pitch more yeast in secondary for barleywine?

so I brewed a batch of barleywine the other day, a variation of palmer's fightin' urakhai recipe (a bit more malt and about half as much hops) extract and steeped specialty grains. As for the yeast I pitched 2 packets of liquid wyeast 1098, fermentaion is vigorous. I'm just wondering if I should pitch another batch of yeast in the secondary a few days befor bottling to prepare for the long conditioning/aging period. Any input?

how long will it be in secondary?

Secondary is for finishing up/aging. Primary is where 95+% of the total fermentation should happen. If you've got a ways to go to hit FG, leave it in primary and let it work (provided it's not stuck)

For a barleywine, I always pitch a high gravity yeast in the secondary. Champagne yeast is a good choice, as is a wine wine yeast.

david, is there any reason I should pitch a champagne or wine yeast in stead of the 1098 british ale that I've already used?

jburkh, if your original yeast is a low attenuating yeast, or can't hit the FG that you want due to alcohol content. Adding champagne yeast might make it more dry and lack some of the taste/feel that you might desire in your barleywine.

jburkh said:

david, is there any reason I should pitch a champagne or wine yeast in stead of the 1098 british ale that I've already used?

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Here's the dealy: only you can answer your own question...by taking gravity readings. Once airlock activity has subsided and the krausen has fallen, take a specific grav reading. Then, take another reading several days later. If you don't witness any change, then it's done. The second thing to note is what your final gravity is, because this determines the need for repitching with a yeast that is more alcohol-tolerant.

My first barleywine got a packet of Nottingham dry yeast. It went from 1.125 to 1.030. Having never made a barleywine before, I thought that champagne yeast was required after primary was finished. So, I pitched a packet of dry champagne yeast, and nothing ever happened. Turned out, 1.030 was as far as it would get. And you know what? It turned out to be amazing beer, and very ageable. See, the thing with barleywine is, it's supposed to age. And with age, it dries out. So, given that fact, it's not a problem for it to finish sweeter (higher FG) than a normal beer.

So, what was your OG? Compare that to your FG when the time comes. And if the FG is very far above 1.035, I'd try some champagne yeast (because it tolerates higher alcohol levels). But if it's 1.035 or lower, just age it in secondary for a few months, then bottle. However, also note that, with that much secondary aging, most of the yeast is likely to drop out of suspension, meaning that you'll need to add some more rehydrated dry yeast (or liquid if you want, but I wouldn't waste it) at bottling time. A few pinches of dry yeast will probably be fine. Just mix it in some sanitized water, then mix that with your cooled priming sugar solution.

Then, do yourself a favor: leave it alone for a long time. As Papa-Z sayeth, a barleywine before its time is like a mountain without a peak.

jburkh said:

david, is there any reason I should pitch a champagne or wine yeast in stead of the 1098 british ale that I've already used?

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Champagne and wine yeasts have a higher alcohol tolerance than the average ale yeast. The original yeast will be fatigued, used up, and potentially overwhelmed by the high alcohol content. I'm pretty sure champagne and/or wine yeasts are often used to finish huge beers like barleywines.

There's also a White Labs super high gravity ale yeast that you could use. I believe it tolerates ABV up to around 20%. There could be a similar Wyeast variety, but I'm not sure.

jburkh said:

As for the yeast I pitched 2 packets of liquid wyeast 1098, fermentaion is vigorous.

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In the future, you might want to just make a starter. Liquid yeasts are spendy; making a starter is a good way to increase pitching rates, and it is cheap and easy to do.

It's really a matter of gravity and ABV. 1098 is relative low attenuation and moderate-high alcohol tolerance. If your starting gravity was over 1.100, 1098 will hit the wall.

I did exactly what you are talking about in a barley wine of mine. I pitched two tubes of east coast ale yeast in the primary, with 5 x 3.3lb cans of extract. After about two weeks in the secondary, I added dry hops, a pound of honey, and a tube of california ale yeast. This yeast tolerates higher alcohol levels. This fermented for 15 more days, at which point I racked to tersiary carboy, for 15 more days. This barley wine is my swan song, absolutely amazing.

I just racked a high gravity Wee Heavy to secondary. It had an OG of 1.100 and an FG of 1.023. I was a bit concerned about the FG, but checking similar recipe's, I see FG's predicted in that range. (It left a massive yeast cake, over half a gallon.) The Wee Heavy is going to have a relatively high amount of unfermentable sugars.
I would imagine the barleywine will be quite similar in that respect.

raceskier said:

I just racked a high gravity Wee Heavy to secondary. It had an OG of 1.100 and an FG of 1.023. I was a bit concerned about the FG, but checking similar recipe's, I see FG's predicted in that range. (It left a massive yeast cake, over half a gallon.) The Wee Heavy is going to have a relatively high amount of unfermentable sugars.
I would imagine the barleywine will be quite similar in that respect.

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Yeah, you would want plenty of residual sugar in a barleywine, because it will dry out with aging...and those residual sugars will really evolve into complex layers on the palate.

Personally I would have used Wyreast 1728, it can handle beers up to about 12-13% IIRC, you may want to pitch some of that in see what it does