickup tube can be a better option. The way I have mine arranged, the pickup tube holds my false bottom firmly in position and snug to the bottom of the kettle. I installed a union in the horizontal pipe for easy adjustment and removal. Works like a champ!

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Yea but short run of 3/8 copper would still be PLENTY stiff enough to hold a false bottom in place... though the union is a great idea!!!!

lrr81765 said:

DO you happen to have a pic on this? I am trying to figure out how to make that work with my snazzy new stainless FB's, in the MLT.

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I'll post a pic in a few minutes. It's very easy to make and works perfectly for me.

When I did some dip tubes from 3/4" SS I used a compression fitting so that it is easier to adjust the orientation of the valve on the outside and the pipe on the inside. Otherwise you are trying to compromise on tightening too much or too little to get it lined up the way you want.

OT: There is a huge time difference in sweating a pipe with a $10 butane torch vs a $50+ MAPP torch. But it this application, use whatever makes sense. There is no wrong answer.

Here's some pics:









Note the last pic shows a close up of the end where I made a ring to fit over the pipe just after the 90 elbow. This ring is positioned to hold the false bottom in place when the union is tightened. I cut the ring from a standard coupling and sweated it in place. As you can see, my connections could be prettier, but they are fully functional!

olllllo said:

OT: There is a huge time difference in sweating a pipe with a $10 butane torch vs a $50+ MAPP torch. But it this application, use whatever makes sense. There is no wrong answer.

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The time difference isn't very important when only sweating a few joints. I have and use both a propane torch and a MAPP torch. I also have an acetylene rig if I really want to get serious. The propane torch works just fine in most situations and the gas is a lot cheaper. I would choose the acetylene torch if I were racing.

The propane would be a better choice for someone who doesn't want to invest in a lot of expensive tools and may only rarely use the torch and it will get the job done just as well.

One other thing. I had to enlarge the center hole in the false bottom to accept the 1/2" rigid copper. I used a rotary file on a cordless drill to do this. It only took a few minutes to do. I think you can buy the same false bottom with the larger hole. At the time that was not an option.

CATT! What I really noticed was the "Beer from Sellersburg, Indiana" ? You live near the 'ville?

No, I'm in Cincinnati. I scrounged a bunch of those cardboard beer cases a long time ago. I can't even remember where I found them. Never had the Tucker's beer that's labeled on the cartons.

Are you entering anything in the Bluegrass Cup competition coming up in Lexington soon? I'm planning to win some gold in that one. Stay tuned!

I'm trying to get my act together to enter in the State fair this year, but it will be close. I am about 3 weeks behind on my spring brewing sprint due to family emergencies.

I am hoping to enter an IPA and a Porter. The porter is done, and has been well received by a BJCP judge

Is that the KY state fair? What's the date. I may have to take a shot at that one too. I will have at least one in the Ohio fair.

Catt22 said:

Is that the KY state fair? What's the date. I may have to take a shot at that one too. I will have at least one in the Ohio fair.

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August 20 - 29. Be sure to PM me if you are coming down.

lrr81765 said:

August 20 - 29. Be sure to PM me if you are coming down.

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I sure will. Maybe we can grab a brew together.

so i came up with several options. found a compression fitting, but i'm starting to think the length of 1/2 inch pipe i bought might prove too tough to bend in such a short distance so i might go back and get a 90 degree elbow. I also found a copper male fitting that accepts the length of pipe well so i might see if it will hold together tight enough to work. I also discovered the neighbor has a torch, though i'd need to get the flux and tank.

by the way, home depot carries a couple models, one is in the $21 range and the other is $40 and come with tank, torch and flux etc.

Got to see what is going to work best, but i'm going to do some reading on copper sweating.

an update ....

took back the compression fitting and the copper pipe i bought yesterday because i realized that bending 1/2 inch pipe over a short distance was going to be a pain in the a$$.

I ended up purchasing one fitting to connect to the weldless fitting, an elbow and then a short union. Fit together they come out of the kettle and then straight down within an 1/8 - 1/4 of an inch from the bottom of the kettle. Hopefully this will allow me to get more of the wort.

I also bought flux, solder and the propane to sweat the fittings. Came home and was done with the whole thing in 20 minutes. Much easier than i though. Tested the unit and it holds water so i think i'm good.

One last question, though. when i screw this thing in, should i use teflon tape or anything like that or would that be a bad idea since it'd be on the inside and in contact with hot wort? The fit seems tight, but i know one never knows until it's too late.

Pipe thread use teflon ( or gas/water tape).

Compression fittings DO NOT use tape.

Shouldn't need thread sealer in this application. You should be able to get the fitting tight enough by hand to do the job and will be easier to take apart for cleaning.

Good move on buying the torch. You will use it more often than you think now that you have one. I use mine to light the burner and my gas grill.

RonRock said:

Shouldn't need thread sealer in this application. You should be able to get the fitting tight enough by hand to do the job and will be easier to take apart for cleaning.

Good move on buying the torch. You will use it more often than you think now that you have one. I use mine to light the burner and my gas grill.

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I agee, you probably won't need any kind of thread sealer for this.

Your 1/8" - 1/4" gap is a little too tight. I would suggest 3/8" - 1/2". You won't be leaving any significant wort behind and it will be less prone to something clogging up the inlet. If you were using a pump, a small gap can sometimes be a point of restriction.

no pump to worry about just yet, though i just realized that in my haste to get the fittings sweated (had a lot of drinking to do at the double decker art fest today) i don't know how the tube will line up once tightened down. i.e. will it be straight down or up or to the sides, etc. Tomorrow will be an interesting brew day.

I never really measured the distance between the bottom and the tube, so i could be off with my numbers. I am considering taking the hacksaw to it if it needs to be shortened, but for the money the three fittings was actually easier and cheaper than buying a 2-foot length of 1/2 inch pipe and cutting the 1-2 inch section off.

Tomorrow is going to be fun. New pickup tube and a aluminum flashing windshield to try out.

Thanks for all the help.

Oh, and the only hard part about using the torch was when i tightened the knob to stop the flow of gas and the thing didn't seem to want to stop burning. It finally went out but i just had visions of sitting on my patio watching a torch burn until it ran our of gas.

LOL at the torch thing. There will be residual gas pressure in the torch neck remaining after you close the valve and it sometimes takes a minute or so to wind down. Perfectly normal. The union (if you used an actual union) will allow you to rotate the elbow on the end to the proper position before you tighten the union completely. No need to over tighten the union nut. Good and snug is enough and this makes it easier to take apart. Yes, you can always shorten the pickup tube if need be. Hell, now that you know how to sweat the fittings, you can easily make whatever you want. If you don't like the way this one works, make another one that does. Might as well start shopping for a nice tool chest next. You've been hooked.

i don't think i used an actual union for the connection to the kettle. The part that attaches is threaded on one end (obviously) and then the other end was small enough to accept an elbow. The other end of the elbow was narrow and i attached a union (that is what the box said) that would normally be used to attach two pipes together (i assume).

I'm sure it will work and i can probably always monkey with the weldless fitting if need to to get it lined up. As someone else pointed out, though. If it isn't directly down then the distance to the bottom of the kettle might work better. Course, now that i know how to sweat fittings, i can always heat it up, pull it apart and start over it need be.

I'm not quite sure what fittings you have there, but sounds like it will work. I think you may have a standard coupling and not a union. Unions are a three piece fitting with a large nut in the center that will pull two pipe sections together when tightened. You can see one in my pics earlier in the thread. It is sometimes difficult to take sweat fittings apart once joined. It can be done, but sometimes not worth the effort. You will need some channel locks or large pliers and maybe both to hold and twist the fittings while hot.